Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Arab Respose to Democracy, reform (Iraqi Blog)
IRAQ THE MODEL | 6/13/04

Posted on 06/14/2004 5:58:56 AM PDT by Valin

I think those who wonder what might be the Arab people response to the big ME project and the demand for reforms in the ME should listen to the Arab people, not the Arab governments or Arab press. Trying to offer as much as I can in this respect, I've translated some of the responses I found in the BBC Arabic forum and although they may not be viewed as very promising, they are no way consistent with what we hear in the Arab media. As expected the most welcoming replies came from Iraq and the worst from Palestine and in between those extremes, came the replies from other Arab countries. The only thing that surprised me was that many posters from Saudi Arabia were optimistic and showed much better understanding and acceptance than the rest of the Arab countries. Here are some of these posts:

It's understandable that the Arab rulers would refuse the reforms in a western style (although I'm sure they refuse reforms in an Arabic style, if there's anything like that) but what is not understandable is that the Arab citizens would refuse the reforms just because they come from the others. I think the Arab people refuse the reforms that come from outside just because their rulers made them accustomed to look negatively to whatever comes from there, and I think the only ones who lose from rejection of the reforms that come from outside and that is mixed with rejection of the reforms from inside too, are the Arab people. As for Bush, I think he has thrown the ball in the Arab governments' court (in his press conference) when he said that he believed that the reforms should suit the culture of the people. So do you think that any Arab government will be serious in making any change without the American pressure?! I doubt it, and I think the USA in her call for reforms in the Arab world is like someone trying to carve in a solid rock.

Mohammed-Baghdad.

When I hear terms like freedom and democracy, I feel like there's a silly play America is trying to sell, just to laugh at the Arab people, because the Arab people have known these hollow terms that don't express what they mean.

Abdullah-Khan Yunis/Ghaza.

During the past 50 years, the pan-Arab nationalists and the Arab monarchy have been leading the Arab world, the first saying "we are the socialist who look for Arab unity and development…" and the Monarchists made their countries their own property and both have been ruling by fire and iron fist, so enough and a thousands times enough and I wish the super powers move to save the Arab people from this nonsense. Tariq Abdul-Hameed-Dubai.

What's the common thing among the Arab rulers who refuse the invitation to the G8 summit? None of them got the power through elections, therefore any initiative that may push towards democracy and justice and the basic citizen's rights must be not only rejected by them, but also considered as a danger to the state's security and peace.

Muhannad Al-Magreesi-Tripoli /Libya.

I think that the change should come from outside and that's because of the dictatorial nature of the Arab rulers and because they only care about their personal interests.

Adil-Bahrain.

America reforms the ME? And for who's interest? Is it for the interest of the Arab people? Of course not, it will be for the benefit of Israel by bringing rulers who serve Israel and America in the first place and create a spoiled generation in the region that will not care about the future.

Shakeeb-Paestine.

If we cannot make the change by ourselves, then why not let the others help us? Let's put the faked pride aside. It's because of our silence and fear from the change that we went through all of this, we were insulted, tortured and our women were raped by our rulers, those who surpassed everyone in destroying their own people so that the wont be able to face them "He who fears to climb mountains, will live his whole life in holes". Let's allow the others to help us climb the first rock towards the top.

Abu-Amir Al-Abbassi-Samawa/Iraq.

Who took away the freedom from the people? It's the regimes and they don't represent their people anywhere you go in the Arab world. They're only opportunistic minorities that live by sucking the people's blood. The change will not come from these regimes, not without strong pressures from outside. The regimes that are asked to make the changes are the main source of all the corruption so how can we expect from the disease to make a change itself in a way that brings the cure!? Here's the Saudi minister of internal affairs reply to the people who demand reforms saying, "You want a democracy that put Prince Abdullah on the shelf??" This is their attitude, so how can you expect from people who think in this way to make true reforms?!

Saad Al-Saadi/Jidah/Saudi Arabia.

The fact that the Arab people may refuse the reforms is a dangerous flaw. If our customs and traditions do not allow Democracy, freedom and social justice, then to the Hell with such traditions. Besides, what did the Arab governments offer to solve the Palestinian issue, for instance, so that we should wait for them to make the change now!? We should start the change now or else the number of Arabs living in western countries will be more than those living in the Arab countries and then you can feel happy with your traditions and "historical issues" in countries with not citizens!

Mohammed Muhsin/Iraqi in Dubai.

