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To: Blue_Ridge_Mtn_Geek; Dimensio; PatrickHenry; Rippin; jwalsh07; lepton; grey_whiskers; shubi
Yawn. Just add it to the list, which is already very long.

No it isn't, but thanks for the falsehood. The number of actual frauds in the 140+ year history of evolutionary biology is extremely small. If you can list even ten (out of the hundreds of thousands of scientists in the field), I'll be amazed.

Speaking of falsehoods, however, let's look at a small sampling of the times that creationists have lied or misrepresented evolutionary biology or the evidence for it:

Summary of the ability of the two creationists (Hovind and Havoc) to present information they *know* is false, and to *fail* to retract when reminded of their falsehoods, is presented here, along with links to all appropriate documentation.

This sort of behavior, unfortunately, is *typical* of creationists. Here, want dozens of more examples of their distortions? A few more for the road? Another? Still more, perhaps? How about even more? Ooh, here are some good examples. And there's lots more where that came from, like this and this and this and lots more here and *tons* here and countless more here and yet more here, a goodie... Wait, there's more over here, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., *ETC.*, etc., etc., etc., . How about 300 more creationist misrepresentations? Not enough, you say? Well then visit Creationist Lies and Blunders. Hey, what about Freeper metacognative's (he's a creationist) ability to accuse Daniel Dennett (evolutionary scientist) of wanting to put Christians into concentration camps for their beliefs, when Dennett was *actually* clearly writing about how RADICAL ISLAM may need to be contained? The ugly details here. Metacognative *still* shows no shame for his patently false accusation.

(Quick aside -- Blue_Ridge_Mtn_Geek, do you condone this behavior of creationists? Yes or no? Is lying for the "cause" of creationism acceptable to you?)

How many more would you like?

Icons of Evolution: Science or Myth? Why Much of What We Teach About Evolution is Wrong by Jonathan Wells, Jody F. Sjogren

Yawn. Read Icons of Evolution FAQs to learn just how badly creationist Wells misrepresents and outright lies about his subject matter. If, of course, you actually want to *learn* about this topic, instead of just reading creationist falsehoods in order to cling to the dogma that evolutionary biology "must" be a house of cards... Are you intellectually honest enough to do so?

The author retraces the reasoning of proponents of evolution from Darwin to the present to show what he sees as their empirically false, and frequently faked conclusions.

No, actually, Wells just lies about most of it. Which is sadly typical for creationists.

http://www.jamesphogan.com/bb/content/072197-2.shtml EVOLUTION Posted on July 21, 1997

...and the "expert opinion" of a science fiction novelist is worth what, exactly?

The spirit of true science is simply to follow the evidence wherever it leads, not select and twist it to fit any preconceived notions.

Contrary to the misrepresentations by creationists, that *is* exactly how science operates. It's just that the creationists screech like little girls when scientists point out that "following the evidence wherever it leads" is exactly what prompted the development of the field of evolutionary biology. BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE THE EVIDENCE LEADS. So deal with it.

Isaac Newton didn't have any difficulty reconciling his religion with his science.

That's because fundamentalists don't see any conflict between the laws of motion or calculus, and their preferred religious beliefs. And there isn't any. Evolution, on the other hand, is seen by them as a challenge to their dogma, and thus it Must Be Denied (even though many Christians have no problem reconciling their religion and evolutionary biology, and in fact the MAJORITY of Americans who accept evolution *are* Christians, contrary to the creationist canard that evolution is only promulgated by "God-hating atheists".)

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Two books that started me rethinking my ideas on the subject were: Evolution: A Theory In Crisis, by Michael Denton (Adler & Adler, 1986) Darwin On Trial, by Phillip E. Johnson (Regnery Gateway, 1991)

Sigh... Both so severely flawed that I despair of the damage they've done to your knowledge. Yes, I'm serious. Both attack a misrepresented CARTOON VERSION of evolution, not the real thing, and are classic examples of what's known as a fallacious "straw man attack" (like beating up a scarecrow effigy of Arnold Schwarzeneggar instead of the real guy and then declaring "victory").

And I debated evolution with Johnson online back in the early 90's. Not to put too fine a point on it, the guy's an idiot when it comes to evolution. He has an extremely poor understanding of what the field of evolutionary biology *actually* consists of, as well as the evidence it's based on. Instead, he has a very sketchy, mistaken impression of it (probably from reading other creationist twaddle), and his only skill (typical of a lawyer) is being able to *sound* convincing when he tries to give the impression that he actually knows his topic and that the "flaws" he has identified in it are a) valid, and b) honest descriptions of what evolution actually says and the actual state of the evidence. Both are incorrect.

Denton suffers from similar hubris/incompetence.

But don't just take my word for it -- post what you feel is the STRONGEST blow that Johnson and Denton each strike against evolution, and then I'll be glad to show you why and how they're dead wrong (and likely incompetent and/or dishonest to boot).

