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To: TigersEye
You have to understand that hopespringseternal's statement isn't about an individual experience it's a generalisation based on historical experience and biological facts. You may have ethics and personal standards of behavior. So do I. But we don't have to. That's one fact.

I think I understand what you're saying here, but I'm not completely sure. What I have said is that I don't think that most men abstain from raping women because of "ethics and personal standards of behavior." I think most men abstain from raping women because they have no innate desire to engage in nonconsexual sex. In other words, I don't think that most men ever have to confront any ethical questions - they don't find themselves saying, "I'd like to, but I shouldn't, and thus will restrain myself" because they wouldn't "like to" to begin with. It has nothing to do with "power" and everything to do with desire.

Whenever a woman allows herself to be in a situation alone with a man she must face those facts.

There's no question about that. Obviously, there are some men who do seem to have a desire for nonconsensual sex and there is no foolproof way for women to distinguish such men from the majority of men who (I believe) don't have such desires. So, yeah, women have to be cautious because there are some abnormal guys out there and no matter how efficiently we kill, castrate, incarcerate or adequately threaten them, we won't be able to completely eliminate the hazard. I wish we could. ;-)

204 posted on 10/05/2004 9:13:27 AM PDT by Scenic Sounds (Sí, estamos libres sonreír otra vez - ahora y siempre.)
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To: Scenic Sounds
What I have said is that I don't think that most men abstain from raping women because of "ethics and personal standards of behavior." I think most men abstain from raping women because they have no innate desire to engage in nonconsexual sex.

I didn't include that but that's true too.

Obviously, there are some men who do seem to have a desire for nonconsensual sex and there is no foolproof way for women to distinguish such men from the majority of men who (I believe) don't have such desires.

That's true as well but what I'm saying and what I think hopespringseternal was saying isn't about rape or nonconsensual sex per se. Male dominance pervades ALL sexual relations between men and women. It's there whether you use it or not. That creates a psychological dynamic that exists no matter what the individual man is like. It can't be erased even by long term relations with a perfect gentleman. (It could be ignored or a woman could delude herself into believing it doesn't exist of course.) But it remains a possibility that any man could become an aggressor at any time. It would be a rare situation where the man lacked physical and mental superiority in terms of aggression IMO.

205 posted on 10/05/2004 9:43:22 AM PDT by TigersEye ("Where there is life there is hope." - Terri Schiavo)
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To: Scenic Sounds
So, yeah, women have to be cautious because there are some abnormal guys out there and no matter how efficiently we kill, castrate, incarcerate or adequately threaten them, we won't be able to completely eliminate the hazard. I wish we could.

I wish we could too. I'm not even talking about that.

206 posted on 10/05/2004 9:45:20 AM PDT by TigersEye ("Where there is life there is hope." - Terri Schiavo)
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