Those who question the possibility of a reform that comes from outside should look at Iraq now. Is there a single Arab who enjoys the same freedom we have now? Any politician no matter how high he is in position is prone to be questioned and fail politicaly if he wasn't faithful to the people, and if Iraq was spared the terror from outside, many regimes would've collapsed without the need for a G8 summit to deal with the Arab situations.

Majid Muhammed/Baghdad/Iraq.

The Arab people are incapable of reforming their system for many reasons: -The regimes that maintain firm grips on the power and who will make the same old excuses, "It's not the right time" and that they have more important issues like "liberating Palestine" which has become an excuse for every misery. -The so-called Arab intellectuals and thinkers have ideologies that they refuse to debate and some of them use these to defend and justify the presence of the dictators. -The opposition in most Arab countries is mainly from radical Islamic groups that try to drag us back a thousand years with their blind hatred. -The Arab street is hopeless and deceived and cannot tell right from wrong and seem to agree on one thing and that is hatred for America and wishing her downfall, sympathizing with criminals like Saddam, Bin Ladin, Hamas, Jihad and Hizbullah, therefore there should be a strong pressure from outside and especially from America and Europe on the ME governments to make radical changes and these should be political, economic, social and educational.

Mohammed Al-Khafaji/Babylon/Iraq.

- posted by Omar @ 04:15


TOPICS: War on Terror
KEYWORDS: democracy; iraq; iraqiblog; iraqthemodel; reform; southwestasia

1 posted on 06/14/2004 5:58:57 AM PDT by Valin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Valin

I just read this before seeing your post. Interesting stuff. That is a pretty good blog. The discussion comments are pretty good too.


2 posted on 06/14/2004 6:02:37 AM PDT by NeonKnight
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Valin
Here is the link Iraq the Model
3 posted on 06/14/2004 6:05:06 AM PDT by NeonKnight
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: NeonKnight

Don't tell any of our SerbocrazyFreepers about these voices. To them all Muslims are crazed nazis who must be wiped out.


4 posted on 06/14/2004 6:07:22 AM PDT by Ronly Bonly Jones (truth is truth)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Valin

"Shakeeb-Paestine.

If we cannot make the change by ourselves, then why not let the others help us? Let's put the faked pride aside. It's because of our silence and fear from the change that we went through all of this, we were insulted, tortured and our women were raped by our rulers, those who surpassed everyone in destroying their own people so that the wont be able to face them "He who fears to climb mountains, will live his whole life in holes". Let's allow the others to help us climb the first rock towards the top. "

At least this guy has it right.


5 posted on 06/14/2004 6:10:27 AM PDT by Conspiracy Guy (I will never give up. So don't ask me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Ronly Bonly Jones

Don't tell any of our SerbocrazyFreepers about these voices.

I double dare ya! :-)


6 posted on 06/14/2004 6:13:01 AM PDT by Valin (Hatred is the coward's revenge)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: NeonKnight

Have you discovered
The Religious Policeman
A Saudi man's diary of life in the "Magic Kingdom", where the Religious Police ensure that everything remains as it was in the Middle Ages.
http://muttawa.blogspot.com/


7 posted on 06/14/2004 6:18:14 AM PDT by Valin (Hatred is the coward's revenge)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Valin

Perhaps a doctor visit is in order to explain...good stuff!

"My apology to the Arab world"

(Dr Mike S. Adams Author’s Note: the following editorial contains mildly offensive language. Given the subject matter, the author is sorry that it does not contain highly offensive language.)

Lately, I’ve been hearing a lot about the Iraqi prisoner abuse scandal. The pictures of those “abused” prisoners have been plastered all over the front pages of papers around the country. Some of my conservative friends have interpreted the excessive coverage as proof that papers like the New York Times are actually rooting against America in its current war on terror. Even those who aren’t willing to go that far say that such coverage is helping the enemy to recruit a new generation of terrorists to inflict harm upon our troops.
Despite these views, I have decided to make a formal public apology to the entire Arab world in the aftermath of Abu Ghraib. It is my hope that the following apology will help bring some clarity to the situation and, who knows, maybe even lasting world peace:
Dear Arabs,
I am truly sorry that Americans decided to take up arms and sacrifice their own youth in the defense of Muslims in Bosnia, Kosovo, and the first Gulf War. After we clear up this mess in Iraq, we will refrain from any such activity in the future.
I am truly sorry that I did not hear any of you call for an apology from Muslim extremists after 911. After all, the hijackers were all Arabs.

