Posted on 01/28/2005 6:41:49 PM PST by Lorianne
LOS ANGELES - Movies like "Braveheart" and "Legends of the Fall" are on the viewing list for men in a growing Christian movement that calls for them to throw off their "nice guy" personas and emulate warriors.
The book which inspired the movement, John Eldredge's "Wild at Heart," has already sold 1.5 million copies in English and been translated into 16 languages, most recently Korean.
Eldredge believes many Christian men have become bored, "really nice guys" and invites them to rediscover passion by viewing their life's mission as having a battle to fight, an adventure to live and a beauty to rescue.
"The modern era has brought up immense conveniences but at what price. The human heart is desperate for something more than a quicker serving of popcorn," Eldredge said in a recent interview.
Eldredge calls on men to be prepared to take risks and rediscover their dreams but does not provide a specific route to find, for example, an adventure to live. Career, marriage and family become heroic quests rather than chains which bind.
He focuses on how men can become less passive and "engage" those around them, particularly their wives and children.
"The guy who sits in front of the television is unengaged. That man is a bad man. They (children) need engagement whether it is playing on the floor with your 1-year-old or tougher games when they are 15 (years old)," he said.
Eldredge said he has been astounded by the response to his book with momentum gathering steadily since the book was published in 2001 by Christian publisher Thomas Nelson.
Men have been flocking to retreats and forming small groups to study it. Some are organized by Eldredge and his team, but many are just informally arranged by readers of the book. These groups have sprung up as far away Kazakhstan and even among tribes along the Amazon River in South America.
"It has become something of a grass-roots wildfire," Eldredge said.
Jim Chase, an advertising copywriter from La Crescenta, California, has had a replica of the sword actor Mel Gibson used when he played legendary Scottish warrior William Wallace in "Braveheart" hanging above his desk since attending a Wild at Heart retreat with 350 other men last year.
"It is just a reminder that we are in a battle every day. It can be just facing boredom and routine, but it is a battle," Chase said.
"Life isn't just about going to work and sitting in front of a computer and bringing in as much money as you can. We all have a story. God has written a story and we are meant to find out what the story is and live it," Chase said.
He said, for example, that the book inspired him to teach his 15-year-old son to ride a motorcycle.
Eldredge, who is a trained counselor and worked for 13 years for Christian organization Focus on the Family, said we are currently living in a "fatherless age" with many men having abandoned their children if not physically then emotionally.
His own father was an alcoholic who after some good years when Eldredge was young became increasingly distant. Chase had lost his father, who he described as "very cold," just a few months before he attended the retreat.
"A lot of what it brings out is how much you are impacted by your own father. What role model he set for you and how God relates to us as the big father," Chase said.
Eldredge said he used characters such as Mel Gibson's warrior Wallace in "Braveheart" because the characters often embody men who are engaging their passions by fighting noble battles, rescuing women and finding adventure.
CHRISTIAN CRITICS
The movement has stirred controversy, attracting criticism from some Christian leaders who fear he may just be reinforcing stereotypes.
While some women have welcomed suddenly receiving flowers and more attention from their husbands, in the long-term there are concerns about the impact on marriages.
"The basic premise that men need a princess to rescue has set back male female relationship in the church by 30 years. He sanctifies a mythological view of 1950s malehood," said Chapman Clark, associate professor of youth, family, and culture at Fuller Seminary in Pasadena, California.
"It is destructive (to marriages) in the long-term," Clark said, adding that treating women as a figurine rather that the personal image of God will hurt relationships over time.
Clark said Eldredge had tapped into an angst among middle-aged white men who are dissatisfied with their lives and for whom depression had become a very serious problem.
Eldredge acknowledged the movement would be judged based on the impact it has on family life.
"The real test of this ("Wild at Heart") is does it make life better for women? Does it make life better for children? We have received letters from women who are immensely grateful. Marriages have been restored," Eldredge said.
- REUTERS
Up on the mount, God was giving moses 10 promises for him and the Israelites to keep. Meanwhile, the Israelites were down the mountain, breaking most, if not all of them.
"Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to [keep]?" Act 15:10
We don't need any promises to keep. Christ lives in us - let us live in Him and we will be the men we need to be!
I have aquaintances that are new order Amish. While they are not typically voters, they do love to discuss politics.
I can image that some new order amish vote. I can't believe that old order Amish ever do.
