[Callahan]

Damn. This is definitely the biggest hit the Swifties have taken so far. More than enough to get the rest of the MSM to continue to ignore the story. Interesting that the WP went to lengths to get Thurlow's records, but fail to mention that Kerry won't release the rest of his.

[FairOpinion]

The more I read it, the more it appears to be misdirection by the MSM.

There could be a very logical explanation, consistent with the story of the SwiftVets:

A mine hits one boat, the flotilla is fired upon, KERRY RUNS, then the firs stops, KERRY RETURNS and fishes the guy out of water, who fell in, precisely, because Kerry was running away so fast.

[arasina]

Ping for you to get your ammunition ready.

[tobyhill]

It sounds as though Kerry wrote the after action report and attributed Thurlows name to it as a co-commander and then it was placed in Thurlows files. Let's see who wrote the report? Let's see the maintenance reports of the boats and see if any had bullet fragments were embedded in them?

[doug from upland]

This shows once again that Kerry turned in a phony report.

[E. Pluribus Unum]

Newly obtained military records of one of Sen. John F. Kerry's most vocal critics, who has accused the Democratic presidential candidate of lying about his wartime record to win medals, contradict his own version of events.

If military records are so useful for clearing things up, why doesn't the Post demand John Fraud Kerry's military personnel records?

[Ron in Acreage]

This doesn't change the fact that Kerrys scratches were self inflicted. Just like Max Cleland blew his own limbs off with his own grenade.

[HarryCaul]

"But Thurlow's military records..."

What records, specifically? His after action report? His commendation paperwork? What, exactly, references the enemy fire? Why are we not told, exactly? Space? There was space to sneak in the source of funding for the swiftboat ad. Why do we not learn exactly what the source of the enemy fire quotation is?

If it's the citation paperwork, well....duh! That's the whole premise of the citation. That's the whole thing under dispute.

I swear, "reporters" are so transparent.

[rolling_stone]

my guess is kerry or Rassman covered their butts by writting up Thurlow...

here is an interesting article someone might want to post if it hasn't been posted already:

http://www.rmf.net/cockburn07292004.html

Kerry's first mission as part of the Phoenix program was to ferry a Provincial Reconnaissance Unit of South Vietnamese soldiers, which would have been led by either a Green Beret or CIA officer. After off-loading the unit Kerry hid his Swift boat in a mangrove backwater. Two hours later a red flare told them that the PRU wanted an emergency "extraction". Kerry's boat picked up the PRU team, plus two prisoners. The leader of the PRU team told Kerry that while they were kidnapping the two villagers (one of them a young woman) from their hut, they'd seen four people in a sampan and promptly killed them. The two prisoners were "body-snatched" as part of a regular schedule of such seizures in the victims would be taken to An Thoi for interrogation and torture.

[cake_crumb]

"Damn. This is definitely the biggest hit the Swifties have taken so far. More than enough to get the rest of the MSM to continue to ignore the story. Interesting that the WP went to lengths to get Thurlow's records, but fail to mention that Kerry won't release the rest of his."

I agree. Damn. Why don't they get KERRY'S records? And what about Kerry's Christmas in Cambodia hoax(es), debunked 5 ways from Sunday??

[cyncooper]

Damn. This is definitely the biggest hit the Swifties have taken so far.

Really? My, you're easy.

I'm going to bet my house that this is a distortion. I'll now read Freeper comments that demonstrate it.

Buck up. The Swift Vets haven't lied, but the LSM is being exposed as hounding like the hounds of hell any good and decent person (Swift Boat Vets and President Bush, etc) and leaving the despicable, perhaps even evil, liars alone.

Now, off I go, confident that I am right and you need to know who is on the side of right and not to believe the likes of the WaPo.

[Rokke]

Where'd you go? Are you reading this thread? Are you starting to understand why the WP story is just so much more crap?

[spycatcher]

SNOPES.COM needs to update their Urban Legends Reference Pages

Claim:   John Kerry's Vietnam War service medals (a Bronze Star, a Silver Star and three Purple Hearts) were earned under "fishy" circumstances.

Status:   False.

Example:   [Collected on the Internet 2004]

---

  Sources:

    Brinkley, Douglas.   Tour of Duty: John Kerry and the Vietnam War.

    New York: HarperCollins, 2004.   ISBN 0-06-056523-3.

    Klein, Joe.   "The Long War of John Kerry."

    The New Yorker.   2 December 2002.

    Kranish, Michael.   "John F. Kerry: Candidate in the Making — Part 2: Heroism, and Growing Concern About War."

    The Boston Globe.   16 June 2003.

[TheDon]

Having read the article, I think this is much to do about nothing. There are two versions of the story on that day, Kerry and the citations state that they were under enemy fire. 3 of 4 swift boat skippers state that there was no enemy fire. Kerry is the one whose account agrees with the record. The only question is who wrote the citations, and from whom did they get their info? Obviously not the 3, so it had to be Kerry. Another Kerrytale confirmed.

