No I agree. Would you answer my question now? Do you believe some of your allies in the fight to enforce immigration laws are motivated by racism?
The argument that 15 million people will be ripped out of our community is an interesting one. Generally I can't get you folks to agree to that number. In this instance you must have coughed that fur-ball up by accident.
There are 10-15 million illegals in the country now posted 1/28.
I also understand that we have 10-15 million illegals here now. posted 1/4
Whether it is 10 million or 20 million the number is staggering.
Tell me, if this nation can't get along without illegal immigrants to man it's businesses, then how are communities operating throughout the Midwest
I live in the Midwest. Illegals are here also.
Kinda shoots your theory all to hell though.
no.
Once again you are proving yourself incapable of discussing an issue on the merits. Even if we stopped every single illegal immigrant, the legal immigration would continue.
My point which keeps getting lost in your response is that legal immigration is not meeting demand for labor. 15 million illegals is a staggering amount of people and what ever the percentage of working illegals will be a staggering amount.
If we get into a discussion on that topic and you support stiff penalties against murder, am I supposed to mention that you agree with Robert Byrd, former KKK member? You guys have a blind spot that is two miles wide and one mile high.
You sure are making mincemeat out of my arguments...At least that's what you keep telling me. Best I know Byrd's not a murderer, but he is a racist.
You mention that you have too much compassion.
I am sure I didn't write I have "too much compassion."
Where is your compassion for the American kids who get fewer vacations, fewer family amenities, a lower standard of living, just so the children of foreign nationals can get a free ride?
I don't agree with your assessment that illegals are causing all the problem you list. I could argue through the rest of your response point for point but none of my arguments would likely be acceptable to you nor particularly novel. Your arguments are not new to me. They boil down to "I'm right. You're ignorant or evil." but you did formulate them into a compelling right fringe argument that is sure to get rave reviews from those who already agree with you.
Although I found little in your response that challenged my opinion, you did reinforce my perspective of the opponents of immigration. Thank you for taking the time to read my post and respond. It takes skill to communicate through written words alone. Although I disagree with you it is not because your opinions were unclear.
There is absolutely no compassion in the current uncontrolled immigration and the massive flood of people out of Mexico --- it's doing the people of that country no good at all --- their misery only increases.
Real compassion would demand that life improve for them in their own homeland --- so that staying home isn't horrible. That might take some bloodshed unfortunately --- because the evil corrupt oligarchs don't wish release their stranglehold of that wealthy country ---- how else will they fill their Swiss bank accounts so well? But some things --- just like the war in Iraq --- take some bloodshed.
It is illegal for people to cross our borders without going through the proper channels to do so. That is reason enough to oppose it. The devistating impact this flood of humanity is having on our nation, is further reason for adults to oppose the criminality of it. They are here illegaly. They are causing a massive drain of tens of billions of dollars in tax funds. They are over represented in the commissions of crime. Many of them are repeat offenders who prey on children and women. When it gets too hot, they return to Mexico for a spell until they return to commit more crimes.
Frankly I have to tell you, that the idea that people oppose our nations laws because they want to molest children was a preposterous canard of the same type you attempted to use against me. It was only meant to provide an example for you to realize how silly you were being. Issues rise or fall on their own merits. If we wish to discuss the problems of people who molest children, we should address it on it's own merits.
Yes illegals are in the midwest too. They are in paultry numbers compared to their California, New York, Florida and Texas numbers. The United States progressed to the status of premier nation on the planet without tens of millions of illegal aliens spuring the economy. Therefore your claim that we must have them is just bogus on the face of it. Well, you may not think your theory has been shot to hell, but I'm comfortable with the opinion of others who are convinced of it.
Legal immigration is more than meeting demand for labor. What you folks continuously dismiss, is that we have 5% unemployment. That's around ten to twelve million people. There is another group of people that has fallen off your radar. They are the people who are employed with make-work jobs by various programs under HHS. These jobs are not full-time, and they are subsidized by HHS funding, but the citizen is considered employed. These people could be jetesoned from those programs and placed in bonified full-time jobs.
Once again you're back on the topic of Robert Byrd. Since immigration debates stand on their own merits without racism playing a factor, your continual bogus inclusion of him really doesn't accomplish anything other than to prove that you can't discuss this issue without straw dogs.
I don' really care whether you accept my claims about illegals or not. The truth doesn't hinge on your ability to grasp it or believe it. As for my points being good examples of 'right fringe' logic, that would be the assessment of the consumate leftist. The person who thinks our's is a nation of laws would never characterize the advocacy of adhering to them to be 'fringe'. Outing yourself isn't really a win win for you, but hey, it's your choice.
Although I found little in your response that challenged my opinion, you did reinforce my perspective of the opponents of immigration. Thank you for taking the time to read my post and respond. It takes skill to communicate through written words alone. Although I disagree with you it is not because your opinions were unclear.
This is an interesting admission on your part. Although you thought my comments were well expressed and very clear and seemingly easy to understand, they were none the less unimpressive to you. The truth of them escaped you, and of course, you found them to reinforce your thoughts regarding those who oppose illegal immigration.
You have provided a very clear image of who you think opposes illegal immigration. You have equated them to Robert Byrd, and have used a number of buzz words meant to frame them as the consumate racists. I'd defy anyone to point out an example of racism in my posts to you. Absent their ability to provide one, that really frames you by the way you framed this debate.
You are a sad individual who is unable to discuss this issue without race-baiting. The facts stand on their own, yet you refuse to admit they exist. You are dishonest in your approach to the subject, and have sought to spin periferal webs of deciet, into something meaningful.
I spent my time addressing real issues and providing reasons why I assess this situation the way I do. You spent your time calling me a racist and dodging realty. That's a shame.