Report from Chappaqua: No downside for Hillary if she replaces Kerry on the ticket..

one man's opinion

[ken5050]

As many of you know, I have over the past four years occasionally chronicled the Clintons, from the perspective of what one hears and observes from Beautiful Downtown Chappaqua. Many Freepers have told me how much they enjoy my commentaries. I've ignored the rumors, the innuendos, the "tin-foil hat" theories. Indeed, there are many more very interesting details that I have deliberately chosen NOT to share with all of you. What I'm going to discuss now is admitted speculation on my part, but based upon a few conversations I've had in the last few days..and you'll have to trust my instincts on my sources..OK..here goes..

[Cboldt]

Can you cite one instance - just one instance where a candidate for POTUS had resigned?

Nope. And I'm not asserting the Hillary! has a chance.

But my generalization is correct, I am not talking garbage. The parties control who the electors cast ballots for (in December), and that if the candidate whose name appears on the voters ballot is unavailable, the party is free to name an alternate.

[RipSawyer]

Assuming you are right, how could you possibly think the country would survive eight years, let alone 34 years afterward before it ceased to exist? If nothing else, the mad mullahs would kill us all before her eight years ran out.

[ConservativeDude]

"this scenario is actively under discussion among Clintonistas"

like who? morons like us who speculate about these things for fun? (i am reminded of every time a top Bush person resigns and we all talk about who the replacement should be....i am usually one of the first to post of course)

or are you talking about people with real clout?

what would the legal moves need to be? kerry pulls out and the DNC picks a new person? won't it also be problematic state by state?

[Publius]

Please read Post #136.

[Publius]

You too, fellow FReeper. Please read Post #136.

[Cboldt]

It's OVER... Kerry will NEVER be allowed to be POTUS. The dream is dead. Kerry will probably NEVER be elected to public office again after this.

Deserves a repeat performace. And warms my heart!

[bjmorris]

Plus, if Rudy runs in 2008, Shrillary isn't gonna walk away with it. Rudy is a highly likable highly respected guy. I don't get all of this "Hillary *WILL* win in 2008" talk I keep hearing.

[Publius]

Thanks for adding clarity to this thread. So few people know what kind of mischief is possible with the Electoral College.

[webheart]

There have to be some laws about this.

Laws? Laws? Democrats care nothing of laws, only as things meant to keep down dissent, or to argue about exceptions in court. It judges we need to worry about. The Dems will pick the judges that hear the cases, and we will all be s*****d.

[Cboldt]

Heheheh, I was just going to private message you the same thing. Appreciate your filling in some of the blanks. Slow and steady. I try to educate the more active posters, e.g., PhiKapMom, in the hopes that more people understand the process and its limitations.

[ZULU]

"Not electable unless this country has just totally lost sight of why, and by whom, it was founded."


It has - the only question is by how much.

I wouldn't put ANYTHING past Hillery in her goal to achieve "The Plan".

She is ruthless, calculating, vicious, unscrupulous, mendacious, grasping and power-mad. NO ONE we have EVER seen in higher office in this country has ever come close to her in the combination of her dangerous personal failings and personal abilities.

I fear for my country. This is a tyrant with endless money, a gang of tax-payer funded personal guards, and no conscience. SHe's something right out of the fall of the Roman Republic.

[oceanview]

I agree with you, this could happen.

But couldn't the slate of electors for a given state, under this method, also be rejected and the race thrown into the house of representatives?

Basically, what you are saying is that the Dems could put up a candidate that wins the race, Zell Miller for example. Then the party takes him out by some nefarious means, and tells the electors to vote for someone else who could never have actually won the race on their own (Hillary).

There has to be some check and balance to stop this from happening.

[american spirit]

My thoughts center on Kerry dropping out and Edwards moving up as the "fresh" face of the Dem party. Hillary (and all her baggage) slide in as a supportive candidate (with major media backing) without having her reputation held up to public scutiny. She's positioned as a public leader for "the village" and ready to assume control if Edwards has any reason to resign....this way she gets what she wants without having to endure an exhausting campaign.

[kevkrom]

4. Ralph Nader would immediately suspend his campaign, endorse Hillary, and campaign for her. Another big Dem problem solved.

While the rest of your points sound interesting, this is way off. The only way a "draft Hillary" scheme works is if she runs to the center -- that will only force Nader to work harder against her. Nader's purpose is to force the DNC to appease it's left flank.

[GunnyB]

There have to be some laws about this. Not that the Dems would follow them.

With tinfoil hat affixed firmly to my head...

