NJ Governor Dick Codey supports death penalty moratorium during new study, 100% Pro Abortion

Newark Star Ledger ^ | 12.07.04

[Coleus]

Senate measure likely to impose two-year hold on executions as death row inmate loses another appeal As one death row inmate moved closer to lethal injection yesterday, acting Gov. Richard Codey endorsed a moratorium on executions until a proposed study commission determines whether the state's death penalty system is just, fair and worth its cost.

Codey, who is also Senate president, called for the moratorium yesterday as he stalled a Senate vote on a bill that would have created a 13-member death penalty study commission.

Such an action could stop any executions from being carried out for up to two years after the bill is signed."The governor does not think it makes sense to do a study without a moratorium," said Kelley Heck, a spokeswoman for Codey. "So he does support a moratorium right now, and he supports it for 18 months to two years."

New Jersey has not executed anyone in 41 years, and capital punishment is already on hold as the Department of Corrections devises new lethal injection rules. The death row inmate who has exhausted the most capital punishment appeals -- convicted murderer John Martini -- lost another round in court yesterday when the U.S. Supreme Court refused to hear his case.

The bill would create a commission to determine whether the death penalty is consistent with "evolving standards of decency," whether it is discriminatory and whether it is worth its cost, both in money for lawyers and the risk of executing an innocent defendant.

Sen. Shirley Turner (D-Mercer), the sponsor, said Codey took her aside yesterday and told her he wanted to add a ban on executions while the panel studies the death penalty system, and she readily agreed.

[Coleus]

Here is a Catholic politician who WROTE the Clone and Kill Legislation, supports embryonic stem cell research and using tax-payers' money to fund the Stem Cell Institute.  He voted NO against parental notification and the ban on Partial Birth Abortion.  NJ leads the nation in the teenage abortion rate and he's worried about the death penalty where not one person has been executed in 41 years. Paroled cop Killer Thomas Trantino is now walking the streets in Camden alive and well. Codey's sister, Sr. Patricia Codey, SC, Esq. is an activist nun with the Sisters of Charity religious order who operates St. Joseph's Hospital in Paterson where they have at least one nurse employee who works on the side for the Englewood Abortion Mill where 1,500 PBA's are performed each year.  They said the hospital can't control what a nurse does in her spare time!  The Star Ledger articles are usually linked for 14 days, if you want the article you will have to copy it from the link now.

[goldstategop]

New Jersey is the Black Hole of American politics.

[phoenix0468]

Why is it that the people who are anti death penalty are usually pro abortion, and the anti abortion people are usually pro death penalty? This is the biggest oxymoron I have ever seen.

Killing another human being, whether it be before they are born or for retribution for a crime, is murder regardless. We are all human, all have imperfections, and therefore the death penalty is constantly going to murder innocent people because they were falsely accused. Regardless of if it is one or many, it is wrong. So is abortion. It is taking a life, whether you consider it fully human or not, the end result is what matters. Life is life, when our society learns to fully respect it from cradle to grave is when we will truly be an enlightened society.

I am Pro Life. There is only one who had the ability to create it, therefore only that one can have the responsibility for taking it away.

May we all be blessed with this knowledge.

[Coleus]

Hey, if they keep the prisoners in jail for LIFE, then I bet many pro-lifers would be against the death penalty. In NJ we lead the nation with teenage abortions and allow convicted, death-row cop killers out of jail.

But how can one justify the killing of 1.2 million babies per year in the USA vs. 375 adults who lived and had a choice to murder or not? I just can not see the parity. Let's end abortion first then we can work on the other issues.

[ElkGroveDan]

But how can one justify the killing of 1.2 million babies per year in the USA vs. 375 adults who lived and had a choice to murder or not? I just can not see the parity. Let's end abortion first then we can work on the other issues.

Bingo, that's about what I always say verbatim.

[Mr. Silverback]

How about a moratorium on abortion until we determine if it's "just, fair and worth its cost"???

ProLife Ping!

If anyone wants on or off my ProLife Ping List, please notify me here or by freepmail.

[unlearner]

"Why is it that the people who are anti death penalty are usually pro abortion, and the anti abortion people are usually pro death penalty? This is the biggest oxymoron I have ever seen. "

Because many pro-lifers base their views on the Bible. The Bible proscribes the death penalty, specifically for murder. This was given to Noah prior to the Mosaic law.

Contrary to some Bible teaching, there was never a specific repeal of this, although Jesus did rescue an adulteress woman from being executed (unfairly).

I do believe there should be exceptions, but the problem is the exception has become the rule.

Often we (and I mean both sides of these arguments) unconsciously think we are more righteous than God.

It is tragic when the death penalty becomes necessary, but there are worse things, such as repeat offenses and copycats who think there will be no consequences for their actions.

[BroncosFan]

The worst thing about all this is that Codey will get over 50% of NJ Catholics if he were to get the Dem. nod in next year's governor's race. There's no stupider animal than the Northeastern ethnic Catholic, and I speak as one related to many of the breed, that continually votes for the likes of Teddy Kennedy, Mario Cuomo, Gay Jim McGreevey, Frank Lousenberg, Pat Moynihan (despite the fact I always had a soft spot for the old drunk), etc. Just go be Unitarians for God's sake!

