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Victor Davis Hanson: History’s Verdict, The summers of 1944 and 2004
NRO ^ | 7/16/2004 | Victor Davis Hanson

Posted on 07/16/2004 6:05:56 AM PDT by Tolik

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1 posted on 07/16/2004 6:05:57 AM PDT by Tolik
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To: seamole; Lando Lincoln; quidnunc; .cnI redruM; yonif; SJackson; dennisw; monkeyshine; Alouette; ...


    Victor Davis Hanson Ping ! 
2 posted on 07/16/2004 6:06:46 AM PDT by Tolik
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[please freepmail me if you want or don't want to be pinged to Victor Davis Hanson articles]

If you want to bookmark his articles discussed at FR: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/k-victordavishanson/browse

His NRO archive: http://www.nationalreview.com/hanson/hanson-archive.asp

His blog: http://victorhanson.com/index.html     BIO: http://victorhanson.com/Author/index.html

Yes, he is listened by the Bush Administration; they like him maybe as much as we do: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1085464/posts?page=6#6

3 posted on 07/16/2004 6:07:58 AM PDT by Tolik
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To: Tolik

VDH shacks this one. Second guessing does no one any good. Bad things happen in war. We have done quite well. I only wish I was more confident about what we are doing at home. People are forgetting September 11. The war ain't over, not by a long shot.


4 posted on 07/16/2004 6:09:35 AM PDT by RKV (He who has the guns makes the rules.)
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To: RKV
I have studied the campaigns and battles of Stonewall Jackson, and I am always amazed how the commentators, who write the books, sit in judgement and look down their noses at mistakes that were made.

Are mistakes made? Of course... War is messy. War ebbs and flows... Could some mistakes have been avoided? Sure, looking in hindsight...100% of them could be avoided. But the commentators weren't there. They weren't caged in by the intelligence Jackson had. They weren't hemmed in by his limitations. Jackson was a genius. He won and won and won...

So, VDH is right. I get exasperated when I even read posts on FR by Freepers, who think they could run this war so much better than the people in charge. The only thing I would say...if you can, then you owe it to your country to get log off your computer and offer your sword and life... (you being a rhetorical you)

5 posted on 07/16/2004 6:27:10 AM PDT by carton253 (It's time to draw your sword and throw away the scabbard... General TJ Jackson)
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To: Tolik
One word..........WOW!

Thanks for posting this!

6 posted on 07/16/2004 6:27:26 AM PDT by ohioWfan (BUSH 2004 - Leadership, Integrity, Morality)
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To: carton253
So, VDH is right. I get exasperated when I even read posts on FR by Freepers, who think they could run this war so much better than the people in charge. The only thing I would say...if you can, then you owe it to your country to get log off your computer and offer your sword and life... (you being a rhetorical you)

Amen!

The bluster and arrogance of the pretenders here on FR is astounding.

7 posted on 07/16/2004 6:30:39 AM PDT by ohioWfan (BUSH 2004 - Leadership, Integrity, Morality)
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To: carton253

We are preaching to the converted here. What matters (for those of us who are too old to enlist) is to speak the plain truth at every opportunity.


8 posted on 07/16/2004 6:33:51 AM PDT by RKV (He who has the guns makes the rules.)
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To: RKV
Worth repeating:

...the point is clear. War is a horrendous experience in which the side that wins commits the fewest mistakes, rather than no errors at all.

Our 24 hour news cycle and reporting in the style of the few seconds soundbytes is a cruel joke on ourselves. Nothing serious can be discussed in such a manner. There are big issues that our nation needs to discuss and come to some kind of consensus. But what we have is shrill accusations from the left, just plain stupid noise. The serious critique, feedback that is absolutely necessary for any organization to be successful (regardless of its size, be it GM or neighborhood auto-mechanic or Bush Administration) is drowned out in this noise, and easily dismissed. We don't have patience, we don't have discussion, just yelling at each other. I hope when W wins in November the temperature of the nation will go down a bit, and we will return to civil dialog.
9 posted on 07/16/2004 6:35:58 AM PDT by Tolik
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To: Tolik

Great post!


10 posted on 07/16/2004 6:40:08 AM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: Tolik

This essay crystalizes the truth that if our country loses the War On Terror, it will be because of the Left's fifth column on our own soil. We, the citizens of this Republic, are on the front line of the WOT as much as the soldiers. However, our duty is political action not violence. This war will be won or lost at the ballot box. The leaders of the Democratic party lacked the nerve to take on their own left wingers and throw their support behind the war effort. The Democratic party will only change if the voters make it emphatically clear next November that this is not another Viet Nam.


