Posted on 11/23/2004 11:17:04 AM PST by whodeani
Suspect says hunters provoked him
Vang says he was surrounded, called names and shot at before shootings
By JOHN DIEDRICH, LEE BERGQUIST and TOM HELD jdiedrich@journalsentinel.com Posted: Nov. 23, 2004
Hayward - The suspect arrested for shooting eight hunters, killing six of them, says he was surrounded by the group, called derogatory racial names and shot at before he opened fire, according to court records released today.
His account differs sharply from details released Monday by the Sheriff's Department and from the accounts from some of the victims, who describe an essentially unprovoked shooting rampage by Chai Soua Vang, a 36-year-old Hmong man from St. Paul, Minn.
Vang, a truck driver, is suspected in the slayings of six hunters and the wounding of two others, according to a probable cause determination signed by Judge Norman L. Yackel here this morning.
Vang is being held on $2.5 million cash bail.
Officials said the Wisconsin Attorney General's Office will prosecute the case, because of its scope and complexity.
Meanwhile, The two survivors continued to improve, officials said.
Terry Willers, the first hunter shot who was hit in the neck, was upgraded from serious to fair at St. Joseph's Hospital in Marshfield today.
Lauren Hesebeck, 48, was released from the hospital Monday night before 9 p.m. He was shot in the shoulder.
Theresa Hesebeck, also the sister of Denny Drew, who died Monday night, said the family was trying to regroup on Tuesday morning and that her husband was recovering at home.
"Your place is at home at a time like this," she said.
The couple have a blended family that includes seven children.
David Drew, a brother of Denny Drew, said Tuesday he was trying to come to grips with the death of his brother and close friends.
A prayer vigil is set for 7 tonight at the Holy Trinity Catholic Church in Haugen, where three of the victims lived.
Complete coverage of this story will appear online later today and in the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel in the morning.
So did John Muhammad
People don't give away free beer in Wiscconsin. On the other hand, it's for sale everywhere, even at beer joints out in the middle of farm country. It's quite a sight to see a tractor pulled up to one, it's owner inside quaffing a few before doing the back 40.
Those were fired at a deer, no doubt.
I had read where the perp had a back tag. What wasn't clear to me was whether he had obtained an out of state hunting license, (a rather expensive endeavor) or had fraudulently purchased a WI resident license.
" Th at would piss me off to and I would have slaughtered them also."
You are one sick mofo. If the tinfoil speculations you've been spouting weren't ludicrous enough, you the go and certify your psychosis by making the above statement.
You need counseling to bring you back to reality.
I saw one article which said there was only one rifle among the eight people--most of them came out to answer the calls on the radio, and it would seem they were unarmed if that assertion is true. I'm sure we'll hear more in time.
Regarding the "fence", if you don't want people to even accidentally or mistakenly come on your property you put up a fence, except in Louisiana where you are allowed to gun them down.
That's the only place in America where mistaken entry, even by a child, is considered the sort of trespass that justifies killing.
Still, I think it's safe to presume there was no fence. The landowner had an interest in allowing wildgame to come onto his property, albeit game owned by the people of Wisconsin (just like in Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan and Minnesota). We know he had an interest in that because he had a bunch of friends and family out there for a holiday hunt.
"I worked with one of those men and he was a GREAT GUY!"
On the flipside of your experience, obviously this particular 'Hmong' was a psychotic freak.
It is lamentable the victims were unable to drop his ass out of the tree stand like a rabid coon.
He knew the deer stand wasn't his. They don't build deer stands on public property for the public to use, do they?
"Well... I am just taking a hunters word for it that I heard on the radio, now Vang has said as much in this article... I never hunted in MN im new to this state... All my hunting was in Indiana.."
==
Well this story was in northern WISCONSIN. I don't see the connection you are trying to make. Hunting in MN is not the same. The killer was from MN hunting in WI; but that dog still don't hunt, as the saying goes.
I think you are a bit off.
I don't like the smell of it either, but one way or the other this guy's got the chance of a snowball in hell.
I mean it, dude, you need help. I'm talking serious mental issues. The county health department can assist you. Please do it for your own sake.
All right. Civility. Many criminals proclaim their innocence, many paranoid schizophrenics consider themselves perfectly rational. Because his guy can justify himself in his own mind does not justify his actions objectively. Neither does playing the race card or victim card justify his actions.
