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To: carlr
...if you have accepted salvation through Christ, you are with Him.

Then how is His second coming going to work??

Are the ones 'with Him' going to get placed BACK into their graves, so that they can "rise to meet Him in the air" with those of us believers who are still alive??


1 Thessalonians 4:13-18
 
 13.  Brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who fall asleep, or to grieve like the rest of men, who have no hope.
 14.  We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him.
 15.  According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.
 16.  For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first
 17.  After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.
 18.  Therefore encourage each other with these words.

112 posted on 12/08/2004 5:36:53 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Elsie
It is sometimes hard to compare Scripture because not all has been revealed.It is made clear though in 2 Cor.5:6-8 that being absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

This is the pre/post millennialism debate.For those with a pre viewpoint these verses can be reconciled by interpretation of 1 Thessalonians 4 as the translation of our physical bodies into our spiritual bodies.

The thrust of these verses was reassuring the early Christians who were afraid that brethren who had died would miss out on the second coming.Remember these people believed it would be in their lifetimes.Paul is telling them that those asleep(dead)are indeed secure and we will be translated into our spiritual bodies together at the Rapture.

120 posted on 12/08/2004 6:54:30 AM PST by carlr
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To: Elsie; freedumb2003; carlr; Vicki
The dead are in what may best be described as a state of dreamless sleep. All this is from demons, who want you to believe; ye shall NOT surely die (unconditional immortality)

Is this an "echo" while the soul behind it has passed to heaven? and….That some cling to this world even after death
No, it is demons, seducing you into the idea of unconditional immortality…spiritualism & “familiar spirits” (btw, one of the three “unclean spirits”, “like frogs” Rev.16:13)
Ecclesiastes 10:5 - ….for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, wither thou goest.

the dead go immediately to either Heaven or hell.
Daniel 12:2 - ….and many of them that sleep in the dust shall awake, some to everlasting life….

took a Bible….to bed with me
Then you should maybe look up Ecclesiastes 9:5
….the dead know not anything, the memory of them(that is, the dead one’s memory) is forgotten.

Do see Elsie’s post….#112, please. It confirms this.

Matt. 24: Take heed that no man deceive you….but many will be deceived.

122 posted on 12/08/2004 6:57:26 AM PST by 1john2 3and4
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To: Elsie

Absent with the body, present with the Lord (not festering in the grave as your heretical rotting in teh grave until the Second Coming doctrine would have us believe).


171 posted on 12/08/2004 11:57:45 AM PST by rwfromkansas
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