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The end of democracy in Europe?
TCS ^ | 1/27/2005 | Pavel Kohout

Posted on 01/27/2005 8:16:27 AM PST by isaiah55version11_0

Where Have All the Children Gone?

.... The prophet Mani is dead. But another prophet's teaching is still very much alive. In 2002 the most common first name given to newborn babies was Mohamed. The name Osama finished at a handsome 12th position.

....

Nevertheless, some estimates suggest that one in three births in France occurs in a Muslim family. ...

A Russian-Israeli journalist Shlomo Groman writes: "Go to any child-care store in Vienna. Its clients will be predominantly Arabic, Iranian, Pakistani, Turkish, Japanese, Korean, and Black African. Viennese women never bear children -- they cherish their figures and careers instead. The Western-European pension systems made the bringing up of children less advantageous than social climbing and maximization of income."

Culture seems to play an even more crucial role than taxes or pension systems. ....

The international demographic context will see huge changes: in 2050, Yemen will have more population than, for example, Germany. These people will quite understandably long for the standard of living that currently prevails in Europe. The immigration pressure on Europe will be immense. Given the European liberal laws on family reunification, the exodus from Middle East and North Africa will have enormous dimensions.

Instead of integration of immigrants from the Middle East and North Africa into a majority European society, the opposite will occur: the immigrants will integrate the existing European culture into their own civilization. After some time, it will be their civilization that will become dominant....

If as a result of demographic trends a large part of future Europeans will have dark skin and go to mosque, why not? But if they become a threat to the European tradition of democracy and tolerance, it will be a tragedy.

(Excerpt) Read more at techcentralstation.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial
KEYWORDS: culture; europeanmuslims; islam; populations
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ASV Gen 1:28 And God blessed them: and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
1 posted on 01/27/2005 8:16:27 AM PST by isaiah55version11_0
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To: isaiah55version11_0
My wife was a school teacher in France from 83-1997 after which she moved here to San Francisco to teach. Her classes in the '80s were 80% Muslims from Northern Africa, none spoke a word of french nor had any desire to. For years she worked in this environment. Now she reads that Muslims are taking over France and does not understand how it happened.
2 posted on 01/27/2005 8:21:42 AM PST by SF Republican
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To: isaiah55version11_0

Socialisim has destroyed Europe - A Europe that has withstood floods, barbarian invasions, plaques, and world wars...

Taxes are pivotal

State pensions systems eliminated the natural economic incentive to have children. At the same time, the welfare state is an enormously costly luxury that has to be financed from taxes. High payroll-tax and social security contributions reduce the earning capacity of people in fertile age. Thus, they push down birth rates as well.

A reader of the Wall Street Journal wrote in a letter on the issue:

"I am the son of a Pittsburgh steelworks worker. I was born at the end of the Second World War. I have three sisters. Our mother never went to work. After the experience of the Great Depression, our parents were reluctant to borrow; yet they could afford to own a house, and our father used to buy a new car once every three or four years. My parents paid for my university education and bought me my first car when I was twenty. We were by all standards part of the middle class, and I was proud of my parents' achievement. (…) Today both my parents have to go to work in order to maintain a middle-class living standard, due to the increase in taxation that has occurred in the past half-century. (…) This has produced a generation of children carrying a key around their necks, city gangs, and aggressive brats brought up by after-school child-care centers."

The tax burden in the United Stated has indeed grown significantly over the past 50 years. The birth rate has been falling proportionately, although not to the critical level that is now current in Europe. The birth rate in the US is nearing the replacement level -- about two children per woman. Even so, comparing to Europe, the United States still appears to be a confirmed and stable superpower.

"Even if we include immigration, the population of the original EU-12 will fall by 7.5 million over the next 45 years, according to the UN calculations. Since the times of the 'Black Death' epidemic in the fourteenth century, Europe has never seen such an extensive population decline," writes Niall Ferguson, a British historian. He also predicts that in 2000-2050, the US population will grow by 44 percent. It seems that the European Union will have to forget for good about its ambitious dreams of becoming a "counterbalance" to America.

