Posted on 07/15/2004 1:12:48 PM PDT by big gray tabby
On June 29, 2004, at 12:28 p.m., I flew on Northwest Airlines flight #327 from Detroit to Los Angeles with my husband and our young son. Also on our flight were 14 Middle Eastern men between the ages of approximately 20 and 50 years old. What I experienced during that flight has caused me to question whether the United States of America can realistically uphold the civil liberties of every individual, even non-citizens, and protect its citizens from terrorist threats.
On that Tuesday, our journey began uneventfully. Starting out that morning in Providence, Rhode Island, we went through security screening, flew to Detroit, and passed the time waiting for our connecting flight to Los Angeles by shopping at the airport stores and eating lunch at an airport diner. With no second security check required in Detroit we headed to our gate and waited for the pre-boarding announcement. Standing near us, also waiting to pre-board, was a group of six Middle Eastern men. They were carrying blue passports with Arabic writing. Two men wore tracksuits with Arabic writing across the back. Two carried musical instrument cases - thin, flat, 18 long. One wore a yellow T-shirt and held a McDonald's bag. And the sixth man had a bad leg -- he wore an orthopedic shoe and limped. When the pre-boarding announcement was made, we handed our tickets to the Northwest Airlines agent, and walked down the jetway with the group of men directly behind us.
(Excerpt) Read more at womenswallstreet.com ...
Dont pay any attention to this this idiot. Its obviously a 14 year old with acne and calloused hands playing on his parents computer....
The Northwest crew was violating TSA instructions by not telling the 14 Syrians to sit down and not to congregate by the restrooms and emergency exits:
http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/business/7655005.htm?1c
Posted on Wed, Jan. 07, 2004
TSA Discourages Lavatory Lines on Planes
Associated Press
WASHINGTON - Airlines have been asked to tell passengers they shouldn't congregate near aircraft lavatories because of security concerns, the Transportation Security Administration said Wednesday.
The agency in mid-December sent an advisory to airlines asking them to inform passengers that they should not gather in groups on airplanes, especially near the restroom, said spokesman Darrin Kayser.
"It formalizes the idea that we don't want people congregating in the airplane," Kayser said.
Thanks Jimbo, I appreciate you confirming that.
I'll say what I want thanks. Go back to DU yourself - whatever that is.
Welcome!
It is my understanding that airlines are subject to a $10,000 fine for each person out of their seats during this final stage of arrival. As this would be difficult to police (the flight attendents aren't going to report their own airlines), the regulation appears moot.
I printed this article out for my husband to read. He asked a interesting question. Why would the flight attendant have asked the author to write a description of the gent in the yellow shirt? She could have easily stepped into a private area (galley maybe) and written it herself. After all, she'd probably walked by and interacted with him several times herself.
Regards from Dothan, Alabama.
http://www.airportnet.org/depts/federal/press/articles/wsj52704.htm
Why It's Harder on Some Flights
To Get Up and Stretch Your Legs
May 26, 2004; Page D9
-snip-
The Transportation Security Administration told airlines in December to police gatherings of passengers on planes for possible security risks, especially near cockpit doors. Since then, different airlines have interpreted that recommendation differently. And frequent travelers say airline crews often unilaterally go further these days, even outright barring passengers from standing in the aisles and the galleys in the back of the plane.
That's what happened to Andy Thorson on a recent five-hour trip from Orlando, Fla., to Los Angeles on United Airlines. Four hours into the trip, he wanted to stretch. So he slipped into a rear galley of the Boeing 757, only to be shooed away by a magazine-reading flight attendant who said he wasn't allowed to congregate in a galley area for "security reasons."
-snip-
Five-hour flights without providing an opportunity to stretch?
United, a unit of UAL Corp., says that isn't its policy, and that its flight attendant was probably confused by another TSA security directive. The TSA has instructed airlines to ban passengers from congregating in any galley on international flights bound for the U.S., but not on domestic flights, says United spokeswoman Chris Nardella. "We want our customers to stretch their legs," she adds.
Officially, the TSA says it has directed airlines only to tell crews they can break up lines or gatherings if there might be a security danger. The directive went to airlines before the busy holiday travel season, about the same time the government raised the nation's threat status (to a "level orange").
"This measure empowered flight crews to take steps if they become uncomfortable with the situation on an airplane," says TSA spokesman Darrin Kayser.
Flight crews do have wide authority in the air. Federal law says passengers must comply with instructions of flight crews -- even if they don't agree with them. An airplane isn't a democracy, and there's good reason for that.
Still, airlines vary in their policies on wandering passengers. They all want you seated when the seat-belt sign is on, or when flight attendants are serving beverages. But after that, policies seem to range from lenient to leg-irons.
Delta Air Lines, for example, says it has no policy. "You're free to move about the cabin, as long as it doesn't interfere with the crew," says Delta spokeswoman Catherine Stengel. "We allow our customers to stretch."
AMR Corp.'s American Airlines, on the other hand, says its flight attendants sometimes ask passengers queuing up for bathrooms in the rear of the plane to sit down and wait; in short, it's up to the discretion of the flight attendants.
Continental says it asks passengers not to congregate near any lavatory, particularly the front. But flight attendants let passengers line up for the rear bathroom, even when lines get long -- as they often do when movies end or prior to the 30-minute stay-seated rule when flying into Washington's Reagan National Airport. Galleys are OK for stretching, a spokesman says, unless flight attendants have pulled closed the curtain the airline provides.
Northwest Airlines says its flight attendants monitor activity around the cockpit door and discourage congregating there, as the TSA security guidance suggested.
-snip-
Yesterday, I sent the link to this article to Andrew Sullivan.
Today, he leads with it.
http://www.andrewsullivan.com/
< / bragging >
Who is Andrew Sullivan?
http://michellemalkin.com/archives/000207.htm
Also up on instapundit.
Who is Andrew Sullivan?
I've always liked your dry British wit, jj.
You forgot the < / sarcasm > ...
bump.
Chilling story.............PC gone mad and way past time to get rid of Mineta.
Sir, I will be the first to say that there is nothing unusual about using the bathroom....but when individuals ACT as a group, that is weird.
If you would have read the article, the plane was packed with air marshals and met with agents, with the crew concerned about the activity as well. The Arabs were detained.
They were not just using the bathroom.
What I can not figure out is why the passengers on the plane and the flight crew did nothing about this. At the first sign of this activity, I would have confronted these guys, told them to sit down and stay in their seats for the rest of the flight.
I would have inserted myself into their little bathroom line and barged in ahead of them to see what they were doing.
Were the regular passengers on this flight nuts? Just sitting there witnessing something like this taking place? Talk about watching someone prepare to kill you.
And I agree with you. A must read.
the good news is that new regulations came about due to this
So what. We found this one here. What is the point of posting that another thread has this story also?
of using the bathroom together, of standing up when they were not supposed to....again TOGETHER AS A GROUP....of TAKING ITEMS INTO THE BATHROOM THAT APPEAR LIGHER WHEN LEAVING AND THEN GIVING THE THUMBS UP SIGN TO ANOTHER PERSON WHO DOES THE SAME THING?
Let me ask you: Do you have any brain cells at all?
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