Posted on 02/23/2005 6:05:33 PM PST by quidnunc
The Islamic state that existed 1,400 years ago cannot be recreated, says a Muslim scholar Israr Ahmad.
"The first Islamic state was created in a tribal setup; today the world has changed," said Ahmad. "So we can form a modern Islamic state based on the principles of our religion but cannot recreate what existed 1,400 years ago."
Ahmed, who heads an orthodox Muslim religious party and campaigns tirelessly for establishing an Islamic government in Pakistan, made this observation during a debate on a private Pakistani television channel.
The debate and Ahmed's admission both reflect the major change that the Islamic world is going through since the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks in the United States. The world's response to the attacks has started a new debate among Muslims: Should they accept their religion as interpreted by their clerics, or find their own answers to the problems they confront?
Muslim liberals who for decades allowed clerics to interpret Islam for them are now confronting the clerics. And they are being helped by liberal-minded rulers.
"Don't be silent when you hear something you disagree with. Speak up," says Pakistan's President Pervez Musharraf. In several recent interviews, Musharraf criticized clerics who use Friday sermons to talk politics. "When you hear a cleric discussing politics in his Friday sermon, stop him. Tell him you are here to say your prayers, not to hear politics," Musharraf told ordinary Muslims.
-snip-
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
Gee, ya think?
She's right. Women are going to make the difference.
Exactly... the clerics can point to the Quran and hadeeths to justify abuse.
"My question for non-Muslims is equally basic: Will you succumb to the intimidation of being called 'racists,' or will you finally challenge us Muslims to take responsibility for our role in what ails Islam?"
Even here on FReep, folks often get called "bigots" when they challenge Muslims take responsibility for their roles in what ails Islam. This Muslim knows better.
I'm still waiting for the Reverend Minister of our local Church of England to stand in the pulpit and tell his congregation that muslims are monkeys and pigs and our God wants them all to die.
But what does he do? He speaks about love of fellow man, doing unto others as you would have them do unto you, and all that Christian stuff.
Gee, I feel bad, being such a bigot, I really do!
Most of us have been asking for you to take responsibility for the whack jobs in your "religion" after every incident.
As well, calling someone that is anti-Islam racist is buffoonery. Arabs, Iranians, Pakistanis, Malaysians- these are not the same "race" though many (most) share "TROP."
"We can't do things the same way we did them 1400 years ago!"
And that's such a surprsing, revolutionary thought from a Muslim that it circles the globe!
I'm so happy that I myself feel like firing off my kalashnikov and handing out candies.
Bah!
But patience.
Give 'em another 1400 years and they might master such technology as toilet paper or indoor plumbing.
This is definately progress and indicates the increasingly liberality of Islam. This guy has the courtesy of warning her with threats. In the unenlightened days, he just would have killed her without a warning. Very considerate. At this rate, Islam will enter the 20th century while everyone else enters the 30th, putting them only ten centuries behind the rest of the world, as opposed to the current fourteen. So things are looking up.
If there is any hope for islam, it's going to come from the women. They've got more cajones than the men.
hopefully this will bear fruit---where the average Muslim will seek to change that which needs changing so badly. But will the average joe have the guts to do so? Only time will tell.
Islam must follow some semblance of modernity, else it will be condemned to the dustbin of history, and of relevence.
I am hoping that what we will see is a continuing disagreement between the followers of islam and the clerics who push the wahhabi line. In Australia, some 20 groups of muslims have combined to remove a radical cleric and replace him with a prayer leader of their own choosing. Muslims in Australia hail from numerous countries, many are Iranian. Many would happily assimilate if left alone to live normal lives. The clerics herd them like sheep, they threaten and abuse them.
There have been several instances where the community raised funds to build a mosque or a prayer centre, only to see it taken over by an imported imam from Saudi or Egypt.
It's a difficult concept for us to accept I realize, but muslims are literally afraid of their own clerics. Islam rules by fear. The longer muslims live in the West, hopefully, the less power the clerics will have over them.
Thanks for the informed reply!
What recourse does Canberra have as to the "imports" that teach the nasty stuff---if they have any at all?
SF71
Read my tag.
So I read your tag. What's up? Who are you and what are you trying to say to me?
the pedophile muhammed (may he burn in hell forever between 2 pigs) was smart enough to see that if you wrap a satanic and authoratarian ideology in a mumbo-jumbo, msogynist, authoritarian "religion" he could turn the minds of the slow and dim-witted. By making it part of their everyday life, they could and did expand the base of those who would teach their children that modernity was bad, tolerance was for the "infidels" and that by doing nothing except hating outsiders they would be "better."
Pretty atrractive. Sit on your ass and let allah sort it out.
Of course, after a millenia went by and Allah, the pagan moon god, did nothing, they got a little upset. Rather than blame themselves, it was somehow the fault of those that actually did something.
Of course, the first order of business, after killing innocent Americans, is to get Americans to confuse religion with ideology and allow them to be the half-witted supporters of evil in the name of "religious freedom."
"These aren't the droids you are interested in. Move on."
Heh, heh!
I love the "person of interest" bit.
You said nothing I haven't said myself a thousand times...but it's islam that's facing a huge test in Western countries now and coming up empty of everything but terrorism.
And what are 'droids' if I might ask?
Yo.
I just re-read your posts.
I think we are on the same side here. I got the wrong context.
Sorry for the knee jerk. I have been fighting this battle so many times that I saw something not there.
But I like my post -- just not to you.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.