The demographic trends in Europe are indeed worrying. In Italy, for instance, the birth rate has fallen to an average level of 1.2 children per woman. Why? A journalist from the Daily Telegraph describes the life of young Italians in the following terms:

"It is virtually impossible to make a living. Just take Rome. Life with a minimum of human dignity (a small rented apartment, occasional dinner in a restaurant) requires a monthly pay of 3,000 euros before taxation, which accounts for some 1,800 euros after tax. If in the Anglo-Saxon world a majority of adults is expected to live an independent life on their own salaries, in Italy this is often not the case. An incredible 70 percent of unmarried Italians aged between 25 and 29 live with their parents, where they benefit from subsidized housing and where their poor incomes amount to a handsome pocket money."

When a modern young European has to choose between setting up a family of his own and a comfortable life without children, he is very likely to pick the latter option -- unless he belongs to a social class which regards children chiefly as a source of social benefits. A high amount of taxation combined with ill-functioning labor and housing markets is a truly genocidal mix. That is the case of Italy, but also Bulgaria and the Czech Republic. Its impact cannot be corrected by all sorts of government subsidies paid out to young families. On the contrary, under certain circumstances the benefits for families may even lead to a drop in birth rate.

The traditional model, which exists especially in Spain and Italy, but to a large extent also in East and Central Europe, emphasizes the successive steps in setting up a family. First, a young man graduates from a college or vocational school; then he secures his living, which is followed by marriage; and only then children are born. This succession not only conforms to social conventions but is also based on a profound economic logic: it is simply foolish to start having children before getting a living. The taboo of sex in Western cultures has profound economic reasons.

The troubles start when one link of this chain breaks. In contemporary Europe, the main problem lies in the second link: making a living. Unemployment among young graduates tends to be much higher than the average of the working-age population as a whole. In countries such as France, Spain, Finland, Greece or Italy, 20 to 30 percent of young people are unemployed. What birth rate can we expect, if a fifth or even a third of young population is unable to make a living due to a distorted labor market?

But there is another problem. The payroll-tax and social security contributions are up, while investments in capital equipment are made tax-advantageous. The government support of the existing families comes at the cost of heavier tax burden for young people who have not yet founded a family. The so-called "support for families" thus hinders the creation of new families, and effectively reduces birth rate. If a young unmarried person is left with mere pocket money after his salary has been taxed, he will hardly be able to make sufficient savings to set up a family. The politicians of most European countries are living in a reality gap if they cannot see this trivial economic connection.


3 posted on 01/27/2005 8:23:18 AM PST by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - They want to die for Islam, and we want to kill them.)
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To: isaiah55version11_0
"the immigrants will integrate the existing European culture into their own civilization. After some time, it will be their civilization that will become dominant...."

The author incorrectly uses the word "civilization." Barbarism is more accurate.

4 posted on 01/27/2005 8:24:56 AM PST by Uncle Miltie (Democrat Obstructionists will be Daschled!)
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To: isaiah55version11_0
The international demographic context will see huge changes: in 2050, Yemen will have more population than, for example, Germany.

Interesting, in light of the controversy on this thread over whether Yemen will surpass Russia in population.

Some of these projections are based, I assume, on simply extrapolating today's birthrates into the future. That may be the best estimate available, but it's not very precise. Is there anyone on this thread familiar with demographic projections?

5 posted on 01/27/2005 8:26:46 AM PST by untenured
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To: isaiah55version11_0
In the 1960s there were only about 350,000 North-African Muslims living in France, with some 1.25 million French living in North Africa. Since then, the notion of "colonialism" has completely reversed. There are almost no French living in North Africa,

Anyone French or white were ruthlessly raped, murdered and driven out of Algeria in the 1960's. Ethnic cleansing worked quite well...

6 posted on 01/27/2005 8:27:35 AM PST by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - They want to die for Islam, and we want to kill them.)
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To: isaiah55version11_0

This is a great article! People should read the whole thing.


7 posted on 01/27/2005 8:30:15 AM PST by Gingersnap
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To: 2banana

Yup, yup, looks like the socialists have a BIG problem on their hands. Every ponzi scheme has to end sometime.


8 posted on 01/27/2005 8:31:50 AM PST by Owl558 (Please excuse my poor spelling)
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To: SF Republican

> My wife was a school teacher in France from 83-1997 ...

