German intelligence “knew plans for Kosovo violence”

CNN/Reuters/B92 ^

[inquest]

What´s against our constitution is not up to you to decide nor up to me - it´s the decision of the independant Constitutional Court

Just out of curiosity, is this court actually granted sole power to decide what your constitution says? That would mean they could amend it at will, right?

[Michael81Dus]

The Justices are bound to the constitution. They cannot amend the constitution, but they´re free to interprete it. The Justices said, that the Constitution allows us to become a member of international bodies, such as NATO. It also states, that we have armed forces. These two messages combined allow us to be part of a military action of the international body we´re a member of (such as the war against Serbia).

[DTA]

Michael,

If you have not heard about something, it does not necessarilly mean it is "typical lie".

That's why FR is great place to learn new things every day.

Use the search engine of your choice and search for "Kommando SpezialKraefte UCK" or "KSK UCK".

Or if you think it is lie, search for KOSOVO LUEGE

If you prefer not to search, here is a sample, an article publushed in The European, September 1998 titled How Germany backed the KLA > It describes the role of BND, MAD and KSK.

In 1998 when KSK trained KLA (UCK in German) KLA was considered to be a terrorist organisation by the State Department.

Perhaps this is an example of Germany not being an agressive country. Hilter also invaded Czechoslovakia under pretext of protecting human rights.

Even more about Germany's aggressive Balkan activities is avalable from German sources if you search for KSK and UCK link.

As ofGermany acquiring nukes, unfortunatelly there are proliferation treaties in force. The only way Germany can get own nukes is to continue working clandestinely with Iran or to buy them on terrorist bazaar.

[Michael81Dus]

Just because you have one article writing down lies, it does not become true. It just makes the story more incredible and ridiculous. German soldiers did not train KLA activists.

[inquest]

They cannot amend the constitution, but they´re free to interprete it.

I'm not trying to get on your case by saying this, but in the final analysis it doesn't seem like there's much of a difference between the two. If they can "interpret" it to mean anything they say it means, then that's not much different from being able to amend it, as far as I can see.

I'm not disagreeing with their interpretation in this matter, by the way; I was just making general comments. Sorry to go off on a tangent.

[Michael81Dus]

The difference between amending and interpreting it, is that amending means you can add anything you want and interpreting limits your possibilities. They cannot do what they want, they need to find at least hints in the text of the constitution. Clever as they are, the Justices found these hints regarding foreign missions of our forces.

[DTA]

>>>>>>Just because you have one article writing down lies, it does not become true. It just makes the story more incredible and ridiculous. German soldiers did not train KLA activists. <<<<<

Yes, one article written by French analyst in English newspaper exposing German terrorist ties may indeed be a lie. But numerous articles written by German writers in German newspapers makes your claim harder to believe.

KSK are shrouded in secrecy. Berlin was annoyed when KSK role in Afganistan was exposed , although KSK were GOOD guys there. One can only imagine how Berlin would react on official admission about KSK role in training and commanding terrorists.

At this point, You are ankle deep in the mud. Here is the rope to get out: Read an article from Frankfurter Algemeine Zeitung , -

Simply say, "Oops, I did not know the facts. It is not "incredible and ridiculous" but disgusting."

Gen. Klaus Neumann, creator of KSK was the man who gave Serbia an ultmatum in October 1998 to stop defending Serbia from terrorists in Kosovo or get bombed. While UCK terrorists trained by KSK were attacking Serbian police and military with German weapons (e.g. Armbrust), "western monitors in Kosovo reported further serious violations of the informal ceasefire between Serb and ethnic-Albanian forces, although they said they did not know which side started it." How convenient.

After the war, when NATO occupied Kosovo Gen. Neumann became the chief of KFOR in Kosovo responsible for overseeing Albanian Kosovo Protection Corps. KPC members were caught in numerous terrorist activities. Coincidence?

If you still refuse to admit the facts, at this point you will sink waist deep into the mud.

