Posted on 10/13/2004 12:54:03 AM PDT by politicket
Edited on 10/13/2004 1:07:27 AM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
Excerpt:
Mystery Surrounds Kerry's Navy Discharge
BY THOMAS LIPSCOMB - Special to the Sun
October 13, 2004
URL: http://www.nysun.com/article/3107
An official Navy document on Senator Kerry's campaign Web site listed as Mr. Kerry's "Honorable Discharge from the Reserves" opens a door on a well kept secret about his military service.
The document is a form cover letter in the name of the Carter administration's secretary of the Navy, W. Graham Claytor. It describes Mr. Kerry's discharge as being subsequent to the review of "a board of officers." This in it self is unusual. There is nothing about an ordinary honorable discharge action in the Navy that requires a review by a board of officers.
According to the secretary of the Navy's document, the "authority of reference" this board was using in considering Mr. Kerry's record was "Title 10, U.S. Code Section 1162 and 1163. "This section refers to the grounds for involuntary separation from the service. What was being reviewed, then, was Mr. Kerry's involuntary separation from the service. And it couldn't have been an honorable discharge, or there would have been no point in any review at all. The review was likely held to improve Mr. Kerry's status of discharge from a less than honorable discharge to an honorable discharge.
A Kerry campaign spokesman, David Wade, was asked whether Mr. Kerry had ever been a victim of an attempt to deny him an honorable discharge. There has been no response to that inquiry.
The document is dated February 16, 1978. But Mr. Kerry's military commitment began with his six-year enlistment contract with the Navy on February 18, 1966. His commitment should have terminated in 1972. It is highly unlikely that either the man who at that time was a Vietnam Veterans Against the War leader, John Kerry, requested or the Navy accepted an additional six year reserve commitment. And the Claytor document indicates proceedings to reverse a less than honorable discharge that took place sometime prior to February 1978.
The most routine time for Mr. Kerry's discharge would have been at the end of his six-year obligation, in 1972. But how was it most likely to have come about?
Question I have, speaking as a former Vietnam era Marine honorably discharged ... why does Kerry have two DD214's? Is the second one a new and improved version?
BTTT!!!!!!!
"why does Kerry have two DD214's? "
1. release from enlisted status to accept commission
2. release from active duty
neither of those relates to the character of his service in the reserve following active duty
My comments refer simply to my own post#238, referring to DD214, when I had not seen sKerry's "second 214". This does not change the thrust of this "Sun" article which does not at all rely on the DD214 record.
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When asked "where are your medals?" he would reply, "I threw them away," when in reality they were taken from him as a penalty.
Excellent point.
It would depend on if he was in a drilling reserve or Individual Ready Reserve. I was mustered out to IRR but then chose to drill at a later point (thus my failure to promote :( ). If he chose drilling reserve then he would have been required to gain 50 pts/yr - same as Bush in the TANG. He could gain those 50 through drills, correspondence courses, etc. He also would have had a 2 week active duty requirement per year. Normally in a drilling status the unit to which your assigned has a minimum number of drills that you have to attend even if you can get your points through another means. One note: my reserve time was 20 years after his, but while some details may have changed the major points have been the same for years.
COAST GUARD PERSONNEL MANUAL CHAPTER 1.B.
1.B.7. Security Investigations for Original Appointment of Reserve Officers
Selectees must initiate a National Agency Check and sign the following Statement of Understanding before commissioning.
I understand a National Agency Check will be conducted to determine my qualification for commissioning as a United States Coast Guard officer. I understand my commission may be revoked and I may be separated in accordance with 10 U.S.C. 1162 or 14 U.S.C. 281 if it is determined I am not eligible for a secret security clearance.
"if it is determined I am not eligible for a secret security clearance."
bump
Good find, if as posted on another thread they revoked his security clearance he apparently could have been seperated..
here is 1162:
To: BigKahuna
Here's 10 U.S.C.S. 1162 and 1163.. Both have since been repealed in 1994. Note 1163.
§ 1162. Reserves; discharge
(a) Subject to other provisions of this title [10 USCS §§ 101 et seq.], reserve commissioned officers may be discharged at the pleasure of the President. Other Reserves may be discharged under regulations prescribed by the Secretary concerned.
(b) Under regulations to be prescribed by the Secretary of Defense, a Reserve who becomes a regular or ordained minister of religion is entitled upon his request to a discharge from his reserve enlistment or appointment.
10 USCS § 1163 (1992)
§ 1163. Reserve components: members; limitations on separation
(a) An officer of a reserve component who has at least three years of service as a commissioned officer may not be separated from that component without his consent except under an approved recommendation of a board of officers convened by an authority designated by the Secretary concerned, or by the approved sentence of a court-martial. This subsection does not apply to a separation under subsection (b) of this section or under section 1003 of this title [10 USCS § 1003], to a dismissal under section 1161 (a) of this title [10 USCS § 1161(a)], or to a transfer under section 3352 or 8352 of this title [10 USCS § 3352 or 8352].
(b) The President or the Secretary concerned may drop from the rolls of the armed force concerned any Reserve (1) who has been absent without authority for at least three months, or (2) who is sentenced to confinement in a Federal or State penitentiary or correctional institution after having been found guilty of an offense by a court other than a court-martial or other military court, and whose sentence has become final.
(c) A member of a reserve component who is separated therefrom for cause, except under subsection (b), is entitled to a discharge under honorable conditions unless--
(1) he is discharged under conditions other than honorable under an approved sentence of a court-martial or under the approved findings of a board of officers convened by an authority designated by the Secretary concerned; or
(2) he consents to a discharge under conditions other than honorable with a waiver of proceedings of a court-martial or a board.
(d) Under regulations to be prescribed by the Secretary concerned, which shall be as uniform as practicable, a member of a reserve component who is on active duty (other than for training) and is within two years of becoming eligible for retired pay or retainer pay under a purely military retirement system, may not be involuntarily released from that duty before he becomes eligible for that pay, unless his release is approved by the Secretary.
456 posted on 10/13/2004 2:05:10 AM PDT by GAGOPSWEEPTOVICTORY
That must be why he once said: "I gave back I don't know 6,7,8,9".
Thank you for your reply, I should not have written my comment the way I did with upper case letters. I could have made my point without typing it that way. It made it look confrontational which is what I was not trying to do. I regret writing it that way and if I caused anyone to think I was dengrating anyone's service I am very sorry.
Okay, no big deal!!
To error is human!! :-)
Hey, don't worry about it. Stuff happens. Also, this is a direct reflection on Kerry's character (or lack thereof) rather than on you in any way. If Kerry was not so shady and oily, and we didn't know that he collaborated with the enemy, then you and other Freepers wouldn't have to be doing the media's job and checking up on him!
Freegards!
Gotcha, thank you.
I can't decide if this story isn't going anywhere, or if it's simmerring.
Hear hear!...The Democrat constituency has become the philosophical and moral equivalent of those who believed OJ Simpson innocent.
bump
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