Mr. Pweisdent . . Wou .. Would You Pwease Pwotect Hour Famiwies?
Posted on 08/01/2004 5:50:21 PM PDT by Coleus
HIBERNIANS SPLIT OVER MCGREEVEY
July 5, 2004
To become a member of the Catholic, Irish-American fraternal organization, members must take an oath to uphold certain core values. The governor's political views, some say, are opposed to those values.
A number of members of an Irish-Catholic organization want Gov. James E. McGreevey removed due to his support of several social and political issues - views that contradict those he once vowed to uphold as a member.
The Hibernians are a long-standing Irish-Catholic national organization whose mission, besides advocating a free Ireland, is to act as an advocate for the Roman Catholic Church on such issues as "right to life," a ban on stem-cell research and opposition to legal domestic partnerships - all issues where McGreevey finds himself on the other side. McGreevey is a longtime member of the organization, which has about 3,000 members statewide spread out in more than 30 local divisions.
In order to become a Hibernian, members must take an oath to uphold their core values.
Critics of McGreevey within the tight-knit and insular organization say he has let them down and should be removed despite his stature within the community at large.
If the storyline sounds familiar, it should - but this time the criticism comes from McGreevey's people, Irish Catholic like himself.
Recently, several bishops in New Jersey criticized McGreevy for describing himself as a devout Catholic and supporting legislation and programs that are contrary to the church's teachings.
The bishops said McGreevey should be denied communion and the story made national news - the same arguments have been leveled against Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry.
And now for the same reasons, some of the state's more than 3,000 Hibernians want McGreevey out of the organization.
It is unclear how many desire such a move because many members are reluctant to talk publicly about internal issues, but interviews with more than a dozen members show the discontent may be moving into the realm of public discourse - which, members said, is a result of the politicization of their organization.
When asked about the issue, McGreevey's spokesman said the governor "would not dignify it with a response."
This is not the first time the subject of McGreevey's removal from the organization has arisen.
In 2001, in a letter to the national president, then state President James MacFarland requested the removal of gubernatorial candidate McGreevey from the organization.
The national president responded, "Based on material I received I intend to take no action on your request to remove Brother McGreevey as a member."
In a recent interview, MacFarland said his views have not changed. "You cannot have it both ways. How do you justify being on both sides of the same issue?"
The national spokesman for the Hibernians said the organization dealt with this very issue at a national convention three years ago, and members decided it should be addressed at the local level and should include the guidance of the local chaplain.
William Young, the state president, also has his critics within the organization, though not always public ones. Some say Young has politicized a historically nonpolitical organization by his hard-line defense of the governor.
Once elected as president in 2001, Young appointed Mercer County resident and former U.S. Senate candidate Kevin Meara, a Democrat, to chair the organization's Right to Life committee.
In 2002, Meara switched to the Republican Party for local political reasons and he left the Irish Americans for McGreevey organization, which he said was primarily a Democratic organization.
In 2003, Young, within his rights as president, removed Meara from his chairman position.
"I was removed from my position because of my switch of parties and my leaving the Irish Americans for McGreevey, which should never happen in our type of organization," Meara said.
Young could not be reached for comment by either e-mail or telephone. Clearly, there is support for Young, who ran successfully twice for state president and who is running for national director during this week's national convention in Philadelphia.
Young is the Director of communications and marketing for the state Department of Labor, a position he has held since 2002.
Young is scheduled to appear in a Lacey Township courtroom later this month in a civil suit brought by Hibernian member Peter Heteji, who alleges that the state president harassed him.
According to court records, Young allegedly threatened violence against Heteji and said he would dissolve the local organization.
NJ, Middlesex County Right to Life, BANNED from St. Patrick's Day Parade, Action Needed!
Knights of Columbus Battle To Expel Pro-Abort Politician Members
Since it is a Catholic organization, it makes sense that someone who advocates in public anti-Catholic positions should not be a member.
Dear Palladin,
What's the deal here?
You told us in the thread in which some bashed the K of C for this sort of stuff that this didn't happen in the Hibernians:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1182649/posts?page=41#41
sitetest
Best wishes to the A. O. of Hibernians ... I choked on that a little ... my folks were Northern Irish Protestants :-).