Or if you want to start learning how badly those gentlemen have misrepresented their source material (all too common among creationists, see my links above), start here:

Review of Michael Denton's Evolution: A Theory in Crisis

The Truth, the Whole Truth, and Nothing but the Truth? Why Phillip Johnson's Darwin on Trial and the "Intelligent Design" movement are neither science—nor Christian

Critiques of Anti-Evolutionist Phillip Johnson's Views

Reviews: "Evolution: A Theory In Crisis" by Michael Denton

DARWIN ON TRIAL: A Review

Reviews: Icons Of Evolution by Jonathan Wells

407 posted on 02/21/2005 6:26:00 PM PST by Ichneumon
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To: Ichneumon

[Thunderous applause!]


408 posted on 02/21/2005 6:34:32 PM PST by PatrickHenry (<-- Click on my name. The List-O-Links for evolution threads is at my freeper homepage.)
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To: Ichneumon

One of those links, "DARWIN ON TRIAL: A Review," will soon find its way into the List-O-Links. It's excellent. (Nothing wrong with the others, but I count on you to haul them out when needed.)


409 posted on 02/21/2005 6:54:12 PM PST by PatrickHenry (<-- Click on my name. The List-O-Links for evolution threads is at my freeper homepage.)
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To: Ichneumon; Dimensio; PatrickHenry; Rippin; jwalsh07; lepton; grey_whiskers; shubi

Darwinist fideist witch hunters strike again.
Must be a pretty desperate bunch.


Science's New Heresy Trial: (Persecution of Scientific Thought)
Discovery Institute News
February 18, 2005
Gene Edward Veith, World Magazine

Science is typically praised as open-ended and free, pursuing the evidence wherever it leads. Scientific conclusions are falsifiable, open to further inquiry, and revised as new data emerge. Science is free of dogma, intolerance, censorship, and persecution.

By these standards, Darwinists have become the dogmatists. Scientists at the Smithsonian Institute, supported by American taxpayers, are punishing one of their own simply for publishing an article about Intelligent Design.

Stephen Meyer, who holds a Ph.D. from Cambridge and is a research fellow at the Discovery Institute, wrote an article titled "The Origin of Biological Information and the Higher Taxonomic Categories." As Mr. Meyer explained it to WORLD, his article deals with the so-called Cambrian explosion, that point in the fossil record in which dozens of distinct animal body forms suddenly spring into existence. Darwinists themselves, he showed through a survey of the literature, admit that they cannot explain this sudden diversity of form in so little time.

Mr. Meyer argued that the need for new proteins, new genetic codes, new cell structures, new organs, and new species requires specific "biological information." And "information invariably arises from conscious rational activity." That flies in the face of the Darwinist assumption that biological origins are random.

Mr. Meyer submitted his paper to the Proceedings of the Biological Society of Washington, a scientific journal affiliated with the Smithsonian Institute's National Museum of Natural History. The editor, Rick Sternberg, a researcher at the museum with two Ph.D.s in biology, forwarded the article to a panel of three peer reviewers. In scientific and other academic scholarship, submitting research to the judgment of other experts in the field ensures that published articles have genuine merit. Each of the reviewers recommended that, with revisions, the article should be published. Mr. Meyer made the revisions and the article was published last August.

Whereupon major academic publications—Science, Nature, Chronicles of Higher Education—expressed outrage. The anger was focused not on the substance of the article, but on the mere fact that a peer-reviewed scientific journal would print such an article.

So the wrath of the Darwinists fell on Mr. Sternberg, the editor. Although he had stepped down from the editorship, his supervisors at the Smithsonian took away his office, made him turn in his keys, and cut him off from access to the collections he needs for his research. He is also being subjected to the sectarian religious discipline of "shunning." His colleagues are refusing to talk to him or even greet him in the hallways.

His supervisors also staged an inquisition about Mr. Sternberg's religious and even political beliefs. Mr. Sternberg, who describes himself as a Catholic with lots of questions, has filed a case alleging discrimination not just on the grounds of religion but "perceived" religion.

Critics of Mr. Sternberg say that the article should not have been published because the American Association for the Advancement of Science has proclaimed that Intelligent Design is "unscientific by definition." As Mr. Meyer points out: "Rather than critique the paper on its scientific merits, they appeal to a doctrinal statement."

Historically, said Mr. Meyer, science has sought "the best explanation, period, wherever the evidence leads." But now the scientific establishment is requiring something else: "the best materialistic explanation for phenomenon." That rules out non-materialistic explanations from the onset, demanding adherence to the worldview that presumes the material realm is all that exists.

David Klinghoffer broke the story of Mr. Sternberg's mistreatment in The Wall Street Journal. The attempts to discredit him, Mr. Meyer said, have resulted in hundreds of scientists from around the world requesting and downloading the paper (available from www.discovery.org/csc/).

Mr. Meyer said that many scientists secretly agree with elements of Intelligent Design but are afraid to go public. Critics tried to force Mr. Sternberg to reveal the names of the peer reviewers—which are supposed to remain anonymous—but he refused. Darwinists shifted the discussions to evolution as a worldview, while avoiding its admitted failures to account for what Darwin purported to explain, namely, the origin of species.

The virulence of the attempts to suppress Intelligent Design demonstrates the Darwinists' insecurity. "You don't resort to authoritarianism," observed Mr. Meyer, "if you can answer it."


703 posted on 02/23/2005 4:12:35 PM PST by Blue_Ridge_Mtn_Geek
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