11 posted on 07/16/2004 6:43:31 AM PDT by darth
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To: Tolik
Great post. It is well to remember that:

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, and comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat."
-Theodore Roosevelt (Paris Sorbonne,1910)

12 posted on 07/16/2004 6:48:25 AM PDT by Snake65 (Osama Bin Decomposing)
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To: Tolik

Do yourself a favor and step out of the cycle. Read books, magazines, and yes internet blogs, etc. which don't play that game. There are many of them out there. Serious people are having serious discusions outside of the ABCCBSCNNNBCNYTWP big media. Talk to your friends about what you see there. Its a small but important start. Just one for instance, I am reading "The Peloponnesian War" by Donald Kagan in preparation for a re-read of Thucydides this summer. This stuff is not on the best seller list and often can be had for free from you library.


13 posted on 07/16/2004 6:48:46 AM PDT by RKV (He who has the guns makes the rules.)
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To: Tolik
Like Hitler, Saddam Hussein was a mass-murdering fascist, whom we had also appeased for years. For all his bluster, Hitler had not been in a prior shooting war with the United States, but after Pearl Harbor he had to be destroyed. In the same manner, after 9/11 there was no longer any margin of error in "boxing in" a rogue dictator that had struck four nations, violated most of the 1991 armistice agreements, ignored over a dozen U.N. resolutions, butchered tens of thousands, ruined the environment of Mesopotamia, constantly tried to recycle petrodollars to terrorists, attempted to assassinate a sitting U.S. president, and was in a stand-off with the U.S. Air Force involving 12 years, 350,000 sorties, and the control of two-thirds of Iraqi air space. Indeed, on September 11, 2001, American military forces were being fired on and firing back at the forces of just one nation in the world: Baathist Iraq.

Well. WMDs? Sadam Hussein was a WMD all by himself!

14 posted on 07/16/2004 6:54:25 AM PDT by mc5cents ("We will have to take things away from you on behalf of the common good." Hillary Clinton)
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To: Tolik

I think we've "run the war" just fine, allowing for human error which is always present. The difference between WWII and this one lies more in how the P.R. war is being run--in WWII, a Whoopi Goldberg would have not only lost her job for what she did, but she would have been unhireable almost anywhere, even bussing tables in a cheap diner. It's considered, if anything, almost chic to bash the war, the President, and the country.

These are very different citizens in these times. I don't think the population as a whole has the judgement to see whether or not it's a just war to begin with, and worse, I think the country's citizens have become so soft and so accustomed to "being taken care of" (not to mention, unable to endure even small inconveniences without severe whining) that they simply don't have what it takes to fight and win a war.

MIND YOU, I am not talking about the troops, but the citizens who must support them if we are to win. That is where the true failing is, in my estimation.


15 posted on 07/16/2004 7:14:03 AM PDT by MizSterious (First, the journalists, THEN the lawyers.)
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To: RKV
You are preaching to the choir. However, consider the television ratings, which reveal that literally millions of people watch the network news, and for many of them, only the network news, to know what is going on in the world around them.

Have you tried talking to such people? I have. I get blank stares, if not suggestions that I might be a paranoid delusional. If Tom, Petah and Dan say it, then by golly it must be true.

I am embroiled in such a conversation now, via email. I know this is a friend who will probably never speak to me again, but I also know I cannot pretend to agree with her, even slightly. "All we've done is stir up a hornet's nest. Bush is going to get us all killed. Michael Moore is right! This is a quagmire worse than Vietnam!" She believes this.

16 posted on 07/16/2004 7:21:22 AM PDT by MizSterious (First, the journalists, THEN the lawyers.)
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To: Tolik

Hanson is a wonderful writer..Thanks!


17 posted on 07/16/2004 7:29:04 AM PDT by MEG33 (John Kerry has been AWOL for two decades on issues of National Security)
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To: Tolik

BTTT!


18 posted on 07/16/2004 7:49:54 AM PDT by spodefly (i am spodefly, and i approved this post.)
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To: MizSterious

Hard to be that blunt to a friend, but sometimes necessary. I hope it works out.


19 posted on 07/16/2004 7:52:30 AM PDT by RKV (He who has the guns makes the rules.)
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To: arbee4bush

WOW...this is GREAT ***ping!***


20 posted on 07/16/2004 8:00:06 AM PDT by KB4W (I voted for the...before I voted...against, No...wait...You mean I'm supposed to vote? JF'nK)
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