My comment about beer was in reference to Ron Artest going gangsta on the fan who threw a cup of beer on him. Many talking heads, even freepers are defending Artest by saying if a fan throws a cup of beer on a player he deserves to have his butt whipped.
So I was being sarcastic and saying that might be the reason for Vang going nuts.
The DNR reported he had registered as an "out of state" hunter. He was wearing a Wisconsin tag. The first man shot had read the tag number and written it in the dust on his ATV fender. That was relayed to the police and resulted in Vang being identified well before he was found by two other hunters and escorted out of the woods to a DNR road block.
Regards,
GtG
Some folks here assume that anyone on another's property is trespassing. That's simply not true. Folks can accidently or mistakenly enter on your property. That's not trespass. This is true even if the property is "posted".
On the other hand if there's a fence, the rules change a bit.
Still, in the Midwest, in general, it's OK to go hunting in open fields or forests because, after all, the game resident thereon BELONGS TO THE PEOPLE, not the landowner! Still a good idea to notify the landowner you are around.
BTW, I never tell them where I find the mushrooms though. None of their business!
We still don't know if the land was posted. You assumed it was posted.
You never hunt on private property without permission and most often in writing and if you are not sure you check for signs or postings. If the land is posted no hunting or trespassing and you enter the property you are breaking the law. To use another hunter’s tree stand is the same as sitting in his vehicle, entering his house without permission, or sitting in his camp and drinking beer from his cooler.
Deer often feed at night and move just before dawn and just before sunset. Mid day you are not hunting unless the deer are moving during the rut which is still seldom mid day, so you are relaxing or checking other areas for tracks or sign.
The SKS rifle is a low power 7.62X39 semi auto carbine as apposed to the more powerful 7.62X54 rifle round used in the M44 and other rifles. The 7.62X39 is not a hunting round and is as practical for hunting as a .30 carbine. The ammunition typically comes in 10 and 20 rounds packs as surplus, which is about 90% of the ammo out there. Most states only allow 5 rounds to be carried by a rifle used for hunting, I don't know about Wisconsin. The SKS box magazine unless modified for a clip could hold 10 rounds. To practical and real hunters the least powerful deer hunting round used is the venrable old .30-30 Win which has taken more deer in North America than any other round. Most hunters use more accurate higher velocity rounds unless they are in states that only allow shotguns becasue of laws passed from areas that have had to many rifle hunting accidents. [John Kerry]
We know that 8 people were shot and at least 4 of those reported as multiple times accounting for at least 12 rounds. Vang had no ammo on him when apprehended. It is likely that he started with at least 20 rounds, but we will not know unless LEO indicates how many shell casings were found and where they were located. He could have hit more than one person with the same bullet if the group was close together during the initial shots. He had time to either reload and or approach people close in. He did not hit people in body center mass which is easy to do with a novice shooter even at 100 yards or more. He hit people from the descriptions from the front, from the side, from the back. He removed his scope to use the open sights. Rifle scopes are good for single shot sniping but not for moving targets close in. He removed his scope showing he was preparing and intent on hitting multiple moving targets in the open, which is what the SKS rifle was designed to do. He waited for a second group to arrive and kill off any witnesses of his escape. He left some alive possibly believing they were dead or possibly because he was out of ammunition. He did not take the other hunters weapons and he did not know how many others were in the area. He did not leave the same way he came in if he was lost in the process of trying to flee from a crime scene further indicating guilt.
The only speculation I would offer from known information is that the first group of people were close together when shot and hit in the shoulder, neck, arm, abdomen. Yang probably opened up rapid fire on the group before they could run, disperse, hit the deck, or get a shot off from the rifle holder he may have shot at with the first aimed round. If the hunting party was facing him at 40 yards why would they stand there with a rifle pointing there way? Did he shoot when they had there backs turned? Or before the shooting start did the one with the rifle turn and scope Yang back when he saw Yang with his rifle pointed at their party and Yang squeezed off the first round?
Make no mistake Yang has no defense for his actions regardless of what words were spoken. Yang broke the law and massacred 6 people and wounded two others who were likely unarmed at the time otherwise Yang would be dead. If Wisonsin has no death penelaty he certainly will not live that long in prison if he makes it alive to trial.
There are subtle cultural nuances throughout the Midwest regarding the diplomacy of beertossing.
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