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Bush Piloted Guard Trainers Before He Quit (AP needs Freeping again)
AP Wire ^ | 10 Sept 2004 | Matt Kelley

Posted on 09/10/2004 5:13:58 AM PDT by Rokke

WASHINGTON - George W. Bush began flying a two-seat training jet more frequently and twice required multiple attempts to land a one-seat fighter in the weeks just before he quit flying for the Texas Air National Guard in 1972, his pilot logs show.

The logs show Bush flew nine times in T-33 trainers in February and March 1972, including eight times in one week and four of those only as a co-pilot. Bush, then a first lieutenant, flew in T-33s only twice in the previous six months and three times in the year ending July 31, 1971.

The records also show Bush required two passes to land an F-102A fighter on March 12 and April 10, 1972. His last flight as an Air National Guard pilot was on April 16.

Meanwhile, questions were raised Thursday about the authenticity of newly unearthed memos purporting to have been written by one of Bush's commanders in 1972 and 1973. The memos, which were publicized by CBS News on its "60 Minutes" program, say Bush ignored a direct order from a superior officer and lost his status as a Guard pilot because he failed to meet military performance standards and undergo a required physical exam.

The network defended the memos, saying its experts who examined the memos concluded they were authentic documents produced by Lt. Col. Jerry Killian.

But Killian's son, one of Killian's fellow officers and an independent document examiner questioned the memos Gary Killian, who served in the Guard with his father and retired as a captain in 1991, said he doubted his father would have written an unsigned memo which said there was pressure to "sugar coat" Bush's performance review.

"It just wouldn't happen," he said. "No officer in his right mind would write a memo like that."

The personnel chief in Killian's unit at the time also said he believes the documents are fake.

"They looked to me like forgeries," said Rufus Martin. "I don't think Killian would do that, and I knew him for 17 years." Killian died in 1984.

Independent document examiner Sandra Ramsey Lines said the memos looked like they had been produced on a computer using Microsoft Word software. Lines, a document expert and fellow of the American Academy of Forensic Sciences, pointed to a superscript — a smaller, raised "th" in "111th Fighter Interceptor Squadron" — as evidence indicating forgery.

Microsoft Word automatically inserts superscripts in the same style as the two on the memos obtained by CBS, she said.

"I'm virtually certain these were computer generated," Lines said after reviewing copies of the documents at her office in Paradise Valley, Ariz. She produced a nearly identical document using her computer's Microsoft Word software.

The Defense Department released Bush's pilot logs this week under pressure from a Freedom of Information Act lawsuit by The Associated Press. The logs do not explain why Bush was flying T-33s or why he twice needed multiple approaches to make landings.

White House spokesman Trent Duffy said Thursday said he had no information on the reasons behind the multiple-approach landings or the surge in training-jet flights.

"He did his training and was honorably discharged," Duffy said.

Former Air National Guard officials contacted by the AP said there could be reasons for the trainer flights and multiple-approach landings which have nothing to do with Bush's pilot skills.

Bush could have flown T-33s so many times because his unit did not have enough F-102A jets available that week, for example, said retired Maj. Gen. Don Shepperd a former head of the Air National Guard. Another former Air National Guard chief, retired Maj. Gen. Paul A. Weaver, said he saw nothing unusual about Bush making more than one landing attempt.

"It doesn't mean anything to have multiple approaches," Weaver said.

Bush's Vietnam-era Air National Guard service became a focus of Democratic criticism this week amid a flurry of new reports about his activities. Democrats say Bush shirked his National Guard duties, a claim Bush denies.

Republican critics have accused Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry (news - web sites), a decorated Vietnam combat veteran, of fabricating the incidents which led to his five medals.

Bush joined the Texas Air National Guard in 1968, serving more than a year on active Air Force duty while being trained to fly F-102A jets. He was honorably discharged from the Guard in October 1973 and left the Air Force Reserves in May 1974.

The first four months of 1972 are at the beginning of a controversial period in Bush's Guard service. After taking his last flight in April 1972, Bush went for six months without showing up for any training drills. In September 1972 he received permission to transfer to an Alabama Guard unit so he could work on a political campaign there.

