Top GOPers in 'Major Effort' to Uncover Kerry's Naval Discharge

News Max ^ | Monday, Oct. 18, 2004 8:58 a.m. EDT | Steve Malzberg

[kyperman]

Top GOPers in 'Major Effort' to Uncover Kerry's Naval Discharge

Top Republicans in Washington are trying to determine whether or not John Kerry received an honorable discharge from the Navy, the reporter who's taken the lead in probing Kerry's naval records said Sunday.

[Congressman Billybob]

He got all his medals "reissued" on the same day -- the day he was sworn in as a Senator, IIRC. Was he merely replacing lost medals? Or was he replacing medals that had been taken away because of a bad conduct discharge? The fact that he has the medals today proves nothing about his original discharge -- which has to have occurred but is NOT in his publicly released record.

Congressman Billybob

Latest column, "Mein Fuhrer, I Can Valk!"

[cookcounty]

" Sorry to sound naive, but since sKerry had all of his "medals", wouldn't that automatically ensure an honorable discharge?"

Nope. He got his medals, then likely received a dishonorable for his post-active-service work to undermine US morale on behalf of the NVA while still in the Naval Reserve. We know that a special board was convened in 1978, in the wake of Carter's general amnesty to determine whether he should have his disharge upgraded. The discharge that he released is from 1978. Unlike Bush, Kerry has refused to sign Form 180, waiving privacy rights. Without a signed 180, there is no standing to sue for documents. That's why various Defense offices have been sued for Bush's recoreds, but there are no suits to flush out Kerry's (in addition to general press laziness when it comes to investigating Democrats).

Bush has been open.

Kerry is keeping secrets.

Why?

[The Loan Arranger]

Not at all. One "Awww, $hit" cancels out all "atta-boy's"
Benedict Arnold was a highly decorated general before he turned traitor.

[SERKIT]

Who's got the stones to go all the way with this? It would require taking Kerry ALL THE WAY DOWN. This isn't just a paper shuffle. The investigation would have to prove all allegations to the point where it would be proven once and for all that Kerry is not/was not eligible to be a congressman or senator (or Presidential candidate) based on his little visit to Paris.

The investigation may uncover that he received some type of dispensation from President Carter, President Clinton, or both that would somehow absolve him from ALL wrongdoing including treason. It may uncover some kind of perverse hearing in front of a Naval officers' review board that somehow lifted a previous "less than honorable" discharge, leading to a reinstatement, and then an honorable discharge.

I am weary of Republicans who make seemingly logical claims of egregious Dem activities and it GOES NO-WHERE!

Remember Sen. Thompson (R-Tenn) who was going to prove that the Clintons got campaign money from a Chinese-Communist Army General? Where did THAT go?

I am not holding my breath.

[teancumspirit]

A general discharge is given under honerable conditions. The other reason you may receive a general is for hardship, or medical, or if for some reason you cannot serve your full inlistment time.

[hyperpoly8]

If Sen. Kerry received a dishonorable discharge, then he lost any security clearance he had. Could he be reissued a security clearance to see classified documents in the Intelligence Committee of the Senate; and can fulfill the duties of a President, exposed to highly classified data, without a top secret security clearance?

[prairiebreeze]

I don't recall that story but you could be right. I was a young thang when Cahtuh was in office.

Prairie

[bitt]

'"I'm kind of sitting here, hanging in the breeze, trying to sort this out - waiting for somebody to talk, some document to pop," he said.'

how did this get here??? It just arrived by messenger...???"

[Seattle Conservative]

I also heard/read several times that someone else gave their medals/ribbons to him and asked him to toss them; so, he didn't use his own, he used someone else's (kinda like he does w $)

[cookcounty]

"A general discharge is given under honerable conditions. The other reason you may receive a general is for hardship, or medical, or if for some reason you cannot serve your full inlistment time."

