Europe -- Thy Name Is Cowardice

FrontPageMagazine.com ^ | 1/07/05 | Matthias Dopfner

[hershey]

No one is suggesting any of the things you point out. We are saying that nations should stand up and fight for their survival, and so far it looks as if Europe is going down that same old primrose path of sacrificing the guy next door because you hope and pray the tiger will be satisfied with him. But unhappily, this tiger wants more than a noontime snack, and Europe as a whole is mighty tempting. He ate Spain last year.

[hershey]

I've heard more than one democrat on TV insist we were wrong to kick out Saddam Hussein and bring democracy to Iraq because he wasn't any worse than fifty other tyrants scattered worldwide, and besides, what right do we have to save Iraqis from shredders, etc.? So, okay. Where is that moral line in the sand? Following that cockamamie reasoning, we'd have to question helping tsunami victims/countries.

[hershey]

I'm thinking of France's shabby history during WWII, most of which is not brought up in polite company.

[hershey]

As John Kerry has said of other things, 'it's complicated.' Europe is supposed to have one foreign policy, isn't it? Or aren't they at that point yet? The only thing they seem to agree upon is anti-Americanism and what looks like appeasement of Islamofascism. When France, as has been reported for more than a year, puts up with roving Muslim youth gangs raping Gentile/infidel girls, when the town of Malmo, Sweden, is taken over by Muslims and the police are fearful of entering the town, something is very wrong. Americans have plenty to worry about on our own turf, no argument there. But we are discussing worldwide terrorism...Jihad. It's the elephant in the living room,a nd sooner or later, we all have to deal with it.

[jveritas]

Europe is dead.

[Brian Allen]

<< This article is extremely lazy in it's [SIC] analysis.

Firstly to suggest "England" fought Hitler shows a lack of historical knowledge.

England has not existed as a nation-state since 1707, and it is an insult to the rest of the men of the UK who fought and died fighting in WW2. >>

I agree, England is an insult to those men -- particularly to the Celts.

And to the Irish and to the Commonwealth and Empire armed forces upon whom it so often depended and to whom it so often proved so abjectly undependable.

<< Also to suggest that Europe appeased Hitler is strange considering that France and the UK started the fight in 1939. What does that say of the US who took two more years to fight Hitler? >>

To suggest that cravenly cowardly, appeasing [Vichy] France fought anyone anywhere is to demonstrate revisionary delusional fantasy -- and without the very very considerable American blood and treasure and Lend-Lease contribution otherwise virtually unarmed once great britain, with its arse in any case kicked the Hell off the continent at Dunkirk, would have been the toast it in any case very nearly was.

<< I also think more respect should be shown to "Europe" considering European soldiers "are fighting" and "being killed" alongside American troops. >>

Where? In your dreams?

Blessings -- Brian

[Slipperduke]

Brian, seriously dude, calm down. I know you've got a massive problem with the English because we've met before, but to suggest that our troops are only dying in our dreams is a little harsh.

Though there are many of us at this website who have differing views on the war in Iraq, we're all united by our respect and love for those serving in horrific conditions out there.

[hershey]

Arguing over the 'immediacy' of Saddam's threat is pointless since it's beating a dead horse. He'd already used WMD's against his own people and the Kurds, he was developing nukes, etc.. We feared and still do, Islamofascists getting hold of WMD's and using them against us. Obviously, one has to have a strategy, an overall plan on how to deal with danger and forestall the worst. The idea was to wage this war where terrorists lived and trained...Afghanistan. Much wiser than sitting on our hands waiting for Cleveland or Boston to go boom. And while we were eradicating murderous enemies in their lair, we'd show everyone there's another way to live and govern themselves...freedom and democracy. Iraq and Afghanistan democracies are Islamofascim's worst nightmare.

If I were German or French or Spanish or Russian or anything else, I'd take more a second look at why America went into Iraq. And sure, I'd question America's wisdom, motives, etc.. Self interest dictates this. You'd be crazy otherwise, but at some point, we have to decide whether western civilization and individual freedom are worth a candle. America has made her choice.

[hershey]

Just rereading your interesting replies. As an aside, are you in favor of Britain joining Europe? You speak of Europe as a continent, not a country, but I thought that's what the game was over there. Common currency, etc., common foreign policy, ala the United States, and with the ultimate goal of competing economically, etc.. Nothing wrong with that, and considering Europe's long and quarrelsome history, welcome indeed.

[cynicom]

Morning Newbie...You wont be here long...

Your take on history seems to be rather skewed.

[Slipperduke]

Which bit is skewed? That we declared war on Germany in 1939? That France declared war on Germany in 1939?

Just because we took a pasting in '39, doesn't mean we weren't there. And just because we were there for the first two years, doesn't mean that we don't appreciate the sacrifice made by the US in the last four years.

[vincenzzo]

Who are the cowards then? What should be done differently?

Hi. I'm a EU citizen and I will tell you what they mean.
We will be "cowards" as long as we don't shut up and do as they say. We will be "appeasers" as long as we don't fully satisfy their every interest, i.e. appease them. We will be called convictionless unless we abandon our better judgement to assist them in the idle foreign fooleries we warned them against. We will be called the "Soviet" EU until we go stomping around in auxiliary neocolonial boots forcing freedom and happiness onto other peoples. As long as we don't listen to their whining now that they're stuck in the mess they got themselves into against our amicable, but unwanted advice we will be the "whimps".

[tjwmason]

As an aside, are you in favor of Britain joining Europe? You speak of Europe as a continent, not a country, but I thought that's what the game was over there. Common currency, etc., common foreign policy, ala the United States, and with the ultimate goal of competing economically, etc..

By 'Europe' do you mean the European Union? Britain joined the European Community (which became the E.U.) back in the 1970s, we're already members (though I would like to leave).

As to whether the E.U. is intent on becoming a country, a proper answer would take a couple of academic tomes. In many ways the answer is 'it all depends on what you mean by country'; there is no stated intent to move to a unified culture, and indeed the Scottish National Party believe that Scottish independence is best aided by closer European ties (I think that's a tad nuts myself). There is certainly a move towards statehood, with the Union as the principal tier of government though the principle of subsidiarity is officially held. The move to a Common Foreign and Security Policy is currently a dead-duck (thanks to the U.K.), and the chances of the U.K. entering the Euro are minimal.

Nothing wrong with that, and considering Europe's long and quarrelsome history, welcome indeed.

I disagree. The intentional suppression of legitimate national awareness has the potential to create great problems a few years down the line. If the rest of Europe wishes to unite, then that is their decision, but I want no part of it at all.

[misharu]

Hits the nail right square on the head.