WOW!!! What's her secret? Teleromase replacement? Nonotechnology? Cloning? Magic serums? Ancient curse?


9 posted on 01/27/2005 8:35:31 AM PST by orionblamblam
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To: TexasCowboy; SheLion; Indie

((( ping )))

The cancer continues to grow.


10 posted on 01/27/2005 8:47:30 AM PST by appalachian_dweller (People are defined by their ACTIONS. Watch what muslims DO, not what they say.)
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To: appalachian_dweller
The cancer continues to grow.

Yes..and eventual "radiation treatment" may be required if we are to survive as a culture and as a nation state.

11 posted on 01/27/2005 9:14:31 AM PST by Indie (Ignorance of the truth is no excuse for stupidity.)
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To: Owl558
Every ponzi scheme has to end sometime.

Not Social Security! Bush has promised to "fix" that Ponzi scheme. He must be really, really smart, huh?

12 posted on 01/27/2005 9:20:57 AM PST by Hank Rearden (Never allow anyone who could only get a government job attempt to tell you how to run your life.)
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To: Indie; appalachian_dweller; SheLion
"Yes..and eventual "radiation treatment" may be required if we are to survive as a culture and as a nation state."

I like the way you think!

13 posted on 01/27/2005 9:40:45 AM PST by TexasCowboy (Texan by birth, citizen of Jesusland by the Grace of God)
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To: isaiah55version11_0
These people will quite understandably long for the standard of living that currently prevails in Europe.

There won't be a "European standard of living" without a European culture. Duh?

14 posted on 01/27/2005 10:26:47 AM PST by Lorianne
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To: isaiah55version11_0

The west has made the decision to kill itself off.


15 posted on 01/27/2005 11:36:41 AM PST by redgolum
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To: Hank Rearden

"Not Social Security!"

Remember what Al told us about the lock box. I heard that they found the thing, but that it was empty except for a 1/2 full bottle of Ted Kennedy's whiskey.


16 posted on 01/27/2005 12:12:07 PM PST by Owl558 (Please excuse my poor spelling)
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To: isaiah55version11_0; Willie Green; Wolfie; ex-snook; Jhoffa_; FITZ; arete; FreedomPoster; ...
Where Have All the Children Gone?

Good find. According to the freemarketeers and the law of comparative advantage Europeans/Americans should not have children. It is cheaper if others have them.

17 posted on 01/27/2005 1:54:52 PM PST by A. Pole (Hash Bimbo: "Low wage is good for you!")
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To: 2banana

I feel no sympathy for the pied noirs. They brought their ruin on themselves by violently refusing to accept anything less than undiluted white supremacy. In the 40's and early 50's Ferhat Abbas used Martin Luther King methods of protest and failed completely in the face of pied noir violence. So the pied noir ended up with Louis Farrakhan, in effect, leading the Algerians. They had only themselves to blame.

But the point is that the "French" Algerians were predominantly Italians and Spaniards.


18 posted on 01/27/2005 2:03:53 PM PST by Sam the Sham
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To: Indie

"Yes..and eventual "radiation treatment" may be required if we are to survive as a culture and as a nation state."


Hence my tagline.


19 posted on 01/27/2005 2:09:06 PM PST by shibumi (Every adult citizen should be permitted concealed carry.....of a tactical nuclear weapon)
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To: isaiah55version11_0; dennisw; SJackson; MeekOneGOP; TrueBeliever9; Geist Krieger; JohnHuang2; ...
WHAT TO NAME YOUR FIRSTBORN IF YOU LIVE IN FRANCE, GERMANY, ENGLAND, SWITZERLAND, BELGIUM . . - ping.

(The USA is about 16 years behind Europe. - Tagline.)

============================================

In 2002 the most common first name given to newborn babies was Mohamed.

The name Osama finished at a handsome 12th position.

f as a result of demographic trends a large part of future Europeans will have dark skin and go to mosque, why not?

But if they become a threat to the European tradition of democracy and tolerance, it will be a tragedy.

20 posted on 01/27/2005 3:04:34 PM PST by Happy2BMe ("Islam fears democracy worse than anything If the imams can't control it - they will kill it.)
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