That's my recollection also. The only time I saw "general" was always "General under honorable conditions." When I was a medic in the Army in 1973, there were a lot of guys kicked out for druga abuse. If they didn't have enough evidence for a conviction under UCMJ, then they gave them a "General Discharge under Honorable Conditions," which I thought was extremely generous.

[Strzelec]

Timing is everything in something like this - and its time is coming soon. [grin] You've already been seeing the fore-shocks. Takes awhile to build up to a crescendo.

My theory: I believe there is documentation out there, and that it will come out before the election. If not from the Republicans, then from the Clintons.

Kerry's explored running for president before, and for some reason always had the rug pulled out from under him early. His service record could be the reason.

Conventional wisdom says that, if Kerry is elected, Hilliary won't become president because she'll be too old in 2012. That assume that Kerry will be reelected to a second term. Big if. Imagine what would happen if the people elected a guy with a BCD. Imagine the effect on the troops in the field. Our allies. One thing I learned when I was in management - your people are the ones that make you look good - or bad. Kerry won't have a friend in the military. Given this, when Al Queda hits us again - and they will, if only to test the new guy - Kerry's vacillating and incompetence will really cause problems.

Kerry will either lose this election - or win but as damaged goods. A win-win for Hildabeast.

[Bellflower]

Where are the Clintons when you need them? Shouldn't they leak these records out? Surely the have connections you would think. Maybe they think Kerry is already toast and they don't need to help him lose this election.

[bitt]

well, maybe you can contact someone who might have been with you at those gatherings? maybe the 2 of you could put it together, like sKerry and the Winter Soldiers "recollecting' those stories...

[teancumspirit]

Your right. If it is a severe discipline problem then it becomes a bad conduct, undesirable or dishonorable. There more than likely would have been a court martial if it would have been a dishonorable, bad conduct maybe but more than likely it was an undesirable, because he was not wanted and this way they could not be accused of retribution.

[Polybius]

Here is my contribution to the issue:

Kerry Deceives News Media About His Navy Discharge on JohnKerry.com

Navy:Undesirable/General Discharges for Civilian Misconduct While on Inactive Duty Reserve Status

[teancumspirit]

You think, have been working on it. I have not seen any of these people for over 20 years. That was a radical bunch, I am glad I did not stay on the east coast.

[Freedom Dignity n Honor]

Yes, not only were his medals and citations reissued in 1985 but there was some kind of council that met about his case in 1978, IIRC, about his discharge.

That's another red flag that he might have had a dishonorable discharge in 1972 due to his alleged treasous activities and then jimmuh carter offered draft dodgers amnesty and I have read where those who had dishonorable dishcharges were allowed reviews of their discharges to have them upgraded.

And something sure happened to his medals and citations to where he had to have them reissued in 1985. If he were dishonorably discharged, he would have had those revoked in 1972.

Or so I've gathered from all the threads on this matter.

[Bellflower]

Could he be reissued a security clearance to see classified documents in the Intelligence Committee of the Senate;

If he lost and then regained a security clearance wouldn't there be a paper trail that could be released without a 180?

[Mike Fieschko]

After Jimmy Carter was elected one of the first thing he did was give amnesty for all draft dodgers and that got extended to a re-consideration of less than honorable discharges for those who perhaps got general discharges for one reason or another.

Discharges could be upgraded before Carter. A frequent situation was were the soldier, etc. got a general or worse because of drug use, straightened his life out, and applied for an upgrade. I helped with some in the early / mid 1970s.

The Discharge Review Boards and Boards for Correction of Military (or Naval) Records handled upgrades. They acted as quasi-courts, taking testimony, reviewing documents, etc.

Only pointing out that this predated Carter. I know that the BCMR/BCNR and DRBs still exist.

[Arizona Carolyn]

I'm thinking they have a lot of info. A friend told me her son went to some sort of function held for John O'Neal last week in Las Vegas. He has SO MUCH more info than we've seen yet. She said he handed copies out to everyone.... probably stuff none of the MSM will touch so far....now if it was Bush it would be all over the news.