I couldn't quite imagine old order Amish voting either, but I didn't know if the others might. My wife's Menonite relatives don't have a problem with it, but then, they drive cars and use other modern conveniences, too. Not quite the same thing.
Bored? Need a battle to fight?
www.kbr.com
Go to "Jobs in Iraq".
There was significant dabate among conservative Presbyterians about 8 years ago as to whether PK was appropriate. Most finally determined that it ignored or glossed over important points and was not something that should be joined. One Presbytery even took action against a session over the issue.
http://www.presbyteriannews.org/volumes/v5/4/pulaski--complaints.html
A list of Reformed concerns about Promise Keepers can be found here:
http://www.prca.org/articles/article_6.html
(raises hand) You know one now.
Do you?
I have 9 yrs. attending events, working at events, attending Conference Meetings & Hosting PK Men's Groups through my Church. I AM a Promise Keeper.
Maybe, just maybe, you should get to KNOW others involved with Promise Keepers. I'm more than positive you will find WE are not a bunch of "Wife Beaters" as YOU seem to think.
Ignorance is a terrible thing to base your opinion on.
Peace-
Thanks for your input, Prince.
yes, each has their own experience.
For me this book was like "Who Moved My Cheese"-much ado about nothing.
Maybe it's message was not for me.
I asked if they were wife beaters. ASKED,
And I never held an opinion of them. I never base my opinions on something I don't know.
I also looked at the website before I made that statement and I didn't see anything about wife beating.
Am I not allowed to ask a question?
and I couldn't find a "promise keeper" where I live if I tried.
Promise Keepers is a "Conference" of Christian believers from THEIR individual denominations/churches, (all with the same goal), YET it is attacked as if it is it's OWN, separate denomination....(we would need a couple of day's and endless cups of coffee to try and iron This out)...
I'll just have to agree to disagree with you on this one, since we seem to be approaching "this" from different angles.
peace-
Sorry,
The Question was "leading" and so I assumed....Please don't mistake my Passion as an attack or judgment.
BTW, now you Know a Promise Keeper !!! :-)
peace
Someone else (not me) labeled them as compromising on doctrine. You, about post 30, asked what doctrine. Although it was not easy coming up with stuff from the pre-internet era, I was just trying to answer your question - there was a legitimate debate at the time. Doctrine is more important to some folks than to others.
I didn't comment on it, because I can't recall the title, but there was also a book that they promoted in that time period that had some questionable material in it.
Most of the stuff I pointed you to was from the 1996-98 time period. As far as I know, the debate has pretty much died down. I know I haven't kept up with Promise Keepers over the last 5 years.
God gave Moses 10 commandments not 10 promises.
Promises are not the same as commandments. Promises are not yokes, they are commitments.
Foolish me for thinking that was obviously apparent.
The 7 promises of a Promise Keeper remind us that we need the power of Christ to live though us to keep them and help us be the men Christ calls us to be.
Is this from the same Presbyterians who divested all church funds from Israeli companies?
One must question their judgement.
Short answer =- NO.
The Presbyterian family tree is a very convoluted graphic, but suffice it to say that virtually all of the conservatives have long sense left the PCUSA (the mainline denomination which advocated divestment from Israel and a boycott of Taco Bell). There are a number of smaller Presbyterian churches which have split from the mainliners over the last 150 years or so, the largest being the OPC (1930s) and the PCA (1970s, but now including groups which split in the 1950s and the 1800s). Many moderates have now split from the mainliners as well, most landing in the EPC (1980s), with some going to the PCA. Some moderates do remain with the mainliners, but they don't control leadership positions. Several of the moderates in the mainline denomination regularly post to these boards.
And just how do you do this? the seven promises are a guideline to fulfilling these two commandments.
As an example, the bible tells us we need to be accountable to each other but the church has lost that accountability in most cases. One of the promises is to build relationships with a few men to regain that accountability.
Perhaps you should've just asked, "When did Promise Keepers stop beating their wives?" (FWIW, I thought you were leading into some kind of Honeymooners joke.)
I went back and looked at the 7 promises; none of them are new or unbiblical. I suppose my real concern is that a big organization with Stadium size regular meetings is required for christian men to be informed and encouraged to do what the bible already instructs them to do. One would think that the Bible, taught by the local church, with inspiration provided by the Holy Spirit should be enough.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.