Lets say I'm seriously over estimating, so we'll cut that figure in half, which ends up being 72,222,222 fighters. 
Posted on 07/16/2004 6:36:27 AM PDT by milestogo
WASHINGTON, (UPI) July 13 , 2004 -
The United States must cease its interference with Chinese internal affairs over the question of Taiwanese independence or face a serious deterioration of U.S.-China relations, China warned Tuesday.
In an official statement delivered to the press at the Embassy of the Republic of China, embassy spokesman Sun Weide spoke of China's grave concern regarding recent U.S. actions on the Taiwan question.
He urged the United States to halt all arms sales to the country, terminate military links, end official exchanges with Taiwanese authorities, and stop supporting Taiwan's efforts to join international organizations that require statehood.
Such actions, Sun said, violated the one-China policy to which U.S. leaders pledged adherence in three joint communiqués signed by the two countries in 1979 and 1982.
In the final communiqué, the United States reiterated its official recognition that there is but one China and Taiwan is part of China. The United States also stated the intention to gradually reduce arms sales to Taiwan over a period of time, leading to a final resolution.
Twenty-four years have passed, said Sun. It is time for the U.S. to honor its commitments.
If those commitments are not honored, he said, ... the reactions will not be in favor of the bilateral relations. ... It will affect our cooperation and China-U.S. relations as well.
Recent visits to China by U.S. national security adviser Condoleezza Rice and Vice President Dick Cheney were successful, he said, and on the whole, China-U.S relations have been steadily progressing.
However, it was made clear to Rice during her visit, Sun reported, that the importance of the Taiwan issue in China's relationship with the U.S. cannot be overemphasized.
The Taiwan question bears directly on China's sovereignty and territorial integrity, he said. We don't need any foreign countries to play any roles in their regards.
Sun rejected Cheney's suggestion during his April visit that there was a link between Chinese conduct over Hong Kong and the Taiwan question, saying China would not accept such interference from the U.S. government.
A senior administration official told the Washington Post in April that Cheney's message to China's leaders had been that Beijing's efforts to stifle democracy in Hong Kong might further kindle Taiwan's moves towards formal independence.
There is not, said Sun, any basis for American government officials to accuse China of eroding freedoms in Hong Kong.
Expressing Beijing's dissatisfaction over recent comments and actions by U.S. government officials and congressmen, he said democracy is expanding in Hong Kong, and people are enjoying freedoms more than anytime in the past.
China, he said, welcomes international dialogue on human rights on a basis of mutual respect. The recent breakdown in such dialogue, he said, is the sole responsibility of the United States.
He pointed to the anti-China resolution tabled by the United States at the U.N. Human Rights Commission in Geneva this April. The defeat of the resolution, the 11th such defeat since 1990, shows the international community recognizes Chinese progress in this area, he continued.
The fact that Taiwan is part of China is also a fact recognized by the international community, said Sun.
A State Department spokesman declined to comment on Tuesday's statement, pointing to the April testimony of James E. Kelly, assistant secretary of state for East Asian and Pacific Affairs, in which he outlined to the House International Relations Committee U.S. official policy on Taiwan.
The United States is committed, said Kelly, to the one-China policy based on the three joint communiqués. However, it will not support any unilateral move that alters Taiwan's status, and should China threaten force or coercion against Taiwan, the United States would use its capacity to resist that threat.
In addition, the U.S. government will continue to sell Taiwan defensive military equipment in accordance with the Taiwan Relations Act, introduced in 1979.
China strongly opposes this act as a violation of the one-China principle and the three joint communiqués, Sun noted at the press briefing.
However, if Beijing fulfills its obligations in adopting a military position that supports peaceful approaches to Taiwan, the defensive requirements will also change accordingly, according to Kelly's testimony.
China currently has short-range ballistic missiles aimed at Taiwan, which have been increasing by 50 to 75 missiles per year, Kelly stated.
Taiwan views this threat as a major obstacle to reunification. Taiwanese President Chen Shui-Bian said in his May inaugural speech:
If (China) continues to threaten Taiwan with military force, ... this will only serve to drive the hearts of the Taiwanese people further away and widen the divide in the Strait.
The chairman of Taiwan's Mainland Affairs Council, Joseph Wu, said in a June statement that under such military pressure, Taiwan must reinforce its own defenses.
