Posted on 03/23/2005 1:35:17 PM PST by davidosborne
Link to LIVE Florida Senate DEBATE.. ABOUT TO VOTE
http://199.44.254.202/stations/MBR/UNI/stream1.asx
I had to smile at your post among all the sadness in this thread. It had me singing to myself. Thanks for bringing back some very old but very pleasant memories.
Muleteam1
"Jeb has to wait until the court appeals are exhausted and a hearing held before judge Greer before Terri is taken into custody, otherwise he could be in violation of a court order."
That's true, but let's play this out as the deadliest and hardest form of deadly political hardball.
Suppose Governor Bush acts by ordering in state officials to take custody of Terry and save her life.
He has defied a judicial order, yes.
Suppose he states that he is acting to preserve the life of a citizen, his duty under the Constitution, against a travesty of justice, where there is a conflict between his duties to protect a citizen, and his duty to follow judicial opinions.
And he refuses to back down.
He is governor, and he does have the power to order the cops to do things, and to fire people for disobedience.
So, the buck stops with him.
Then what?
Well, Terri Schiavo is alive, at least for the moment, and starts getting treatment.
Bush has defied a court order.
The court, all the way up to the Florida Supremes, can issue a flurry of orders, but Bush says they're all related to the same issue, and he has made his decision.
At that point, the court is POWERLESS.
You have a direct standoff between the Executive and Judicial branches of the State of Florida, and the Judicial Branch has no independent forces to be able to compel the Governor to act.
So, you have a political case of defiance of a Court.
The only recourse is to the Legislature, and the legislature could either pass a law to compel the governor to act according to the court (but the Legislature would probably deadlock on that), or impeach the governor (and the legislature would deadlock on that too).
Net result: Terri Schiavo is alive, Jeb Bush will have established a principle of Executive override of the Florida Courts in order to save a life in a Right-to-Life case, not been impeached, remain in power, and the defeated pro-death side will scream impotently that the Nazis have taken over Florida.
JEB wins, and Terri lives.
Now remember, JEB's a multimillionaire who has said he's not thinking of the Presidency. So, he does not economically NEED this job, and this is - he has said - his last job. He has nothing to lose, when you get right down to it, other than having a frustrated Judiciary and frustrated pro-death party hate him. They already do.
The only thing Bush has to lose, at worst, is an office he doesn't need.
Morality demands that he save this woman.
Legality, as currently understood, says he can't defy the court.
But the structure of our system says that, actually, he probably CAN defy the court in this case and establish a new principle of executive parity with the co-equal Judiciary when the life or death of a citizen is involved.
It will take testosterone and a willingness to play the hardest of deadly hardball to do this.
He should.
Just announced on TV. Judge Greer has just denied DCF's request to take protective custody of Terri Schiavo. With the exception of the decision of the Supremes, it is now all over. The State of FL now has no legal options.
Yeas - 18 Nays - 21 Not Voting - 1 VA VO MEMBER VA VO MEMBER VA VO MEMBER _ N Alexander _ N Dockery _ Y Peaden _ N Argenziano _ Y Fasano _ Y Posey _ N Aronberg _ Y Garcia _ Y Pruitt _ Y Atwater _ N Geller _ N Rich _ Y Baker _ Y Haridopolos _ N Saunders _ N Bennett _ N Hill _ Y Sebesta _ N Bullard _ N Jones _ N Siplin _ N Campbell _ N King _ N Smith _ N Carlton _ N Klein _ Y Villalobos _ Y Clary _ Y Lawson _ Y Webster _ Y Constantine _ Y Lee _ N Wilson _ Y Crist _ N Lynn _ Y Wise _ EX Dawson _ N Margolis _ Y Diaz de la Portilla _ N Miller Presiding: Lee President: Tom Lee 'VA'=Vote After Roll Call 'VO'=Chamber Vote
NAMES IN BOLD ARE REPUBLICANS WHO VOTED AGAINST TERRI SCHIAVO...
LINKS TO THEIR WEBSITES....
Senator JD Alexander Majority Whip
Senator Michael S. "Mike" Bennett
New at The Empire Journal
http://www.theempirejournal.com/56092_FDLE_agent_implicates_mccab.htm
FDLE Agent Implicates McCabe in Halting Schiavo Probe;
New Evidence, Subpoena Could Save Terri
(fyi can only post excerpt from TEJ)
You were no doubt dealing with a CINO or apostate. God is using times like these to separate the sheeps from the goats and the actions of these make it easy for him to discipline or judge those worthy of it. Just pray that they learn and God opens their eyes.
I called and got a live human. They were very nice. Said they are logging calls so call now!
Contact info for DCF
Lucy D. Hadi, Secretary 1317 Winewood Blvd.
Building 1, Room 202
Tallahassee, Florida
32399-0700
Phone: (850) 487-1111
And no conscience, either.
It's a real moment of truth. And it's Easter week. He has to examine his conscience and consult with his God and go.
When Jeb pardons a criminal, he directly violates ALL COURT ORDERS related to the proscribed punishment.
Hope they just go get her.
It has the option of establishing a new principle of Executive parity with the Judiciary - the "Andrew Jackson Option" if you will, by which Jeb Bush acts, saves the life of a citizen based on his own interpretation of his duties, and essentially challenges the Democrats to try to impeach him in the Florida legislature.
Do they have the votes?
No.
Call this the "Illegal Option".
I have already sent an email to the President telling him, I am no longer a Republican if this party can not even save this woman. My son is in the Military risking his life so we can starve helpless handicap people? God help us...
Amazing... NOT! People with no real moral courage or convictions hide behind 'tricky talk', just like Kerry tried to.
Gee, what a surprise. </sarc>
I say the hell with what Greer wants.
How can ONE elected judge overturn the will of Congress, deny valid investigations by DCF, etc?!!
This is insanity.
That I have my friend...
Quick technical point: Hearsay evidence is admissable in certain circumstances such as when the declarant has become incapacitated. I agree that using hearsay evidence to condemn this woman to death is a tragedy.
I submit that this finding of fact is abomination. However, does that justify the executive acting outside the scope of his authority every time he does not like a court decision?
Under what circumstances should the executive take extra constitutional steps? If Mumia Abu Jamal is being led down death row, should Ed Rendell send in the National Guard to prevent his execution?
Jeb has done everything in his power to save this woman's life to no end. He is now carefully considering using extra-constitutional measures to prevent her death. Invoking little understood concepts such as natural law will not be sufficient for him to withstand the backlash.
On a more practical note, to what end is Jeb taking custody of Terri Schiavo? He is personally going to care for her? Will she be in the care of the executive branch of Florida until her death? What if a democrat governor is elected in 2006 and he decides the state has no authority to keep this woman alive?
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