"Yes, we were wrong. So sorry!"
Exactly, but I think there is more to this story. I don't think it would of gone this far unless there was some other reason that is not being reported. What it is I can only speculate
Posted on 01/22/2005 7:00:10 AM PST by SLB
A family's lawsuit against Casper police officers for using what they say was unnecessary force in a 2003 traffic stop will proceed to trial, according to a decision handed down Friday from Chief U.S. District Judge William Downes.
The fact that Jennifer English and her two children were stopped on June 23, 2003, as they traveled on CY Avenue while officers searched for suspects in an armed robbery, and that she and her son were then handcuffed at gunpoint, is not in dispute, the order denying summary judgment in the suit says.
But, the order continues, the question of whether the officers' decision to use what amounts to deadly force in detaining English and her children was reasonable is an objective matter that must be decided by a jury.
Arguing Thursday morning against the motion that the suit be decided without going to trial, plaintiffs' attorney John Robinson said that people should be protected from the "terrifying and humiliating" experience of having guns pointed at them by police officers in ordinary circumstances.
Whether the circumstances under which the Englishes were subjected to this experience went beyond "ordinary" is the question that will face jurors when and if the suit goes to trial.
On June 23, Jennifer English and her two children, then 14 and 9 years old, were driving east on CY Avenue in a green Ford pickup truck, according to documents.
Having heard been told moments earlier that two teenage suspects in the robbery of a Casper bakery had stolen a green Ford pickup and were fleeing east on CY, Officer Marcus Maton -- one of three Casper Police Department officers named in the suit along with Darren Douglas and Kirk Buchholz -- saw English's truck and got her to pull over.
Unable to confirm that the license plate number on English's truck matched that of the stolen pickup, documents say, Maton, Douglas and Buchholz instructed 14-year-old Dustin English and then Jennifer English to step out of the truck, walk backwards, kneel and submit to being handcuffed. All the while, documents say, the officers kept their guns unholstered, pointing them at the Englishes periodically.
The officers then released Jennifer English and her son from custody approximately six minutes into the traffic stop. After instructing English's 9-year-old daughter to leave the truck, the document says, the officers realized that the pickup was "probably" not the one they were looking for.
The suspects in the armed robbery were identified earlier by a police dispatcher as two teenagers, one tall and bald and the other short with red hair and blue eyes, according to court documents
John Rossetti, the attorney representing the officers, drew on previous court cases in arguing Thursday that it is inappropriate to judge the actions of the officers according to the standards of perfect hindsight. The officers named in the suit, he said, acted appropriately given their training.
Robinson argued, in contrast, that the standard for officers to draw their weapons must take into account the severity of the suspected crime, the likelihood that the suspects could pose a threat to officers or other people, and propensity of the suspects to flee.
Whether or not this standard was met by the officers named in the lawsuit is for a jury to decide, the court order says.
Unusual circumstances to say the least. Innocent family matching about 90% of the description of armed robbers, same color truck, same time, same street. I can imagine she's upset, but based on what the article says, I'd find for the cops.
I'd have to agree, but why are the cops so reluctant to apologize for the misunderstanding.
How long between the robbery and the stop. Was there no availabe information on the number or did someone in the police department have a number that didn't get to the arresting officers? Those would be my first questions.
Actually, cases like this are what settling out of court is for.
"Yes, we were wrong. So sorry!"
This, in this day and age of 'TASER-suits'.
An armed society is a polite society. Please arm yourself.
"Why is this even IN my courtroom?
Case DISMISSED!"
"Yes, we were wrong. So sorry!"
Exactly, but I think there is more to this story. I don't think it would of gone this far unless there was some other reason that is not being reported. What it is I can only speculate
dispatchers communicate to cops on the road......the description had gone out......."earlier"
"The suspects in the armed robbery were identified earlier by a police dispatcher as two teenagers, one tall and bald and the other short with red hair and blue eyes, according to court documents "
In common culture, 'sorry' counts for very little. In this case, 'sorry' would set an unfortunate president and could imply liability.
Here is the bleeding edge between freedom and security. Who wants to give-up a bit of which?
Thank you for providing me my new tagline!
Did the police have the right to stop all green ford pickups at gun point? Guess you had to be there...I've been drawn down on by cops because of their misjudgement..it's no fun....
Maybe the only reason the case has gone this far is a woman is involved....if it had been the father driving, they would have been taken to jail and the truck towed..
Perfect!
You are most welcome. Reading mine, you may imagine that I mean with more than a firearm.
'Misjudgement'? Or judgement? Misjudgement may be established only after the fact.
Why not make the decision, their's and your's, easier and be armed legally? Then you will have some expectation of consistent, anyway, treatment.
An apology would be tantamount to admitting guilt in this particular situation. The plaintiff's attorney would use the apology against them.
They have nothing for which to apologize because they had done nothing wrong. Any reasonable person would have acted in much the same way.
There was no misunderstanding. They were acting prudently.
I hope I have answered all of your concerns.
The outcome will depend a lot on the race of the "victims"
If they're white, then the cops are innocent. Black.......
I think 6 minutes is a reasonable time to sort something like this out. It's not like they were put in jail or injured in any way.
I think they are entitled to reimbursement for the cleaning bill after soiling themselves.
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