Yet, there is a winch to take you out. According to recently published book BEDINGT DIENSTBEREIT" Reiner Kesselring trained Albanian KLA/UCK terrorists in Izmir.

Kesselring Reiner "stellv. Chef des BND 1996-; 1978 Resident des BND in der Türkei; soll 1996 die Ausbildung von UCK-Kämpfern in Izmir geleitet haben"

Reiner Kesselring has grown up in in new, democratic and peaceful Germany. Incidentally, his father Albert is also well known:

Albert "Kesselring, the only one of the early field marshals not to be sacked by Hitler, was taken prisoner on 6th May 1945. Tried as a war criminal he was found guilty on 6th May 1947 and condemned to death. Soon afterwards this sentence was commuted to life in prison and was released for health reasons in October 1952. The following year he published his autobiography, A Soldier to the Last Day (1953). Albert Kesselring died on 16th July 1960."

Albert Kesselring is responsible for terror bombing of Belgrade in 1941:

"Belgrade itself, as Hitler ordered, was razed to the ground. For three successive days and nights Goering's bombers ranged over the little capital at rooftop level - for the city had no antiaircraft guns - killing 17,000 civilians, wounding many more and reducing the place to a mass of smouldering rubble. "Operation Punishment," Hitler called it, and he obviously was satisfied that his commands had been so effectively carried out. (The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, page 1083, 1959 William L. Shirer)

His son Reiner is reponsible for training of Albanian terrorists.

Like father, like son.

If you still insist the fact about Germany training terrorists is "incredible and ridiculous", it is your right. Some people say the same about Dachau.

Only, in that case, you are up to the neck in mud and there is no way out.

Denial is not a river in Egypt.

[Michael81Dus]

Oh, I see. This is the front against the Serbia war. However, I did a search on this subject - and all I found was lots of peacenik-shit (I call it what it is) from the Easter-March-Movement via the extremist Left Antifa-Movement to Serbian groups who support your claim. No credible news source presents your claims as fact. Sorry, unless you bring up serious news, I stay with my "ridiculous and incredible"-position. I rather believe official and mostly independant news sources than lobbyists. Unlike Dachau, this here is not confirmed by serious news agencies. Sorry pal. But I´ll give you the last post!

[AuntB]

Is there even a Serbian Army left? Serbs are only 10% of the population of Kosovo now.

[mark502inf]

Is there even a Serbian Army left?

Yes, in Serbia proper. Minor scandal brewing right now as they are accused of hiding wanted war criminals on military bases.

The Serb Army is torn between wanting to to get rid of their pariah status and get into NATO's Partnership for Peace with loyalty to their generals who are accused of war crimes and their unwillingness to let go of the Greater Serbia ideal. They have reportedly much improved their tactics after the dismal showing in the 1990s. Their short-term conscripts led by poorly trained junior officers were unable to effectively execute the sophisticated small unit operations required to win against popular insurgencies such as the KLA. Instead they relied on firepower overkill and brutality that alienated the populace, increased support for the insurgents, and eventually drew in the international community. Their 2001 Presevo Valley ops were much better, but not sure if that's because the Army is better or just a few select units.

[Banat]

Albania is not Kosovo. Albanians from Albania do, in fact, live in the XXI century and even act like it.

[Banat]

According to a recent survey, 79% of the officer core would rather leave the Forces than be a part of PfP. Any decision involving the Armed Forces will have to be subject to a referendum.

NATO knows who's the sh_t in the Balkans. They want us as allies but are too proud to beg.

[Alex Marko]

dont assume that all albanians are in collaboration with Kosovo....albania proper wants NOTHING to do with them.

[OldFriend]

Do you know that Albania was on the list of terror nations before it became slick willie's new best friend.

[Alex Marko]

Yes i do..under Enver Hoxha's regime. But Albania completely turned around in the mid to late 90's. Now its a strong US supporter. Evidence of htat is Albanian troops in afghanistan and Iraq.

[OldFriend]

Thank you for the information.