The Taiwanese position has been to call for peaceful and amicable negotiations on the issue of independence. Chen stated in his May speech that the Taiwanese government would not exclude any possibility as long as the people consented, and that the country understood China's insistence on reunification based on historical and ethnic concerns. However, he also called for a reciprocal understanding on the part of Beijing of the Taiwanese people's democratic concerns.
Sun, however, cited the refusal of the Taiwanese authorities to recognize the one-China principle as the main obstacle to reunification, which, he said, is the common wish of all Chinese people, including our compatriots in Taiwan. China will never tolerate Taiwanese independence, he added. We know that there is only one China in the world.
Such statements further confirm that Beijing's patience is beginning to wear thin, Ted Galen Carpenter, a leading foreign policy analyst, told United Press International Tuesday.
Beijing is becoming increasingly frustrated that the United States does not regard this matter as urgent, said Carpenter, vice president of defense and foreign policy studies at the Cato Institute in Washington.
In fact, he said, We've reached the point where the status quo is unsustainable for more than a few years.
The United States is caught in the middle of an increasingly tense situation, said Carpenter, and is currently heading for a nasty confrontation.
We're likely to have a major crisis within the next few years, he said.
If United States wants to avoid the line of fire, according to Carpenter, we should make clear to Taiwan that although we support negotiations, we will not defend Taiwan in the event of a military conflict.
We don't want to fight a war with China over Taiwan, he concluded, and that may be the bottom line.
"What do you think China can throw at us that would be effective?"
Um, how about nuclear weapons?
The people of the United States have already show the lack of backbone that they have with the war in Iraq. If a few hundred soldiers die,(let alone hundreds of thousands of people), they will scream and cry that we should pull out....we shouldn't be fighting for Taiwan.
China should be first on the preemptive strike list.
Lets say I'm seriously over estimating, so we'll cut that figure in half, which ends up being 72,222,222 fighters.
72,222,222 fighters. Big deal! We can just ask the French to give us a hand. Problem solved.
I don't see how receiving by diplomatic pouch a amputated hand from a French general is any help.
Have reread my post your post referenced.
I have no clue how to connect your post with mine or what you are trying to say.
Sorry. Just got up.
Could you please spell it out for me?
Now THAT is more than plausible!
And along the lines that I've pondered for years.
I've often wondered how loyal the 'students' et al would be who are already so well placed within our society.
I think that's a hazardous thing for China. I think many would not be loyal to China. And, sadly, many we think might be loyal to us, would not be.
But yeah, they have thousands here and plenty would be loyal to China to cause us great grief, imho.
And, Mexicans for Aztlan (not called that then) had plenty of cached weapons hidden in the Southwest at least as early as 1965. I talked with such critters in my job at the univ library.
I'm a bit sorry, I'm not likely to give you a preferred response. The tone is . . . welll anyway . . .
The Chinese CAN BE quite inventive in a list of ways. Living there, it's obvious.
Certainly they've lived handsomely off our creativity. But they are certainly artists at making something shabby look polished and pristine.
They are artists at MAKING DO.
Paper, gun powder, printing, paper money, rocketry, etc. were inventions they didn't exactly develop well centuries ago--but they are fair hints at their creativity.
It's not wise or realitistic to be smug and haughty about Chinese inventivenes.
imho.
Sorry, probably need more coffee. Thanks for calling it to my attention.
I'm sure the french and germans will back us up...
The interesting tangential evidence of this is that every few years, US Customs finds a COSCO container full of military weaponry (labeled as something else, of course) while spot-checking imports. And every time, the Chinese government says they'll investigate the matter and you never hear about it again. This has been going on for years. Since they only catch them in random checks which only look at 1-2% of the containers overall, it does make you wonder how many containers full of weaponry make it through to have the occasional one randomly caught.
And I still find the fierce nationalism of Chinese here, including some that were even born here, to be a bit odd. Most other Asian cultures have gotten past the overt master race complex a long time ago, even if the subtext is still there. In most countries it is now muted to the level of how Americans generally think we're better than everyone else -- a matter of pride and history rather than the axiomatic Word of God. A lot of Chinese believe it is the destiny of their race to rule the world or some such, which is slightly disconcerting vocal assertion coming from born and bred Americans. (Can you imagine the press coverage if white people openly said such things?)