That May, Bush also skipped a required yearly medical examination. In response, his commanders grounded Bush on Aug. 1, 1972.

Bush's pilot logs showed regular training in the F-102A until Feb. 9, 1972, when he flew 1.4 hours as the pilot of a T-33. After seven more flights in the F-102A, Bush made eight more T-33 flights between March 9 and March 15, including the four as co-pilot.

He flew an F-102A on March 12 and eight more times in April 1972.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: ap; aplies; killian; ltbush; tang
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Idiot reporters like Matt Kelley obviously don't know that military pilots regularly fly practice approaches to fill annual training requirements. Flying one approach to a full stop is very rare. I've been an instructor pilot flying fighters for 15 years. According to the AP, I must be a terrible pilot, because I log more than one approach on almost every sortie. With regard to Bush flying T-33's...air defense squadrons frequently had trainers assigned to them for practicing intercepts and other maneuvers. Some pilots were lucky enough to be dual qualled and allowed to fly both the trainers and their primary aircraft. Apparently Bush was. That is a positive indicator of his flying abilities. Not a negative. Furthermore, his unit (and the entire Air National Guard) was in the process phasing out F-102's during the early 70's. As aircraft get phased out, they become less available to fly. Flying the T-33 was the only way to maintain proficiency.

Clearly, the AP is in a full out assualt on President Bush. They need to feel our wrath for printing lies and poorly researched stories.

1 posted on 09/10/2004 5:13:59 AM PDT by Rokke
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To: Rokke

AP seems to have a firewall around them...Your local newspaper/radio/TV station that runs their trash might be a better target to call.


2 posted on 09/10/2004 5:16:14 AM PDT by Drango (What's the Font, Kenneth?)
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To: Rokke

I wonder if you could find a single veteran employed by the AP.


3 posted on 09/10/2004 5:17:25 AM PDT by DaughterOfAnIwoJimaVet (God bless Senator Zell Miller.)
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To: Rokke

Thanks for the info. Us land based folks want to know!!


4 posted on 09/10/2004 5:19:13 AM PDT by Sacajaweau (God Bless Our Troops!!)
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To: Rokke

"Idiot reporters like Matt Kelley..."

He's obviously not enough of an idiot to not know how to bury the REAL NEWS in the middle of an article. "It's the forgeries, stupid!" (This is not directed at you, Rokke).


5 posted on 09/10/2004 5:21:36 AM PDT by Socratic (Yes, there is method in the madness.)
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To: Rokke

I've had to abort landings in light aircraft many times. Sometimes it's the prudent thing to do. The F102 is not a Cessna 172. They were fast and twitchy and very unforgiving at low speed such as landings. Go arounds happen to the best pilots in the best planes.

This is such a non-story that it is hilarious!


6 posted on 09/10/2004 5:22:41 AM PDT by Conspiracy Guy (I can always tell when John Kerry is lying.)
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To: Rokke
Tomorrow's headline from Al-Socialist Press:

"George Bush photographed picking his nose in 1970!"
(6 or 8 paragraphs on the nose story)
"Oh yeah, AP has learned that the Watergate tapes were fakes."

7 posted on 09/10/2004 5:28:23 AM PDT by atomic conspiracy (This message prepared with MS-CBS Word 72 software)
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To: Rokke
"He was honorably discharged from the Guard in October 1973."

All we need to know -- and something we do NOT know about Jean-Fraude Kerry.

8 posted on 09/10/2004 5:28:59 AM PDT by Ed_in_NJ
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To: Rokke

It's hard to make specific comments without seeing the actual logs, but the AP article does raise some questions for this private pilot.. For example, "Bush was only the co-pilot". I presume that means he was not the "pilot in command". This does NOT mean that the pilot in command was flying the plane. When I used to fly with an instructor, he took the right seat, and except for the first time out, and a few minutes here and there afterwards, I flew the aircraft even though he was the Pilot in Command.

They do not say whether the missed approaches were IFR missed approaches, but an IFR "missed approach procedure" is a practice exercise. I do not know if you have to practice them regularly, but they are one of the things an IFR pilot has to know how to do. I don't take the APs word that just because Bush had some "go arounds" it means he screwed up.