[phoenix0468]

unlearner wrote:
"Why is it that the people who are anti death penalty are usually pro abortion, and the anti abortion people are usually pro death penalty? This is the biggest oxymoron I have ever seen. "

Because many pro-lifers base their views on the Bible. The Bible proscribes the death penalty, specifically for murder. This was given to Noah prior to the Mosaic law.

Contrary to some Bible teaching, there was never a specific repeal of this, although Jesus did rescue an adulteress woman from being executed (unfairly).

I do believe there should be exceptions, but the problem is the exception has become the rule.

Often we (and I mean both sides of these arguments) unconsciously think we are more righteous than God.

It is tragic when the death penalty becomes necessary, but there are worse things, such as repeat offenses and copycats who think there will be no consequences for their actions.

........................................................

Besides the rhetoric that you just presented, could you please provide detailed real world evidence that no person who was wrongly accused has been put to death, or that the death penalty has done anything to deter murder as a crime. I don't really want to go there, but there is data that shows that not only is Life without Parole cheaper on the system (due to lack of repetitive appeals), it may also be more of a deterrent.

[fastattacksailor]

What is so odd about someone who is pro-death penalty being against abortion? Consider:

Abortion takes the life of an innocent, the death penalty takes the life of the most evil in society.



Hardly an oxymoron. Though I would agree that it IS the case when the situation is reversed (as espoused by Liberals, killing the innocent and allowing the vermin to live is OK. Go figure....)

[hopespringseternal]

Why is it that the people who are anti death penalty are usually pro abortion, and the anti abortion people are usually pro death penalty? This is the biggest oxymoron I have ever seen.

Guilty. Innocent. These are concepts you should acquaint yourself with.

[phoenix0468]

hopespringseternal wrote:

Guilty. Innocent. These are concepts you should acquaint yourself with.

..........................................................

Life, and respect for it. As taught by Jesus in the Bible. Even the most evil of us are worthy and equally able to be forgiven in his eyes. Also, this is not my main argument against the death penalty. My main argument is that it takes the life of innocent people at times, just as abortion does all the time. Whether it is one life or millions, it is the same crime in my eyes, and according to the Bible in God's as well. But, hey, if you can't get past you desire for revenge (as most in society can't), that's ok, it is your right to have your opinion as it is me to have mine.

[unlearner]

"Besides the rhetoric that you just presented, could you please provide detailed real world evidence that no person who was wrongly accused has been put to death, or that the death penalty has done anything to deter murder as a crime."

No. I cannot. I have no first-hand experience on either side of this issue.

The possibility of wrongly convicting someone for a crime is part of the trial process. I agree that the court system is broken. It must be fixed.

My point is that the death penalty is, in principle, morally just. Of course, if the innocent are executed that would not apply.

The way it should work is that if someone murders in cold blood (premeditated murder for money, for example) they would receive a swift and fair trial. There would not be endless appeals. They would have the opportunity to make their peace with God (a benefit their victim probably did not enjoy). They would be executed in a matter of days not decades.

Parents, schools, churches and media should warn children that murderers always get caught, and they are executed. Do not murder.

Anyone who lies under oath, plants false evidence, or otherwise attempts to subvert justice should face the same penalty as the one being accused would face if found guilty.

The criminal justice system is broken in more ways than just this one issue. We have great disparity in the severity of punishments. Sometimes minor offenses trap young people in a cycle of incarceration. Typically, behind prison walls, more evil inmates run the prisons. Men are subject to many abuses including rape. And often outsiders applaud this as justice or choose to ignore it.

[hopespringseternal]

Life, and respect for it. As taught by Jesus in the Bible.

Oh please. God authored the death penalty.

Also, this is not my main argument against the death penalty. My main argument is that it takes the life of innocent people at times,

Produce one.

Whether it is one life or millions, it is the same crime in my eyes, and according to the Bible in God's as well.

So according to you, killing a baby is morally equivalent to killing a serial killer? And you expect anyone to take you seriously?

But, hey, if you can't get past you desire for revenge

Revenge has nothing to do with it. Revenge is personal. The death penalty isn't.

Of course, self-righteous people are only able to ascribe the worst motivation to those they disagree with.

[sully777]

If you're going to quote Christ, you might want to brush up on what he says in the Pauline epistle of God's enduring love (Amplified Bible) Romans 13: 2-4:

2 "Therefore he who resists and sets himself up against the authorities resists what God has appointed and arranged [in divine order]. And those who resist will bring down judgment upon themselves [receiving the penalty due them]."

3 "For civil authorities are not a terror to [people of] good conduct, but to [those of] bad behavior. Would you have no dread of him who is in authority? Then do what is right and you will receive his approval and commendation."

4 "For he is God's servant for your good. but if you do wrong, [you should dread him and] be afraid, for he does not bear and wear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant to EXECUTE His wrath (punishment, vengeance) on the wrongdoer."

