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House About to Strip More Civil Liberties in Name of Anti-terrorism
The NewStandard ^ | 10-7-2004 | Madeleine Baran

Posted on 10/07/2004 1:44:58 PM PDT by MagnusMaximus1

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To: glock rocks

Glock, does your often-used quote mean that we should do away with metal detectors and such at airports?


41 posted on 10/07/2004 2:00:58 PM PDT by Shryke (Never retreat. Never explain. Get it done and let them howl.)
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To: Sthitch
Why don't you go easy on the use of "troll" newbie?

Hillary could designate the NRA a terrorist organization. What then???

42 posted on 10/07/2004 2:00:59 PM PDT by Eaker ("He's the kind of guy who would fight a rattlesnake and give the snake a two-bite head start.")
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To: MagnusMaximus1
Too bad that some Republicans believe in raping the Constitution, too.

The morons who have stretched the Constitution until it means whatever they want it to mean have raped the old girl into hopeless uselessness long before Congress got to her this time.

43 posted on 10/07/2004 2:01:48 PM PDT by Publius6961 (I, also, don't do diplomacy.)
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To: Chemist_Geek

... or IDPA.


44 posted on 10/07/2004 2:02:13 PM PDT by glock rocks ("I couldn't be out of gas. The light didn't come on." ... then she voted.)
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To: rennatdm
Have you ever done a credit check on yourself? Background check? You are living in a dreamworld if you think you have some privacy left. Privacy long went over the hill with plastic.

Try the credit check trick. Better still just put your name, phone number or SSN in google and see what pops up. Or log into your local county real estate tax board and run your property through the hoops. Might surprise you.
45 posted on 10/07/2004 2:02:51 PM PDT by snooker (French Fried Flip Flopper still Flouncing, be careful out there.)
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To: MagnusMaximus1

The Author's BIO tells it all:
Madeleine Baran

Madeleine Baran is a freelance journalist who writes frequently about work and labor issues. Her articles have appeared in The Brooklyn Rail, Dollars & Sense, Clamor, Maximum Rock N Roll and a variety of other progressive publications. Most recently, she has written about the assassination of union activists at Coca-Cola bottling plants in Colombia and the growing campaign to hold Coke responsible. Madeleine is originally from Wisconsin, but is currently finishing her Master's degree in journalism at NYU.


OTHER COLUMNS
Labor Organizers Call Bush’s Threat to Workers ‘Unprecedented’
Owatonna migrant workers to vote on a union
Sears firing of black worker ‘racially motivated’


46 posted on 10/07/2004 2:02:53 PM PDT by Ramonan (Honor does not go out of style.)
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To: mountaineer

"What does that mean? These so-called advocates could represent the most extreme of Marxist or other nutball groups. They even could represent pro-Islamic terror groups. Until I'm satisfied this comes from a legitimate source, I'll take these dire warnings with a grain of salt."

Uh, just as the ACLU is trying to keep Limbaugh's medical records out of court, sometimes two opposing sides can be working against the same thing, for different reasons.

You'll notice that a number of Freepers are opposed to this legislation. Not for the reasons the liberals are, of course, but for other reasons. Read the thread. See if they don't have a point.

Don't simply be for something just because some liberal organization is against it. Pay attention and you may be against it too, but for other reasons. If you own firearms, you should definitely be concerned with this legislation. If you belong to any organizations that have a very narrow point of view of anything, you should be alarmed.


47 posted on 10/07/2004 2:03:05 PM PDT by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: MagnusMaximus1
The House is acting as a rogue group," ... "They're defying the 9/11 Commission."

And here I thought the House of Representatives was beholden to the voters, and not some oddball Commission. I guess represeting your constituency makes them a "rogue group" when they're not falling over themselves to promote Leftist socialist causes.

48 posted on 10/07/2004 2:03:16 PM PDT by Teacher317
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To: MagnusMaximus1; dorben

Right up your alley


49 posted on 10/07/2004 2:03:44 PM PDT by wingnuts'nbolts (keep your eye on the donut not on the hole)
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To: Shryke; glock rocks
Glock, does your often-used quote mean that we should do away with metal detectors and such at airports?

I do.

If citizens as defined by the Constitution and guaranteed by the Bill of Rights were allowed to arm themselves as they see fit then metal detector would not be needed anywhere.

50 posted on 10/07/2004 2:04:51 PM PDT by Eaker ("He's the kind of guy who would fight a rattlesnake and give the snake a two-bite head start.")
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To: Ramonan

"The Author's BIO tells it all:
"

It is a mistake to base your opinion of a piece of legislation based on who is opposed to it. Take a look at this thread. Lots of Freepers are opposed to this legislation as well.

