Are We Stingy? Yes

NYT ^ | 30 December 2004 | Who Really Cares?

[.cnI redruM]

President Bush finally roused himself yesterday from his vacation in Crawford, Tex., to telephone his sympathy to the leaders of India, Sri Lanka, Thailand and Indonesia, and to speak publicly about the devastation of Sunday's tsunamis in Asia. He also hurried to put as much distance as possible between himself and America's initial measly aid offer of $15 million, and he took issue with an earlier statement by the United Nations' emergency relief coordinator, Jan Egeland, who had called the overall aid efforts by rich Western nations "stingy." "The person who made that statement was very misguided and ill informed," the president said.

We beg to differ. Mr. Egeland was right on target. We hope Secretary of State Colin Powell was privately embarrassed when, two days into a catastrophic disaster that hit 12 of the world's poorer countries and will cost billions of dollars to meliorate, he held a press conference to say that America, the world's richest nation, would contribute $15 million. That's less than half of what Republicans plan to spend on the Bush inaugural festivities.

The American aid figure for the current disaster is now $35 million, and we applaud Mr. Bush's turnaround. But $35 million remains a miserly drop in the bucket, and is in keeping with the pitiful amount of the United States budget that we allocate for nonmilitary foreign aid. According to a poll, most Americans believe the United States spends 24 percent of its budget on aid to poor countries; it actually spends well under a quarter of 1 percent.

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[.cnI redruM]

Egeland has no real connection to suffering at all. He has to be the worst person possible to put in charge of disaster aid.

[NittanyLion]

Tell me NL, is providing taxpayer funded charity either domestic or foreign included in the list of enumerated powers?

It's in...err...penumbras?

Maybe it's interstate commerce?

No?

[.cnI redruM]

The only interstate commerce Jan Egeland should be involved in is hitting the road!

[shubi]

That's true. We should not be using one cent of tax money to help other countries.

[commonguymd]

He might be stating a fact. I do not know if Europe discourages private charities by not allowing a tax exeption. If you remember, and I am unsure exactly when, that there was a cut to the amount of charitable deductions one could take on their taxes here in the US. It was in my opinion a blantant attempt to discourage donations outside of our forced income tax program.

[conserv13]

How much help did we get for the hurricanes in Fla. from them?

The hurricanes were devastating, I know people who lost their homes. That said, this disaster is WAY bigger than the hurricanes in Florida. There is really no comparison.

[kabar]

It depends what is all included in these figures. They don't reflect the costs of our participation in transporting relief supplies and other assistance involving our assets. It also doesn't include private contributions and contributions to such organizations as WHO, IMF, and other UN aid organizations.

[shubi]

Sure there is. We lost a lot more property and had fewer die, because we are a prosperous safe country.

It doesn't take much money to bury the dead.

Most of this hype is a scam to get our money.

[Sthitch]

This like much else the NYT's writes is pointless. The amount of aid they are discussing is simply the financial aid that we are providing. We are sending much more real aid to the area than $35 million. How much have we already spent on the P-3's doing search and rescue work in the area? How much does it cost to relocate a Marine Expeditionary Force to help with the relief efforts? How much does it cost to move a Carrier to the region that will help ferry food, water, clothing and relief workers to those areas hardest hit? How much does it cost to fly the C-141's filled with supplies to the region? How about the military doctors and nurses, plus all of the supplies and equipment being sent? Are we stingy? I guess in the eyes of the NYT's we are, but anyone else would look at our response as quite generous.

[conserv13]

It doesn't take much money to bury the dead. Most of this hype is a scam to get our money.

Wow. I can't believe you just wrote that.

[shubi]

England has a VAT. This means no deductions are necessary.

If the only reason we give to charity is a tax deduction, we are not being charitable. If we had a national sales tax and no deductions, we would still give to charity, probably in larger amounts, since we could keep more of our own money.

I resent our government taking our money to give to other countries against our own interests.

[shubi]

Wow! I can't believe you just wrote that.

[commonguymd]

Proves my premise on the giving nature of human beings. Though the tax deduction was reduced, we continue to give to the world - independently and voluntarily.

[A Ruckus of Dogs]

As a Floridian who was in the middle of the eyes of two hurricanes, I would like to know exactly how much aid we received from the rest of the world.

I do recall that after Gulf War 1, some hurricane hit the Carolinas and the Kuwaitis donated a few million.

That's the only example I can thnk of.

[KwasiOwusu]

"It certainly doesn't include private donations either from the US or anywhere else (Sainsbury foundation in the UK for example) I don't believe I ever claimed it did."

The only difference is that American private charities give vastly more than any other country on the planet by far, plus private charity giving in America makes up a bigger percentage of the total aid given out, than for any other OECD country.
So when the socialist Euro-weenis (where the government controls more of the economy than America) keep quoting just government aid when comparing aid between Europe and America, they are being deliberately disingenuous.

BTW Bill Gates has already given out some $25 Billion to the Gates Foundation so far, with even more to come, and already done more to stop malaria in Africa for example than the entire EU.
How much is the Sainsbusry Foundation worth, and how much have they put into helping the poor, the sick and the dying in Africa for example?)

"Nor did I claim that it included millitary spend and I certainly did not demean in any way the sacrifices made by the US troops (although how that is pertinent to this debate, I'm not sure)."

Its pertinent in the same way Americans scarified hundreds of thousands of lives and trillions of dollars in today's money, to save Europe from an evil German Nazi dictatorship, and restore and in some cases install democratic regimes in most European countries in World War II and then put in even more vast amounts under the Marshal Aid to restore Europeans economies.
All that money and lives lost was aid, given free of charge by America.
Same as the vast aid that America has given and is continuing to give to Afghanistan and Iraq to bring democracy to those countries.
Euro-weeines always choose to define aid in a very narrow way that makes them look far batter than they really are.

"You however seem to be claiming that the CIA is in fact disseminating falsehoods in order to bring down the US.
Perhaps you could tell me which story you want told and Ill try and find the facts to support it"

No less a person that US Senator John Macain has called the CIA a "rogue" organization, just a few weeks ago.
He also called them an agenda driven bunch of folks who deliberately set out to bring down a sitting American president, President Bush.
In fact during the elections, the CIA became so rabid that one of their agents wrote an vicious anti-Bush book anonymously, an agent who has now left the CIA and only recently professed his great admiration for Bin Laden in a TV interview.
http://www.rightnation.us/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t61218.html

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/005/004nbtqq.asp

Note that John Macain is considered so non partisan that, even though a Republican, he was the first choice of John Kerry to be his VP.

[cyncooper]

We beg to differ.

I beg the lying evil slimes to pound sand and sthu.

[commonguymd]

Great information. great post.

[KwasiOwusu]

"That said, this disaster is WAY bigger than the hurricanes in Florida. There is really no comparison."

Question remains, exactly how much aid did Florida get from the Euro-weenies, for example, Norway, with all the vast free money they are getting from their oil, and a very small population to spend that money on?

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the ping!