ECONOMIC LOSSES DUE TO SMOKING BANS IN CALIFORNA AND OTHER STATES

United Pro Choice ^ | 3-6-05 | David W. Kuneman and Michael J. McFadden

[CSM]

"I assume you are all for the legalisation of marijuana in public restaurants then. Can't have that pesky government telling the owners what can and cannot be smoked in their own establishment can we."

If it were a legal commodity, then the property owner should have the ability to allow its consumption. But then, your straw man argument lends itself to a lot of "ifs".

[bobdsmith]

"Oh don't be such an ass. Cigarettes are a legal commodity. Always has been."

The illegality of marijuana has been set by the kind of interference of government that you have said you don't agree with. It seems to me that you don't actually mind the government restricting what other people can do as long as they aren't restricting you. I wonder if you would mind if you were in the position where someone was legally smoking a joint near you in a restaurant.

The differences between the overall bad effects of marijuana use and tobacco use are negliable. There is logically no reason to support one and want to ban the other.

Your arguments in support of tobacco have destroyed most of the common arguments against legalising marijuana anyway. For example one common argument against legalising maruijana is that it would cost the taxpayers lots in paying for the medical effects. But you have already destroyed that argument by pointing out that tobacco users pay these costs through their purchases (and it would be no different with marijuana)

[Ditter]

I don't have any connection to this shadowy group you call the anti-smoking lobby. If you say the lobby exists I will have to take your word on it. I thought that public opinion had just turned against the smoker. Smokers had their way for many many years and non smokers said nothing. You smoked any place any time and never asked permission, it was a given. We hated it but said nothing. The tide has turned and you blame some big shadowy group for it. Maybe so, I think it is just numbers and smokers are on the low side.

[bobdsmith]

It's urban warfare

[Just A Nobody]

NO one knows the date of our death except our maker. When it's my time to go, it won't matter one iota if I ever smoked or not.

EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BTW, that goes for seat belts too, but that is another whole thread.

LOVE the cartoon. Sums it up much better than a myriad of words. I must admit I had not heard they upped the ante to 20 years, I thought it was still only 10...maybe I should quit. HAHAHAHAHAHAH
As Dennis Leary said long ago, "People, who cares, those are the DIAPER YEARS!" I agree with Dennis.

[SheLion]

What it means to be a Private Business Owner:

      

  

 

[mdmathis6]

The real proof is to count the number of restaurant/pub CLOSURES AN BANKRUPTSIES before and after the bans take place!

[SheLion]

LOVE the cartoon. Sums it up much better than a myriad of words. I must admit I had not heard they upped the ante to 20 years, I thought it was still only 10...maybe I should quit. HAHAHAHAHAHAH
As Dennis Leary said long ago, "People, who cares, those are the DIAPER YEARS!" I agree with Dennis.

I LOVE Dennis!  I can't wait for Rescue Me to start again.  He is my kind of guy.  LOL! 

[Enterprise]

Well said!

[SheLion]

The illegality of marijuana has been set by the kind of interference of government that you have said you don't agree with. It seems to me that you don't actually mind the government restricting what other people can do as long as they aren't restricting you. I wonder if you would mind if you were in the position where someone was legally smoking a joint near you in a restaurant.

Listen. This is about cigarettes and tobacco products.  Legal.

Pot = not legal.  

Also, pot heads are getting their rights while smoker's are losing ours.  I see no justice. And I would much rather pass a smoker on the highway any day then a pot smoker.  At least my cigarettes don't make me a limp dishrag and/or make me all la la in the head!

Once pot is made legal, we can then discuss it.  For now, I stick with legal commodities.

[SheLion]

The real proof is to count the number of restaurant/pub CLOSURES AN BANKRUPTSIES before and after the bans take place!

They have already done that.  Haven't you read any of the links???

[Just A Nobody]

"Maybe only 25-30% of the people in the state smoke, but you take away 25-30% of the revenue and it's going to hurt."

I must say...since I don't believe the other "statistics" I find it hard to believe this one. By pure observation alone I would say it is also bogus! Few will admit to smoking these days due to the demonization of the act. Meanwhile, you can smoke crack on most street corners or subway bathrooms, but that's ok, they need help.

[SheLion]

I think it is just numbers and smokers are on the low side

You WISH!

And if you DO get your way and there are no more smokers, guess what?  They will be coming after something YOU enjoy.

Pull out your wallet and bend over.  Then we will see how YOU like it. heh!

[CSM]

Look up the American Lung Association's agenda, or RWJF. Most non-smokers and smokers find a way to interact without all the vitroil (sp?) and both of these groups are conent with the choice being left to the private property owner. It is the anti agenda that is for demoloshing the choice of the property owner.

To get back to the point, it is not the fault of the non smoker or the smoker that the businesses are harmed. It is the fault of to much government intrusion. Many "conservatives" applaud this government intrusion. A shocking turn if you ask me.

[SheLion]

I must say...since I don't believe the other "statistics" I find it hard to believe this one. By pure observation alone I would say it is also bogus! Few will admit to smoking these days due to the demonization of the act. Meanwhile, you can smoke crack on most street corners or subway bathrooms, but that's ok, they need help.

Oh yes!  Get this:  Maine has opened THREE METH clinics!  I couldn't believe it.  Our tax dollars going into clinics for the druggies. 

[Lucky Dog]

Do you have the same objections to taxes on beer, wine, liquor, perfume, etc.? If not, then it seems a bit hypocritical to merely object to those on tobacco products. If you object to those taxes on other nonessential products, then why are you only carping about those on tobacco?

[mdmathis6]

The posting spoke only of revenue growths and losses...I didn't see any links regarding the closures and bankruptsies unless some of the posters I haven't read on this thread yet have posted the links you speak of!

[Lucky Dog]

...I am not making you pay jackcrap for medicare for me, nor am I indigent, nor I have I spent all my money on "my habit" or its results...I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR TAKING UP MEDICAL RESEARCH MONEY...

Perhaps you, personally, aren't yet, nor, if you are lucky, ever will... However, a number of your fellow smokers are doing so.

FYI: My cousin died of cancer 3 years ago at 53 years old. Her death bed words to her 24 year old daughter were: I never smoked,... My aunt died at 44 years old of lung cancer. She, nor anyone in her family smoked...

I am sorry for your loss. Unfortunately, I have lost several aunts, uncles and cousins to cancer, all of whom smoked. Your point, which appears to be that smoking is not tied to cancer, is not made statistically because you can cite a few exceptions. I suggest you consult the CDC statistics in this area and you will find a far different picture.

[Just A Nobody]

"The will of the people as expressed through their elected representatives is within the bounds of "liberty" as long as there is no infringement upon the constitutions of either the individual state or the US."

BAAAWWWAAAGGGGHHHH!!!!

YOU CAN NOT POSSIBLY BELIEVE THIS! My will has not once been considered regarding this issue. I have NOT ONE TIME voted for non-smoking anything. Please tell me where that option has been made available and I will be enroute by noon to establish residency.

IT IS JUST ABOUT THE MONEY S I L L Y !!

[Ditter]

Do you ever get of Maine and see how few smokers there are in other areas of the country?