Read the legislation, then decide for yourself.

While the ACLU often represents people who are not compatible with conservatism, they also represent civil liberties in other cases. In this case, they're on your side.


51 posted on 10/07/2004 2:05:50 PM PDT by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: MineralMan
I predict a division among Freepers on this post. Some will offer up their civil rights to "protect America," while others will point out that their civil rights are inviolable.

Oh ye of little imagination...

There is at least one more alternative view of the problem: there are no longer civil liberties to give up. If my government has allowed special groups to threaten and kill me with impunity, I don't need to fear the central government. The results are the same.

Q.E.D.

52 posted on 10/07/2004 2:06:07 PM PDT by Publius6961 (I, also, don't do diplomacy.)
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To: Sthitch
Well, lessee. Potential illegal military training includes

Martial arts training
Firearms training
Reloading
Blacksmithing
Boy Scouts
Most engineering training

All they have to do is decide that they don't like your "group." I wonder if it is retroactive? If I got my firearms training in the Boy Scouts (thirty years ago!), and President Hillary! decides the Boy Scouts are terrorists, does this make me a guilty of "providing material support" for terrorists?
This is pretty silly. Unfortunately, it is about par for congresscritters.
53 posted on 10/07/2004 2:06:36 PM PDT by Little Ray (John Ffing sKerry: Just a gigolo!)
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To: Publius6961

"There is at least one more alternative view of the problem: there are no longer civil liberties to give up. If my government has allowed special groups to threaten and kill me with impunity, I don't need to fear the central government. The results are the same."



I'm not that pessimistic. Sorry.


54 posted on 10/07/2004 2:07:16 PM PDT by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: Shryke
Glock, does your often-used quote mean that we should do away with metal detectors and such at airports?

I'd have to ponder that. I don't fly, so maybe we could discuss seat belt or helmet laws... I do think that a national database and national ID card would be more destructive.

55 posted on 10/07/2004 2:07:47 PM PDT by glock rocks ("I couldn't be out of gas. The light didn't come on." ... then she voted.)
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To: MineralMan
If you belong to any organizations that have a very narrow point of view of anything, you should be alarmed.

Are you kidding? I wouldn't belong to any organization that would have me for a member! (apologies to Groucho Marx). You seem to have misinterpreted my post. I simply suggested there would be no kneejerk reaction from me, especially when I was unfamiliar with the particular biases of the website posting the article. Like anything else, the allegations should be examined thoroughly, not just accepted at face value.

56 posted on 10/07/2004 2:10:53 PM PDT by mountaineer
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To: Little Ray

"All they have to do is decide that they don't like your "group.""

Bingo!

Now, I doubt they'd pick the BSA. I doubt they'd pick the NRA...it's too darned big. But, what about the GOA? What about some of the other RKBA organizations that are a bit smaller and have less political clout?

What about all those other organizations that are a bit on the fringe? Those are the ones that are the most likely to be targeted by an unfriendly administration.

They're all over the place. I can see it now. Why, there are Freepers who hint at civil disturbances here all the time. Maybe FR might be targeted.

There are many reasons to oppose this legislation. The liberals have some, and so do conservatives. It's a bad bill.


57 posted on 10/07/2004 2:11:16 PM PDT by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: Eaker
If citizens as defined by the Constitution and guaranteed by the Bill of Rights were allowed to arm themselves as they see fit then metal detector would not be needed anywhere.

Tell me how you, armed with your pistol on an aircraft, would stop a suicide bomber from detonating his briefase full of explosives?

58 posted on 10/07/2004 2:11:34 PM PDT by Shryke (Never retreat. Never explain. Get it done and let them howl.)
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To: Eaker
If citizens as defined by the Constitution and guaranteed by the Bill of Rights were allowed to arm themselves as they see fit then metal detector would not be needed anywhere.

Yep... and Delta would get some of my money.

59 posted on 10/07/2004 2:12:43 PM PDT by glock rocks ("I couldn't be out of gas. The light didn't come on." ... then she voted.)
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To: glock rocks

"THE PRISONER" We want information...information...information............... #2: I am the new number two... Prisoner: Who is number one? #2 You are number six... Prisoner: I am not a number I am a FREE MAN!!! #2 HAHAHAHAHAHAHA......................


60 posted on 10/07/2004 2:12:50 PM PDT by rennatdm
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