No problem.
Just wanted to know what you meant and were referring to, so I could respond somewhat intelligently.
Geostrategic imperatives...and counter apllications by both.
So ya...in the 50's ..China was a horde seeking WMD.
Today..they are challenging U.S. Geostrategics on many levels.
For the past decades...China has used situations....inflamed them..in a game which principly drags hard on the U.S. fiscally....and see's division in Americas populace as to what American foreign policy should really be.
China postures..bangs pot and pans,
the U.S. Moves carrier battle groups around and seeks funding for their logistics and maintenence.
China does not move....only speaks words,
The U.S. expends Billions if not Trillions.
So then..who is the cat..and who is the mouse?
The U.S. has spent how much to secure South Korea's freedom and economic potential.
yet today..China invests millions in South Korea.
They come and go as they please..and make U.S. dollars.
To some extent..Russia used the same dynamic in the middle east..commi Europe of the past.
posture..threat..sell arms.
The U.S. is in catch up mode spending Billions to settle out the chaos.
And then the return for U.S. security.
Ungratefull Europe for the most part....complaining South Korea..on and on.
I guess you could just go to war and settle the feuds outright...yet fear morphs options into quasi settlement/boundry acceptance realities.
China can keep *tweeking situations....costing the U.S.continually in the game of move and match.
China has compromised Americas security by stealth and cunning.
patiently getting what they can..and making money while doing it.
2005 will see China's new *Boomer sub out of the barn..if things go well for the Court of Heaven.
5,000...7000? mile range on the Mirved [Clinton w-88] warheads.
so ya...a few years for China to fab 6-10 Type 094's...then a new round of stratagem.
Chinese Boomers detected off Washington state...believed to be doing launch drills on U.S. Boomer bases and Naval bases.
Chinese boomers in the Carribean..on and on.
Myself..percieve that some proxy war may oocur in the future...India/Pakistan.
both Russia and China get to see how long technology applications last in modern war..learn.
neither would be caught starting such a conflict..yet if they want to destabalize and force the U.S. to charge around spending gobs of money..it likely to happen.
Pakistan and Indias ethno/relgious reality ensures such a war occuring.
just a matter of triggering it when time suites them.
both nations can only buy arms for so long...pushing them into a war where they will attrit each others assets gives both Russia and China a military resupply reality.
The future watch crowd..consider that eventually overpopulation and economic/societal support balance will be tripped....the far east could be a run of chaos..with several nations siiting in the high seat..tweeking the thing for their own geostrategic imperative.
For now...U.S. presence in the mid east semi neutralizes Russia and China as per enabling the crazed muslims to their dimented ends.
really bad news if Kerry and surrender monkeys get the wheel.
suddenly..the mid east becomes a tantalizing wepaons sales opp for Russia and China...the nuclear war clock goes to 11:59 again with Israel drawing a line in the sand.
There was an economist on Charlie Rose a few nights ago..this guy..[sorry cannt remember the name]..Chair of the CFR...involved with the Fed in the past...buddy of Snow..etc.
he commented that a possible fiscal/meltdown is what awaits the U.S. down the road...Health care..Retirement,,social programs...national debt...taxation.
The consumer society meltdown thingy.
hard to know if that projection will occur.
but for certain...Americas enemies will continue to posture and bang pots and pans...and drain away Trillions from the U.S. in the game of move and match.
EXCELLENT AND VERY PERCEPTIVE POST,
imho.
Thanks tons.
bump
I don't think they're that serious.
We have more than enough bullets and bombs to carpet bomb their asses. They can have all the billions they want. But they have to have a way to get to Taiwan. They also need the military equipment. So just showing me bodies is not enough to tell me that they would be militarily effective.
Chinese have also been rehearsing amphibious operations in recent months and now have the capacity to launch their own satellites on short notice. Couple that with a socialist agenda in this country willing to sell out anything American to advance their personal meglamanias then imagine the Chinese attacking the west coast using tactics similar to how we attacked Iraq. It wouldn't take much because as a nation the socialists have split our command and control.
I sure agree!
China has a new C3I system...
the debate...how much is schemed off U.S. C3I.
The Chinese amphibious operation offers the U.S. another opportunity to digest the new C3I Encryption.
an interesting article;
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