Posted on 02/13/2005 1:53:33 PM PST by kellynla
At church on Sunday the congregation was asked to pray for the recovery of the Pope. I have abstained from doing so. I hope that he will not recover.
The seizure brought on by his dramatic trip to the hospital a week ago suggests the international sense of his indispensability. Pope John Paul is a graphic figure in the lives of Catholics and many non-Catholics. He is of course a towering theological figure who has presided over the development of Catholic thought and practice for the 26 years of his papacy. He is a major historical figure, who began as a Catholic seminarian in a Poland subservient first to a Nazi overlord (they hanged him in Nuremberg), then to a Communist overlord (nothing happened to him — the Communists are never prosecuted). From that scene he succeeded to the Holy See, where he was the symbol of hope and, after the Communists fell, of triumph, distinctive in his bid for international recognition as a God-fearing man of good will.
I remember him as he was leaving Havana to return to Rome. Fidel Castro was there to recite the diplomatic amenities. The pope was standing on the gangway of his airplane and suddenly rain fell. As John Paul spoke under an improvised parasol, his three-minute farewell address evolved, in near-perfect Spanish, into a homily on water's purifying mission. All of Cuba watched on television, no doubt hoping, for an exhilarating moment, that Castro would melt away, Cuba shriven from the antipodal reign of a tyrant who came to power even before the pope did, and will outlast him.
(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...
No, and more importantly, I think, it is not up to us. We don't just sit back and let life go by, but the wisdom of God is always greater than ours. It is difficult to give up the "this is what I wish" approach, but it is the essence of faith to do so.
Either re-phrase your message or pray to GOD you don't meet somebody like me. Because I will invoke Daniel.
very well put.
God knows far better than we which is best.
And if we believe in the Heavenly Home our Father has prepared for us - then why should we wish that someone who has lived a long and fruitful life - which is now only a shadow of itself - not be released to return Home?
I don't think it's for us to either wish he stay or go - but, as you have said - "God's Will." (I trust in Him)
"Pope John Paul has more work to do.
He can't do any work because he is dying. He is very ill if you haven't noticed."You do not know Jana Pawla II I do know him he is from my country G-D do know time G-D will help him person is person G-D is G-D do you know when G-D talk nothing total nothing talk Today Sister Lucja "pass away"many persons do want my "pope" not life I do not know why Thank you
very astute
I agree and it is sort of a knee jerk reaction to condemn a man who has done so much for all of us. I think Buckley is simply saying that when someone's time comes, it is God's will not ours and to not pray for his recovery is not that terrible. When people I have known who have suffered from incurable illness, some worse than what the Pope has had and some not, I have felt that it was their time to go and did not pray for their recovery, only for an end to their suffering.
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Beautifully said.
He is only old. His body will die, not his spirit. When I die, I want to sit around with him and have tea and talk about things over the biggest pizza imaginable:)
By nature, we all wish to see those that we love, and suffer from terminal conditions, recover from medical emergencies like cardiac arrests, etc. However, we must weigh what we feel is best for ourselves against what we feel is best for them in the light of God's will. This is not a form of fatalism. Rather, it is a realization that life is God's to give and take away.
Buckley had the good sense to retire, the occasional column notwithstanding. He clearly thinks the Pope should have done likewise some time ago. I agree.
JPII has been one of the towering figures of the second half of the 20th century, but it is past time for him to leave the stage. He has become erratic politically, which is particularly sad because this is a man who used to be able to clearly tell the good guys from the bad guys, and had the courage to stand with the former against the latter. I'm not a Catholic and don't follow closely his denominational management, but if his fumbling of the American church's sex abuse scandal is any indication, he's damaging the institution by staying on. Age imposes imperatives of its own. It's sad to see a great man overstay his time.
Okay, I'll ante, and raise you:
Stupid, pompous, buffoon!
God raises people in every age for a purpose. In the last century, He has raised Patton, MacArthur, Reagan, Buckley, Thatcher, and Karol Wojtyla. And don't forget Jim Robinson. All have had shortcomings, but none "outlived their usefullness" nor turned traitor. I respect them all, notwithstanding any occasional lapse, and don't feel a need to discard any of them on the basis of a disagreement.
I think you misunderstood me. When my loved person had a heart attack at the end of a miserable two years, I didn't want her to live through it. I didn't want the suffering to continue. And I did not pray for her recovery.
To pull someone back from death when it is a certainty and when that person is suffering terribly is a grave thing to me. I think a time comes when it is best to "let God's will be done". And I think that is what Buckley said and I agree with him. How one knows when the time to quit pulling people back from the inevitable is very very difficult to know, I know that. I did read that the Pope did not want to go to the hospital. Whether he changed his mind or those around him took him in spite of his wishes, I don't know.
I'll raise you one more. A stupid, pompous, buffoon who helped save the nation. Even buffoons can have a place in our hearts (that's why my wife keeps me).
I won't quarrel with Buckley because he means well, but it would be a poor example not to give the Pope the best medical treatment. It would fall in with the Culture of Death's attitude that "quality of life" is all-important and that you should pull the plug on people when they are past it.
God will determine the time of his death. If God wants to call him home, He will do it. That applies not only to the Pope as a man, but as head of the Church. Sometimes it may be best for the Church to go through a period of rest and consolidation, before getting on with the next piece of business. PJP II has done plenty, and maybe the Church needs a few more years to digest it, or even a few more years for the dissenters in the Church to grow older and weaker.
Only God understands the full meaning of His providential guidance of history. That is especially true of a pope, in whose person so many historical and religious factors converge. It's not a good idea to second-guess God.
Please forgive me, but I didn't understand a word you said.
"Pope John Paul has more work to do. Jesus alone will tell him when his work is finished. Jesus knows better than us."
THANK YOU!
I'm glad someone on this thread knows Catholicism!!!
Buckley sure doesn't!!!
being such a "devout Catholic" and all! LMAO
Ref. post #47....Well said. Thank you.
***I pray that the next leader of the Catholic Church will be as strong in his faith is this one is....***
I agree completely with what you said. Everyone should be praying that the Pope's successor not be one of the liberal cardinals. If the Catholic church should fall, the rest of Christendom is doomed.
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