I tend to not get involved in some of the flights of fantasy that appear from time to time on FR. However, since the torricelli debacle and most recently mcqueervy, I tend to at least look at the POSSIBILITY -as I am certain the dims are as well. Look, the dims KNOW that selecting kerry was a huge mistake. He couldn't win this election if his life depended upon it.

And therein lies the partial "truth" of this possibility. Suppose that kerry's recent bout with prostate cancer were to reappear - but in a much more virulent way. Much as Rudy was able to gracefully bow out of the NY Senate campaign, kerry could have his cake and eat it too. Safely off the hook for a landslide loss of epic proportions, he could (and probably would) continue his senate career. After 6 or 8 months his cancer would suddenly be found to be under control once more.

As for hitlery, well she salivates like a rabid dog over the Presidency (sorry, slipped into a Ratherism there...). I feel that, as the author suggests, if hitlery was to perceive that she could benefit from this, she'd do it in a heartbeat. She might not win - this time, but the clintoons would still own the dim party (that awful terry the M would stay on), and she WOULD have a real springboard to 2008.

I dare not contemplate further than this, as my brain is starting to hurt. But, it is axiomatic to "know thy enemy", and we here at FR do know the Hitlerybeast quite well. Forewarned is forearmed...

[DollyCali]

you make some interesting points for discussion but I don't know how sKerry would "step down".. or if it is even feasible.. he might die/be assinated.. I am thinking the rat camp is feeling some assault on our country will make a difference as it did in Italian. Sick-os that they are.. they too often glee in American's pain for their gain.

will be interesting to follow discussion on this later. I am off for now..

(play nice)

[hershey]

I came to the same conclusion just before Bill's heart operation when it became obvious that Kerry couldn't find his own behind with a flashlight let alone rev up his poll numbers. When Bill went into the hospital, I had second thoughts. Hill really needs him on the stump with her at least in the battleground states, and he isn't up to campaigning. But you're right, she gets a pass because of sympathy, and how can GW stomp on her? The 'woman' thing comes into play. She can scream all kinds of lies and gets away with it since he looks like a bully if he calls her on anything.

So Bush has to hammer away at his own agenda and basically ignore most of Hill's attacks. And since all she has to sell is socialism and the lie that she's hawkish on protecting America...well, she did eat turkey in Afghanistan...which is more than Kerry did, Hill doesn't have much of a positive message. She'll just bash Bush 24/7. She is widely despised across the country, but she's recently taken voice/speech lessons so something's up. No more 'uhs' and 'you knows'. Not a one. She's trying not to sound like a screeching witch, too. Lower voice. This isn't just to keep Bill and New Yorkers happy. She's after bigger game, folks, and we're it.

[atomicpossum]

What do you believe would stop them?

And if you're going to say "the law" or "the Supreme Court", please quote the law or constitutional provision you feel would bar such a scenario.

Actually, I think the people, overwhelmingly, would stop them-- certainly virutally all Republicans, many Independents, and I think a good number of non-KoolAid (Zell Miller) Democrats would object to the last minute insertion of a non-vetted candidate grabbing the reins. Whatever numbers Kerry might have been polling at the time, I think a replacement candidate would get less for this very reason.

If the Lautenberg switch were played out nationally, outside of an East Coast Dem Machine stronghold, I don't think it would go over with anywhere near that kind of success.

As for the Supreme Court, they declined to intervene in the Toricelli case and overturn the NJSC ruling. That case involved an office representing the state of New Jersey, not the nation as a whole. While the Court might defer to the NJSC to interpret New Jersey law, it would not be a precedent to cover the rest of the country.

[Publius]

But couldn't the slate of electors for a given state, under this method, also be rejected and the race thrown into the house of representatives?

When the electoral votes are counted before Congress on January 6, members of Congress can challenge electoral votes and vote to throw them out. In a tight race, this would certainly lead to the election being thrown into the House.

But if a party picked a new ticket due to death or the resignation of a candidate due to scandal or disease, there would be no grounds for challenge. The key to challenge is fraud in a given state. You have to go back to 1876 for that one.

There has to be some check and balance to stop this from happening.

That is one of the many problems with the Electoral College. People on both the Left and Right have pointed out that the Electoral College is an accident waiting to happen. (This isn't the thread to go into possible ways of remedying problems with the EC.)

[camle]

thank you for that information. however - it ain't gonna happen. Kerry is gonna stand fast. He didn't come this far to throw it in now. Hillary ain't gonna step up. it just ain't gonna happen. useless speculation that the DU'ers use to label us as a bunch of tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists.

now if y'all'd excuse me. tis time to go home and put on the old PJ's.