Posted on 01/17/2005 3:23:28 PM PST by swilhelm73
Remember how that OLC memo was supposed to have led inexorably to the abuses of the likes of Charles Graner at Abu Ghraib? Well, presumably some evidence of that would have been introduced by his defense at his trail. But this is how the Times reports it today: His lawyers have argued that Specialist Graner, a 36-year-old former prison guard from Pennsylvania, was following orders to "soften up" detainees before interrogations. But on cross-examination, witnesses called by the defense on Wednesday and Thursday almost all ended up reinforcing the prosecution's case that Specialist Graner had abused detainees for sport. There are new damning e-mails according to the Times: In addition to testimony in the case, including three detainees who gave videotaped depositions, the jury of 10 combat veterans will consider about 10 e-mail messages, retrieved from a cache that Specialist Graner sent from his Army account around November 2003.
The court said it would not publicly release that e-mail, given to the jury by the prosecution on Tuesday, but a person close to the defense provided copies to The New York Times. They include new photographs from Abu Ghraib, sent to Specialist Graner's friends and family, including his young children, with chatty messages to explain them.
"The guys give me hell for not getting any pictures while I was fighting this guy," said one message, titled "just another dull night at work," with a photograph attached of a bound and naked detainee howling with pain, his legs bleeding. To an e-mail message about a Take Your Children to Work Day event, he replied, "how about send a bastard to hell day?" attaching a photograph of a detainee's head bloodied beyond recognition.
With a photograph of him stitching a wound on a detainee's eye, he wrote: "Things may have gotten a bit bad when we were asking him a couple of questions. O well." A similar photograph is titled "cool stuff." It was attached to an e-mail reading, "Like I said, sometimes you get to do really cool stuff over here," ending it "xoxoxoxo to all."
Sending the same photograph to another friend, Specialist Graner wrote, "Try doing this at home, and they'll lock you up if you don't have some type of license," adding, "Not only was I the healer, I was the hurter. O well life goes on." Of course, don't look for these e-mails to be splashed all over the news because they reinforce the idea that Graner--not Al Gonzales--was responsible for his acts of abuse.
If I remember correctly, in the initial flush of hysteria over Abu Ghraib Anne Appelbaum and Andrew Sullivan advanced the theory that Graner must have been acting on orders because he didn't look guilty in the photos. I guess they would argue that these e-mails prove even more clearly that Graner was acting on orders since he doesn't demonstrate any guilt whatsoever in them. Of course, what they show is that Graner is a remorseless monster.
There were a few witnesses for Graner's defense. One was named Megan Ambuhl, who was also having sex with Graner (who, of course, fathered a child by Lyndie England). She said interrogators told them to point at male detainees in the shower. The Times continues: Questioned by the prosecution, Ms. Ambuhl acknowledged that she had been sexually involved with Specialist Graner for a month before the investigation began, and did not wish to see him convicted. She acknowledged, too, that military intelligence, or M.I., was not present for the photographs that show hooded and naked detainees forced to masturbate, form a pyramid or simulate oral sex.
"M.I. did not direct this, did they?" the lead prosecutor, Maj. Michael Holley asked. "No, sir," she replied. Sgt. Kenneth Davis also testified in Graner's defense that military intelligence officers were involved in the abuse. That appears to be true, but there is a problem with the idea that they were ordering Graner to do what he did as part of an interrogation strategy. The Times again: But under questioning from the prosecution, Sergeant Davis acknowledged that the military intelligence soldiers ranked below Specialist Graner - he was a corporal at the time - and that the detainees were not interrogated.
The child of Lynndie England and Charles Graner is truly hellspawn.
Should have been a simple reprimand and re-assignment, IMO. No prison time. This whole case is BS.
They needed a White Christian Male scapegoat. And they got one. Does Timmy "I Hate America" McVeigh, "scapegoat", ring any bells? Does "Chief Moose", in The Beltway Snipers 2002, come to mind? He sure tried until the facts called him a liar. Now, he's a left-wing wacko hero.
"Up is down, right is left, in is out, left is right..." - left-wing-liberal-demokkkRAT-socialist-commie-fascist-nazi-filth.
"The more things change, the more they remain the same" - Someone, A While Ago.
Exactly, what came up early on and what the MSM will never publicize is that this whole thing was Master Chuck and Mistress Lyndie's private S&M studio. We could certainly do with a look at the other 1,000 or so photo's that our little playmates took so freely. From what I understand they would prove without a doubt that the detainee abuses were only a small part of their private pervert fest.
The child of Lynndie England and Charles Graner is truly hellspawn.
I don't know Lynndie's family situation but maybe her parents can get the child away from her and save it from growing up to be Freddy Kruger.
I don't know anything but that Graner never grabbed any of them by the hair and slit their throat while they squealed like a pig!
I suppose My problem is that I tend to be civil, but never too civilized.
Only way I see to stop these barbarians is to make them afraid to mess with Us, or kill them all!
I have,often in My life, had to do things that were inconcievable,at earlier stages, I just never accelerated the response too far ahead of the need. We are "hoist with Our own Petard".
Nice Guys are gonna finish last, in this one, go figure.
BUAIDH NO BAS
I don't know anything but that Graner never grabbed any of them by the hair and slit their throat while they squealed like a pig!
I suppose My problem is that I tend to be civil, but never too civilized.
Only way I see to stop these barbarians is to make them afraid to mess with Us, or kill them all!
I have,often in My life, had to do things that were inconcievable,at earlier stages, I just never accelerated the response too far ahead of the need. We are "hoist with Our own Petard".
Nice Guys are gonna finish last, in this one, go figure.
BUAIDH NO BAS
They needed a White Christian Male scapegoat."
Yep.
Talk about the punishment NOT fitting the crime. NO rape. NO murder. NO torture.
Underwear on the head, and making the terrorists play with themselves -- simple humilation -- some of which (as Rush said) resembles more or less a rite of passage at college frat houses.
But...I suppose as long as the Democrats and French are pacified with our perverting justice, then all's well and good.
There is such a thing as a conscience. There also is such a thing as a Golden Rule. Graner never had any realization of either. I cannot understand why anybody is willing to debauch themselves by becoming as inhumane as his opponent. There should be a certain amount of pride in believing that an individual has better values than those he abuses. I never saw this in the Korean War days, it is a phenomena that has crept into our nation's psychic since then. This whole episode is depravity and stupidity at its worst. Actions such as this give the opposing side an incentive to behave more ruthlessly and inhumane than we.
Nice guys? There isn't anything at all "nice" about Graner.
From all accounts, Graner is a sadistic jerk. When he was a prison guard before he went to Iraq he was known as cruel and hateful.
If you are just comparing him to the Islamic beheaders, then I guess he is the "nice" one.
But he isn't nice.
While Lynndie is in prison, where I'm sure she will be going, I guess her family will have the baby, but her parents didn't do all that great of a job with her.
Granted, sometimes a kid just goes bad, but anytime I have seen her parents interviewed, they didn't seem to get it.
Do you know if that baby is a girl or a boy?
Don't get me wrong, I don't think he deserved 10 years, but he is not a nice guy.
That child is going to have a terrible burden to carry through life, unless the media is willing to respect that child's privacy. I am not optimistic about that.
Don't be too gloomy. After all, no one ever seems to ask about Lee Harvey Oswald's daughter.
I suppose that the "nice" thing only works when the enemy follows the rules, too!
OOPS! I just revealed the barbarian part of Me! I try to keep it down, always figured I should keep it, just in case!
I never did live in Mr. Roger's neighborhood, always lived out here in the swamp!
I guess Your reality depends on where and how You spend Your days.
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