FMCDH(BITS)
FMCDH(BITS)
When the narrow backs named Jim McGreedy the Grand Marshall of the Newark St. Patrick's Day Parade, they did so out of blind Democrap allegiance. At the end of that parde, the Essex County Democrap Chairman had a Roman Catholic priest removed from the post parade ceremonies, because the priest was reminding everyone of Jim McGreedy's Pro Abortion stance!
Kick his stinking carcass out of the AOH!
Thanks for the ping.
It is a matter voted on at the local level when a candidate is being inducted.
Evidently, McGreevey fooled them into thinking he was prolife.
I hope the national leadership boots McGreevey's ass out of there.
Dear Palladin,
Well, this is what you said in the other thread on the Knights of Columbus:
"I'm really surprised that the Knights let pro-abortion guys in, in the first place.
"In my org., Ancient Order of Hibernians, pro-abortion men are NOT ADMITTED."
And now, here is what you're saying here:
"It is a matter voted on at the local level when a candidate is being inducted.
"Evidently, McGreevey fooled them into thinking he was prolife.
"I hope the national leadership boots McGreevey's ass out of there."
Of course, it's far more than Mr. McGreevey having fooled them, Palladin. Even after it became apparent that Mr. McGreevey is extremely pro-death, the NJ state Hibernians continued to back him, even removing from office a fellow who thought otherwise. The NJ state president, elected twice by his state, has continued to refuse to remove Mr. McGreevey from the rolls.
I hope that the national organization manages to get rid of Mr. McGreevey, too. We have Hibernians in our parish, and they're great guys.
I hope you realize that in the Knights, each individual Council, all 10,000+ Councils, votes in its own members, and we can have the same problems that the Hibernians seem to have, in spades.
In the future, you may wish to give the Knights a bit more slack, considering the (understandable) failures of your own organization.
sitetest
Remember this is a group that plays down the Babaric evil of Irish terror on British civillians. Most Freepers should regard this association with suspician. Any Irish who doesn't condemn fully acts of murder by the irish against the british is no worse than the arab supporters of osama. Long live our ally Tony Blair and freedom for protestant civilians ( and moderate catholics) in Northern Ireland . Death to all terrorists.
Oh, well--I guess you told me off.
Wouldn't it be nice if all the prolife Catholic orgs could get along?
We might actually accomplish something, and get the two-faced politicos out of our ranks.
Should you remove a tumor from your brain stem????? Should you defecate a fecal impaction???? Huh?????????
Dear Palladin,
"Wouldn't it be nice if all the prolife Catholic orgs could get along?"
Yeah, it sure would.
So, if you want us all to just get along, why take a potshot at the Knights?
You know that the Knights of Columbus, on the whole, is a good, Catholic, pro-life organization. You saw someone taking potshots at us. Clearly, the faults they could find with the Knights they could just as easily find with the Ancient Order of Hibernians. Someone eventually did.
Instead of saying, "Hey, guys, wait a minute, you're judging the whole group, a good group, on the basis of a few problems,"
you said:
"I'm really surprised that the Knights let pro-abortion guys in, in the first place.
"In my org., Ancient Order of Hibernians, pro-abortion men are NOT ADMITTED."
Thanks for watching our backs. Thanks for giving us the benefit of the doubt. Not. Thanks for (falsely) contrasting us poorly with the Hibernians.
Notice, my response back wasn't to take a potshot at the Hibernians. I know the Hibernians are good guys. And unfortunately, they have many of the same difficulties we have.
All I'm asking is that in the future, when you hear or read bad things about the Knights, try to give us the benefit of the doubt, cut us some slack.
I certainly try to do the same with other Catholic fraternal organizations.
sitetest
YES!
BUMP
Since being 100% pro abortion and starting an embryonic stem cell institute wasn't enough. I wonder if the Hibernians are still split on kicking out McGreevey given his coming-out speech.
sitetest, I should have spoken for my Chapter only. In our group, his ass would have been booted out the door.
New Jersey is another story. AOH there is just too politicized.
We are starting a letterwriting campaign here to the national leaders to kick out of the Order all phony Irish Catholic politicians like McGreevey.
(sitetest--you must not have seen my many other posts deploring the fact that McGreevey is still a member of AOH).
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