9 posted on 09/10/2004 5:34:55 AM PDT by Flash Bazbeaux ("I'll have the moo goo gai pan without the pan, and some pans.")
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To: Rokke
Idiot reporters like Matt Kelley....

Any relation to Kitty Kelley?

10 posted on 09/10/2004 5:35:41 AM PDT by Velveeta (Never forget http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/520255/posts)
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To: Rokke

Amarillo has one of the longest (maybe it is THE longest...can't remember) runways in the country at Rick Husband International Airport here. The T's (Trainers) do touch and go's all the time out there...like little jet flies when they take off! Compared to the big, lumbering commercial jets, they are so much fun to watch...must be a ball to fly one.


11 posted on 09/10/2004 5:37:26 AM PDT by Maria S ("We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good." Hillary Clinton, 6/28/04)
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To: Rokke

Might have been practicing "missed approaches" for instrument landing conditions. No telling, the is a no brainer as usual by the American "free" press. (Bought and paid for by the finest radicals in America.) For those of you in Rio Linda, that is Democrats.


12 posted on 09/10/2004 5:42:49 AM PDT by biff
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To: Rokke

OMG, if I had only known GW Bush was a BAD pilot before the 2000 election!!!!!!

How much longer do we have to suffer with poor aviators in the white house???


13 posted on 09/10/2004 5:47:47 AM PDT by ruiner
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To: Rokke; All
Bush Served Honorably - Not AWOL
14 posted on 09/10/2004 5:52:07 AM PDT by Conservative Coulter Fan (BURN IN HELL, MICHAEL MOORE!)
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To: Rokke

There is NOTHING George W. Bush does right in the eyes of people like this jackass Kelley.

So intent are they in convincing the American people, come hell or highwater, that GWB is the dumb one in this contest, they take leaps and bounds flights from their senses to write tripe like this.

All the while duly noting as an aside that, oh, there was also this document fraud perpetrated, but nevermind that, LOOK at what these other papers say.

What a disgrace.


15 posted on 09/10/2004 6:09:11 AM PDT by cyncooper (We're mad as Zell and we're not going to take it anymore!)
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To: cyncooper
The MSM/left is still seething over this photo:


16 posted on 09/10/2004 6:15:24 AM PDT by Rebelbase (John Kerry, sign form 180 .)
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To: Flash Bazbeaux

Air Force pilots regularly practice both IFR and VFR practice approaches. All Air Force pilots are IFR rated, and required to perform a certain number of IFR approaches each training cycle. To ensure you accomplish the required number of approaches, you do a few every time you fly. But there are also VFR approach requirements including straight in approaches and overhead approaches. In my jet, we also have to practice simulated engine out approaches. Other requirements include no flap approaches, and in jets with more than one motor, engine out approaches. ALL of which require multiple approaches before you land. Matt Kelley has no idea what he's talking about, but that obviously doesn't slow down the AP effort to slime Bush.


17 posted on 09/10/2004 7:03:55 AM PDT by Rokke
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To: Rokke

I bet the ground effect of that large delta wing made the last few feet over the threshold rather interesting in the Texas heat. We haven't had delta-wing aircraft in the inventory for quite some time, but we may have a Freeper or 2 around who might be knowlegeable on the subject.


18 posted on 09/10/2004 7:23:34 AM PDT by Tallguy (If Clinton did a good job stopping the Millenium Bomber, I've got 2 Towers in NYC to sell you...)
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To: Drango

"The records also show Bush required two passes to land an F-102A fighter on March 12 and April 10, 1972. His last flight as an Air National Guard pilot was on April 16."

This required two passes garbage is hardly unusual.

These people are NUTS.


19 posted on 09/10/2004 7:25:31 AM PDT by faithincowboys
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To: Howlin; Ed_NYC; MonroeDNA; widgysoft; Springman; Timesink; dubyaismypresident; Grani; coug97; ...

Just damn.

If you want on the list, FReepmail me. This IS a high-volume PING list...

20 posted on 09/10/2004 7:27:12 AM PDT by mhking
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