---

If you're going to blow smoke better not take it from the Shekenah Glory.

[phoenix0468]

unlearner wrote:
No. I cannot. I have no first-hand experience on either side of this issue.

>Of course the only experience I have is reading the >statistical data that does not support the death penalty as >a deterant. The most recent data suggests murder is a >declining crime in all states almost equally.

The possibility of wrongly convicting someone for a crime is part of the trial process. I agree that the court system is broken. It must be fixed.

>This is the most unfortunate aspect of a "human" system. >It will never be perfect. Fortunately, our system has a >number of safeguards that make the likelyhood very slim.

My point is that the death penalty is, in principle, morally just. Of course, if the innocent are executed that would not apply.

>And of course my point is to allow even one innocent person >to be executed is immoral and unjust. The Bible says A >Life for A Life, not a Death for a Death. What I mean is, >if someone commits murder, taking someones life, they >should have their "life" taken as well by perpetual >incarceration. Also, every thing this person has in the >form of wealth, or whatever should go to the family of the >victim.

The way it should work is that if someone murders in cold blood (premeditated murder for money, for example) they would receive a swift and fair trial. There would not be endless appeals. They would have the opportunity to make their peace with God (a benefit their victim probably did not enjoy). They would be executed in a matter of days not decades.

Parents, schools, churches and media should warn children that murderers always get caught, and they are executed. Do not murder.

>The truth is, murder is likely the easiest crime to get >away with. In most cases without extracuricular witnesses, >it boils down to proving three main things. One is >physical evidence, motive, and opportunity. Those cases >where the accused have been convicted on circumstantial >evidence stand the best chance of winning the appeals >process. Also, many who murder, have murdered someone they >know in a fit of rage, and therefore don't care whether >they live or die after the fact. The cold blooded murderer >is somewhat rare in the case of this crime, and therefore >it makes more sense to keep these people alive and use them >to discover their motives and reasonings which could be >used to catch or deter future murders.

Anyone who lies under oath, plants false evidence, or otherwise attempts to subvert justice should face the same penalty as the one being accused would face if found guilty.

The criminal justice system is broken in more ways than just this one issue. We have great disparity in the severity of punishments. Sometimes minor offenses trap young people in a cycle of incarceration. Typically, behind prison walls, more evil inmates run the prisons. Men are subject to many abuses including rape. And often outsiders applaud this as justice or choose to ignore it.

>I agree our criminal justice system is not as effective as >it has been and should be, but it is still the best in the >World. We do a darn good job of putting most of the bad >guys behind bars, otherwise we wouldn't have two million >people there. I guess my conclusion is, take a good hard >look at both what the Bible (God) really meant, and also >the fact that the system being flawed makes the death >penalty unjust in some cases. Therefore, until we find a >way to ensure that every person executed is 100% guilty, we >should not use it. I would also like to point this out. I >am not against a person or police officials use of deadly >force against someone who has either commited murder or >threatening it. It is our right as a human to protect each >other from predetors like that. What I am concerned with >is a flawed system using such a completely final form of >punishment.

[phoenix0468]

sully777 wrote:

If you're going to quote Christ, you might want to brush up on what he says in the Pauline epistle of God's enduring love (Amplified Bible) Romans 13: 2-4:

.......................................................

Sully, I never remember quiting Christ in any of my posts. Therefore, why don't you not say I did. My posts have been from my own opinions and beliefs.

[phoenix0468]

hopespringseternal wrote:
Oh please. God authored the death penalty.
>I and others do not agree with you on this. He said a Life >for a Life. You can take someones Life away from them >without killing them. I know this may be hard for you to >comprehend, so I won't elaborate.

So according to you, killing a baby is morally equivalent to killing a serial killer? And you expect anyone to take you seriously?

>Of course I don't expect a person who misrepresents my >words to take them seriously. I said, a system that has >the potential, and has taken the life of an innocent person >is equally immoral. But again, thats my belief and opinion >which I am entitled to.

Revenge has nothing to do with it. Revenge is personal. The death penalty isn't.

Of course, self-righteous people are only able to ascribe the worst motivation to those they disagree with.

>Of course calling me self-righteous because I don't agree >with the death penalty is not as bad as me thinking the >death penalty is a Revenge Punishment. I made no mention >of you in a personal manner and would appreciate the same >respect. Hope you can handle that.

[unlearner]

We have been discussing the Bible as an authoritative source regarding the morality of the death penalty.

Cain was the first murderer. God sentenced him to lifelong exile. (Genesis 4:1-15)

God instituted the death penalty after the deluge. He said, "Whoever sheds man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed." (Genesis 9:6) This ordinance was instituted long before the Mosaic Law. It applies to all nations because we are all descendants of Noah.

Jesus referred to the proscription of the death penalty for anyone who curses their parents. (Mark 7:6-13) He condemned the religious leaders of the day for substituting their own morality in place of God's commandments. He did not repeal the death penalty. I find no such change made in scripture.

Again, on so many issues, I think we tend to want to mold the moral laws of our society and our religion to reflect our own morality. In so doing we act as if we are more righteous than God.