Posted on 01/15/2005 2:30:04 PM PST by Prost1
Chaos will flourish in the Middle East if President Bush’s policy continues unchanged
EVEN DONALD RUMSFELD, in his more private moments, must wonder if the invasion of Iraq was really such a good idea. It has become obvious to almost everyone else, including many such as myself who originally supported the war, that it has been a huge mistake. My support was based solely on the evidence of weapons of mass destruction (WMD), on which the intelligence was exaggerated and which Washington has just admitted it is no longer looking for. There is absolutely no evidence that Iraq was supporting al-Qaeda. I believe that the real reason for the war, at least in the US, was to create a reasonably democratic, free-market Iraq to act as both a beacon and a rebuke to other countries in the region. That possibility looks more and more remote. The forthcoming elections look unlikely to produce a government with real authority and legitimacy, or to stop the violence, but they must go ahead; let us hope that they prove a step on the road to normality. Despite the bombing of the UN headquarters in August 2003, the current appalling level of violence did not begin until March 2004, a year after the invasion. It might have been more easily contained if the postwar administration had not made so many early mistakes.
(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...
You have Pat Buchannan on your side, you are in good company eh ?
No, I take you at face value that you are Buchanan/Savage type rightist... but loosen the tinfoil and let your skull breath, you'll be fine. :-)
My point is - if you are NOT a leftist, ignore their arguments, and consider our interests, say from the view of U.S. general. Listen to what they say.
Savage would always blow hot and cold on Iraq. Pull out - then 'blow em all up' - then 'its about oil' etc. .. I dont think he really got it, because he didnt have enough faith in the humanity of the Arabs/Muslims to actually make a decent go of building a better nation to replace Saddam's regime.
That's the bottom line here - many of the right-wing-anti-war types either dont care or dont believe in the possibility of improving government in these countries. But isolationism and pessimism is simply WRONG.
Never mind that the rule-of-law was invented in Iraq ... a mere 4,000 YEARS AGO. Iraq and Iraqis are capable of building democracy and good Government in Iraq, and doing so will go a long way towards WINNING THE GLOBAL WAR ON TERROR, by destroying the twin pillars of tyranny and state-sponsorship of terrorism.
Yes, I know how horrid Islam is as a basis of governance, and the track record in the mideast is bad. But that is why we haven't succeeded yet, the Arab culture is a diseased one, and the bloodletting is the purging that is going on.
We are winning and making progress, and elections are the next step forward for rebuilding Iraq and defeating the terrorists. It will happen.
Those who argue that Saddam Hussein was NOT a threat to the US have wrongly implied that that the administration claimed we were on the verge of being attacked by Iraq.
I dont recall that every being implied, directly or indirectly by the Bush administration.
LOL!
"Who was Zarqawi before we showed up there?"
Zarqawi was a terrorist for over a dozen years, who was jailed (in Jordan I believe) for earlier terrorist activities. He trained others in Afghanistan before coming to Iraq to help set up Ansar al-Islam in 2001/2002.
Zarqawi then and today was trying to become the next Bin Laden.
Capturing or killing him would be a great win for us in the GWOT. Had we not deposed Saddam, he'd be under Iraq's protection, and likely plotting attacks in Europe and maybe even the US.
I have listened to Savage, he is anything but a right winger.He's an old leftist, it comes through if you listen closely on every show.
Not true. Remember the Scud's? Very tough to find, tough to intercept.
LOL! This is the best you have?
You know where the safest place to be in a scud attack? On the target.
Scud? LOL!
Joe, why don't you just post a Hillay 2008 pictures on your profile page and be done with it ? You find any reason you can to bash republicans.
Reading what you say makes me think that saddam was guilty of not painting the picket fence around Iraq and Bush killed hundreds of thousands of innocent people and destroyed the nice peaceful farmland of Iraq.
Typical of the left these days. If you don't see something it doesn't exist and anyone who does is an estremist right winger.
Isn't that what Chamberlain did?
Please see #20
What does this claptrap have to do with what I have posted here?
Well, whether I like the U.N. or not the U.S has a responsibility to further diplomacy amongst the world's nations. The U.S. sees the U.N. as an important body and does what it can to promote peace and humanitarian causes through it. None of the examples listed in post 36 had a direct impact on our national security. It's apples to oranges.
I'm not sure it this was in response to something I posted but I largely agree with what you said. President Bush was acting on principle. In the end the U.N. wouldn't stop Saddam so President Bush led the coalition against Iraq and guess what we discovered. The member nations of the U.N. and some of its officers that were so opposed to this war were the ones working to make sure it happened. There is no doubt the U.N. is corrupt.
He keeps refering to "traditional" ways of conducting foreign policy. 911 was a transformational event...No going back. There are no more safe, effective, "traditional" ways of dealing with a ruthless enemy who ignores tradition and plays by his own brutal rules.
Well you see, that's part of the big problem. The UN is a criminally corrupt, global, communist/socialist organization, filled with American hating members. Seeing them as an important body is utter lunacy.
No dear, TRUE conservatives are smart enough to realize that we are killing the terrorists by the thousands. TRUE conservatives what their children to grow up in a world without terror. TRUE conservatives know that the only way you get a job done is by doing it yourself.
Something that you can now say as a matter of hindsight considering the fact that you would have never been able to say it had we not invaded the place and settled the WMD question once and for all.
Then again, if you're going to wage war on Middle Eastern nations whom sponsor terrorism, why would you NOT take out their biggest army right at the onset?
Or, in your esteemed military opinion, should we have invaded let's say Iran or Syria leaving our backside exposed to Saddam's armies AND not knowing whether he had the ability to launch chemical weapons at our troops?
Stick to whining about Mexicans Joe...you're out of your league here.
Had Bush NOT taken out Saddam, you'd be in here accusing him of exposing our troops in Iran or Syria to the possibility of an attack by Saddam's WMDs.
Your agenda is anti-Bush on every possible topic.
Oh, another one.
These people need never support war again. They may as well go ahead and invest in peace symbols, long hair, and dope.
In effect, they supported the war until it turned out to be a war. Wars are messy, the intel is always bad, and thousands of armchair quarterbacks always know how it should have been run.
Anyone who doesn't know this has no support either worth giving or renouncing.
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