Posted on 03/09/2005 6:07:17 AM PST by Happy2BMe
Beware of Back-Door Gun Registration Scheme, Group Says By Susan Jones CNSNews.com Morning Editor March 9, 2005
(CNSNews.com) -- Being on a terrorism watch list does not mean you really are a terrorist -- and therefore, your right to buy or own a gun should not be infringed, Second Amendment supporters say.
But FBI Director Robert Mueller, Sen. Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.) and gun control groups disagree.
In testimony before Congress on Tuesday, Mueller said lawmakers "ought to look at what can be done" to prevent people on the government's terrorism watch list from buying guns.
His comments followed the release of a government report showing that more than 40 people included on a terrorism watch list were allowed to buy guns last year.
According to the audit by the Government Accountability Office, 35 people on the government's terrorist watch list legally bought guns in the United States between Feb. 3 and June 20, 2004. Twelve more people on the list were allowed to buy guns between July 1 and Oct. 31 of last year.
But none of those people had been charged with, or convicted of, any crime, said the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms.
By law, convicted felons, illegal aliens and people declared mentally ill are not allowed to buy guns. Being included on a terrorism watch list may invite more scrutiny, but it does not automatically disqualify someone from legally buying a gun.
"How does somebody's name get on one of those lists? How is it removed?" asked CCRKBA Chairman Alan Gottlieb. The government does not discuss details of its terrorism watch list, which reportedly includes some 50,000 names.
But Sen. Frank Lautenberg believes anyone included on the government's terrorism watch list should be treated differently when it comes to gun purchases.
The New Jersey Democrat says he will introduce a bill requiring the National Instant Check System (NICS) to retain records of gun purchases by "watch-listed" people for at least ten years. Current law requires the FBI to destroy gun-purchase applications within 24 hours of approval.
But current law is "aiding and abetting terrorists," Lautenberg was quoted as saying on Tuesday. "Lots of times you can't uncover the data you need in 24 hours."
CCRKBA said Lautenberg is using the GAO report -- which he requested -- in an attempt to advance his gun control agenda.
"In Sen. Lautenberg's warped view, anyone who buys a gun is a suspected terrorist," said CCRKBA Chairman Alan Gottlieb. He believes Lautenberg is looking for a way to "justify a back-door gun registration scheme."
That way, if he ever gets his gun control bills through Congress, "he will know where to go to collect" all the guns, Gottlieb said.
According to CCRKBA, the GAO report shows that the NICS system works, but Sen. Lautenberg is trying to say it doesn't -- "so he can demand that we keep records on people who may have broken no laws."
CCRKBA said the American Civil Liberties Union would be in "hysterics" if Lautenberg's proposal to keep records on law-abiding Americans involved anything other than gun purchases.
CRKBA Executive Director Joe Waldron said no system is completely fool-proof: "Even if we adopted all of the gun controls Frank Lautenberg has ever advocated, we would only disarm honest citizens, not criminals or potential terrorists, and he knows it."
According to USA Today, the terrorism watch list officially is known as the Violent Gang and Terrorist Organization File, and it includes everyone from actual terrorist suspects to their relatives, neighbors and co-workers.
Credit owed to Aldous Huxley, and Roger Waters...
Thanks for the ping!
Even more to the point, are any of them pilots or have access to terrorist weapons like airplanes and Rider trucks? Shouldn't they be excluded from those activities before asking for their guns?
"...This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow us into the future - Adolph Hitler, 1935..."
The statement attributed to Adolf Hitler is absolutely FALSE and was never made. Firearms enthusiasts must stop spreading this incorrect story. Why this fictional quote is seen over, and over, and over is beyond me.
The people who are really knowledgeable about this vile murderous maniac and his attitudes towards firearms can be visited at Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership for a complete and thorough background.
~ Blue Jays ~
However, the same precedent used in 1938 bears a striking resemblence to the one used in 2005.
It's still gun control that is not in favor of the private citizen and still will not prevent or delay terrorists from obtaining weapons.
Remember when Rush Limbaugh was blamed for the Oklahoma City bombing? Remember when the term "patriot" was used by the left as a slur akin to "potential terrorist"?
This is a far more complicated issue than it may seem. A change in the political wind could put a lot of polifical dissenters of all stripes on the watch list.
bump
Do you trust the government to do this? What is the government changes to a new regime you don't like. What then?
Thanks for the ping!
De Facto registration .......precisely why I don't have a carry permit. I find my grant of authority in the 2nd Amendment.
Well Said!
Exactly. The records are kept, so in effect we already have registration.
Did Hitler ban gun ownership?
....see below.
http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mhitlergun.html
Well, if there's enough information that they are terrorists, they should be in jail, where they won't be buying any guns. If not, and they are citizens, then leave them the FReep alone, in full Passion of their rights. If they are foreigners, deport them, since that takes a whole lot less evidence than convicting someone in a court of law.
Thanks for that info, on the false quote.
How about this one below, by Himmler; do you know if this is a verifiable and true quote?
"Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA - ordinary citizens don't need guns, as their having guns doesn't serve the State." -–Heinrich Himmler
Here is what Hitler really said:
"The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by doing so." (Adolph Hitler)
Thanks for clearing that up FBD. I don't need a link for it - I know they said (and did) it.
If the government was serious about the protection of Americans from terrorism and foreign enemies, they would close the Mexican border.
I believe that quote is legit.
You're not kidding about our porous Mexican border...it's absolutely absurd down there. Who knows who is streaming across on a daily basis. My personal preference is to run two parallel fences along the border 400 meters apart. The ground between the two fences would be filled with landmines.
Large, illuminated, bright, reflective, black-on-yellow, multi-lingual signs could be placed at quarter-mile intervals:
*** ATTENTION / DANGER ***
You are approaching the border of the United States of America. The fenced area contains landmines which will result in death when triggered. For your safety, use authorized border crossing areas only.
We would still welcome properly-documented visitors, but they would need to cross at appropriate areas. Illegal aliens would only need to see two or three of their countrymen blown to smithereens before they got the point that the fenced territory must be honored. At the same time, the fences would prevent hikers, animals, and other innocents from accidentally being killed.
Use of this technique would drastically cut the costs associated with maintaining our southern border. Dangerous night patrols wouldn't be as critical since sensors could simply advise a central station that a fence had been crossed...then it is a matter of replacing the spent landmine. People would be fairly warned, so I think the number of lives saved (compared to casualties from starvation, thirst, bandits, etc.) would be greatly reduced. Just tell me if I'm being totally cold-hearted here.
~ Blue Jays ~
p.s. Sorry for the slight thread hijacking... Those foreign visitors coming to our country through the authorized points of entry should NOT be allowed to bring firearms either...unless they're specifically going on a hunting vacation or entering a shooting competition.
Much stranger things have happened.
(My tagline.)
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