[Chaguito]

dobbsm@washpost.com

Enjoyed your Post reportage regarding the records of Swift Boat Veteran Larry Thurlow. In the interest of completeness, why don't you reference Thurlow's After Action Report, rather than the medal citation alone? Even better would be the after action reports of all the commanders involved.

Since you have seen the document, you understand that the medal citation is neither a timely, nor a first person account of what happened. Can you report who wrote the citation? If you can, it would be good to include that information. For the sake of completeness, you understand.

Far more valuable would be the after action reports of all the commanders involved. With your rapid response relationship with the records people, it should be fairly simple to get the information.

Keep digging.

[ohCompGk]

Let's see, Mr. Thurlow lost his medal 20 years ago and is now giving it back. Kerry gave his back 20 years ago but still has it! Hmmm..

[tobyhill]

Thurlow would not have known about the attributing statement(s) to his award unless he was told. When they present the Bronze Star, they only give a generalization of the award, something like,"for your bravery and courage under duress, we are presenting you with a Bronze Star". I don't even think the Post can guarantee this came from Thurlow's files. They could have just ask for Thurlow's medal citations and the achieves pulled it from a data base and on the reason line it says,"Bravery under fire"? It wouldn't be the first time The Post stretched for a story.

[SunkenCiv]

Headline is spin. Intent is to smear.

"For much of the episode, Kerry was not in a position to know firsthand what was happening on Thurlow's boat, as Kerry's boat had sped down the river after the mine exploded under another boat. He later returned to provide assistance to the stricken boat.

Two other Swift boat skippers who were direct participants in the March 13, 1969, mine explosion on the Bay Hap, Jack Chenoweth and Richard Pees, have said they do not remember coming under "enemy fire." A fourth commander, Don Droz, who was one of Kerry's closest friends in Vietnam, was killed in action a month later."

[kabar]

The Post filed an independent request for the documents with the National Personnel Records Center in St. Louis, which is the central repository for veterans' records. The documents were faxed to The Post by officials at the records center yesterday.

Interesting that the WP immediately goes after Thurlow and were able to get his records so quickly. The point is that Thurlow didn't write up his own report and did deserve the Bronze Star. In Unfit for Command, it was Thurlow who tried to rein in PCF 3, which was going around in circles with a dazed, unconscious crew onboard. He was thrown into the water on the first attempt to board the PCF 3 and then later brought it to a stop after it was on a sandbar.

I believe Thurlow when he said he believed he received the medal for saving people and paid no attention to the wording about being under fire. Thurlow certainly deserved a medal more than Kerry. Hopefully, the SBVFT will respond. The battle is now joined.

[Protect the Bill of Rights]

from:
Massachusetts Veterans for Kerry Edwards

http://veteransforkerry.home.att.net/truth_about__slime_boat_sailors_.htm

The TRUTH about SLIME BOAT SAILORS for BUSH

This is part of the Official Kerry Site as noted by comparing contact info. I can't post actual page. If someone knows how, I'd appreciate it.

_______________________________________________

.........The ad continues with a statement from the NEXT talking head….LARRY THURLOW, who says: “….When the Chips were down, you could not count on John Kerry.” My Thurlow ALSO, was never a crewmate of John Kerry, but he, and HIS BOAT were also entrapped in that ambush on that fateful date in March of 1969. The Official After-Action Report states: “Larry Thurlow had maneuvered his PCF-51 over (to the disabled) PCF-3, and by and hopped aboard to offer assistance. The boat was in shambles but they were still returning fire and could not therefore assess any damage” The Report continues….“ALL BOATS RECEIVED HEAVY A/W [automatic weapons] & S/A [small arms] FROM BOTH BANKS…ALL BOATS RETURNED FIRE…PCF-94 [Kerry’s boat] PICKED UP SPECIAL FORCES ADVISOR WHO WENT OVERBOARD. PCF-94 TOWED PCF-3.” [U.S. Navy After Action Report:)

Did you all catch that last part? Despite the withering gunfire, despite being wounded, and AFTER saving the life of the Special Forces Guy…Lt. Kerry…Commanding PCF-94, hooked up a tow line to the disabled PCF-3, and TOWED it to (eventual) safety! It does NOT state that Lt. Thurlow took on this task! Who is he ACTUALLY talking about…when he says “when the chips were down, you could not count on John Kerry”?.....

______________________________________________________

Say what we want about Kerry, but he is not stupid. Ruthless, yes. Stupid, no. He has had a plan since before Viet Nam. No one has been able to bring him down. No one.

This may be part of the Kerry stategy. The above info (and much more) is on that web page. Once again, comparing contact info IT IS PART OF THE OFFICIAL KERRY EDWARDS ORGANIZATION.

Kerry has been very quiet. How many of us believe the Washington Post said "Hey, Let's file a FOIA on Thurlow!" Someone is feeding them this info. Where to look. Whose files to request.

Even if he did not anticipate the attention the Swiftees has gotten, he may have used it as a way to neutralize ANY charges against him, from Viet Nam to VVAW, to his Senate record.

[the Real fifi]

Please note Thurlow said he didn't prepare the report or see it..