I am truly sorry that Arabs have to live in squalor under savage dictatorships throughout the Middle East. I am also sorry that the “leaders” of these nations drive their citizens into poverty by keeping all of the wealth in the hands of a select few.
I am also sorry that these governments intentionally breed hate for the U.S. in their religious schools while American schools do the exact opposite.
I am sorry that Yasir Arafat has been kicked out of every Arab country and has attached his name to the Palestinian “cause.” I am also sorry that no other Arab country will offer nearly as much support to Arafat as we offer to them.
I am sorry that the U.S. has continued to serve as the biggest financial supporter of poverty stricken Arab nations while wealthy Arab leaders blame the U.S. for all of their problems.
I am sorry that left-wing media elites would Rather (pun intended) not talk about any of this, thereby perpetuating your anger towards us. It’s probably really bad for your blood pressure. I am also sorry that most of you lack the medical resources to measure your blood pressure. And, of course, I’m sorry that few of you have indoor plumbing. That’s bad for your health, too.
I am sorry that the U.N. cheated so many poor people in Iraq out of their “food for oil” money so they could get rich while the tortured, raped, and poverty-stricken citizens of Iraq suffered under Saddam Hussein.
I am sorry that some Arab governments pay the families of homicide bombers after their children are blown to pieces in pursuit of Arafat’s “cause.”

I am sorry that these homicide bombers have as little regard for babies as the local office of Planned Parenthood.
I am sorry that so many people are unable to differentiate between the gang rape rooms and mass graves of Saddam Hussein on the one hand, and the conditions of Abu Ghraib on the other.

I am sorry that our prison guards do not show the same restraint that Arabs show when their brothers in arms are killed. By the way, you shouldn’t be sorry about that.
I am sorry that foreign trained terrorists are trying to seize control of Iraq and return it to a terrorist state. I am sorry we have not yet dropped at least 100 Daisy cutters on Fallujah in order to stop that effort.
I am also sorry that cleaning up the mess in Iraq is taking so long. It only took Saddam Hussein about 30 years to accomplish all he did in the realm of human rights. Come to think of it, that’s about ten years less than the duration of our War on Poverty in the U.S. Come to think of it, I’m sorry we haven’t sent all of our gang bangers from South Central Los Angeles to Fallujah.
I am sorry that every time the terrorists hide, it just happens to be inside a “Holy Site.”
I am sorry that Muslim extremists have not yet apologized for the U.S.S.
Cole, the embassy bombings, and for flying a plane into the World Trade Center, which collapsed in part on Saint Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church, which is one of our Holy Sites.
I am sorry that we have not taken a portion of the diet of Michael Moore and shipped it to one of your starving villages in the Middle East. You need it Moore (pun intended) than he does.
I am sorry that your only supporters are professors, journalists, and other assorted Leftists who also support homosexuals, bisexuals, transsexuals, partial birth abortion, and everything that you abhor in this world. I am sorry that everyone else in America is against you.
Finally, I am sorry that I am going to have to end this apology by asking you to kiss the right side of my conservative butt. I’m probably just having a bad day.
For that I am truly sorry.
Dr. Mike S. Adams


8 posted on 06/14/2004 6:19:06 AM PDT by BillyCrockett
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Ronly Bonly Jones

just the extremists and terrorists


9 posted on 06/14/2004 7:10:31 AM PDT by Jaded
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Valin

Tell me...how long did it take you to learn Arabic?


10 posted on 06/14/2004 7:15:04 AM PDT by carton253 (Re: The Reagan Presidency: Not bad. Not bad at all.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Valin
I am so impressed. When and where did you learn Arabic? How long did it take? Most of the posters, like you said, "get it". That is very hopeful. Does it take you a long time to translate? Thank you for this valuable information.
11 posted on 06/14/2004 7:33:57 AM PDT by Chgogal (Fellow Democrats, don't be stingy with Freedom and Liberty. Win won for the Gipper!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Conspiracy Guy

That guy was Abu-Amir Al-Abbassi-Samawa/Iraq. Shakeeb posted the stupid post just before that one.


12 posted on 06/14/2004 11:56:09 AM PDT by Excuse_Me
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: Excuse_Me

ooops. Right words. Wrong speaker. Thanks for correcting the boo booo.


13 posted on 06/14/2004 12:01:29 PM PDT by Conspiracy Guy (I will never give up. So don't ask me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson