Your Right to Use Vitamins Is in Jeopardy, Senators Push Regulatory Assault on Vitamins

HUMAN EVENTS ^ | 09.03.03 | Dr. Julian Whitaker

[Know your rights]

The same group of leftists that support everything being a right

There are no such people; leftists want to restrict many rights, such as the right to get rich, the right to bear arms, etc.

(And even if you had correctly identified the views of leftists, guilt by association isn't a valid argument.)

[Dead Corpse]

Because genius, the Webb-Kenyon Act had to do with TRANSPORTING fuel and liquor across State lines. A legitamate Federal concern. The REED Amendment to that act was what criminalized transportation of liqour to Dry Counties. The Prohibition Amendment made possession and usage of liquor ANYWHERE a crime.

If you had read them instead of justing spouting to support your lies, you would have known that.

Same as this "vitamin" crap is trying to do. Same as the Drug War in general. It is hitting tobacco and will soon spread to fast food and anything else deemed "unhealthy".

Little tin-pot dictators like yourself always do this kind of crap.

[discostu]

How is it the left have pushed through abortion? How did they push through getting rid of parental notification for abortion? How did they hammer through gay marriage? Heck it's even the left that added the right not to be offended to the 1st Ammendment. They're all about imaginary rights, that's how they cover getting rid of the real rights, oldest concept in stage magic is to hide the small motion behind the large motion. They make big fusses about your right or this and that to distract people away from their burning of the Bill of Rights.

[Know your rights]

Ah but given that the nutritional suppliment industry has no oversight and you don't know what's in them, they even go so far as to tell the consumer they're not garaunteeing any of the results they promise, there CAN be harm to others in the production or sale of nutritional suppliments.

I don't see any harm to others there.

And if it gets you all woozy and you crash your car into a school bus there's potential for harm to others too.

Good point. I agree that government may legitimately require accurate labelling with regard to such effects.

And in the case of fireworks any level of misuse that results in harm to others is already a crime, so if that's a legitimate reason for the state to ban something say goodbye to your guns and car.

I don't agree that government may legitimately ban the possession of fireworks (or guns and cars); I do agree that it may legitimately limit the use of fireworks, guns, and cars.

[discostu]

Well some state governments ARE banning fireworks outright. And with the same powers they can ban vitamins. It would be just as dumb, but depending on how the state constitution is written it would be just as legitimate.

[Salvation]

The vitamins I take could set the standard for all the other vitamin companies.

If you want more information -- give me a FR mail.

[Know your rights]

leftists want to restrict many rights, such as the right to get rich, the right to bear arms, etc.

They're all about imaginary rights

They're also about restricting real ones.

[Know your rights]

Well some state governments ARE banning fireworks outright. [...] depending on how the state constitution is written it would be just as legitimate.

I'm talking about natural rights, not legal rights.

[tpaine]

bumpkin

[discostu]

How can you not see the harm to others. I'm a "vitamin" manufacturer. My vitamins are actually Altoids, I advertise that they do all kinds of stuff like help you lose weight, fight off colds, and serve women... they're just Altoids. Somebody buys them thinking they'll be healthier, they don't get healthier, they stay obese, get a nasty cold, and their heart gives out because it can't take the added pressure of the lard and the clogged lungs. That's harm to others.

Now in the current world I put a little label on the bottom of the box that says my vitamins have never actually been proven to do the things I claimed and I'm free and clear (really, check out a GNC sometime, look at the bottom of the boxes, almost everything in there is not garaunteed to do anything it said it will). Banning products that have never actually been proven to accomplish anything they're advertising is a legitimate action for the state or local government, but outside the limitation for the Fed as outlined in the Constitution (unless they make an ammendment of course).

[discostu]

And i'm talking about legitimacy of laws which isn't always realted to rights, because not everything is a right and laws limiting things that aren't rights (like vitamin or firework use) have no impact on rights.

[discostu]

Which is what I said. They're making imaginary rights to cover their elimination of real rights. And you can see them moving towards ending age restrictions on rights with their arguments against parental notification, by making abortion none of the parents' business they're taking the first steps to making everything none of the parents' business and thus eliminating age restrictions.

[tpaine]

bumpkin II

[Know your rights]

they stay obese, get a nasty cold, and their heart gives out because it can't take the added pressure of the lard and the clogged lungs. That's harm to others.

Up until now, "others" has meant someone other than the vitamin buyer. I agree that the buyer himself is harmed by producer fraud, and that government is within its legitimate authority to punish fraud.

[Know your rights]

not everything is a right

Every act that doesn't screw up other people's rights and liberties is a right or at least a liberty, and it is morally illegitimate for any government to restrict such acts.

[Know your rights]

Which is what I said. They're making imaginary rights to cover their elimination of real rights.

You referred to "leftists that support everything being a right". There are no such persons.

[discostu]

I'd said there was the potential for harming others by the manufacturer or seller, being as there's a minimum of three parties in every purchase limiting the discussion to just the buyer is artificial. But it's not fraud because they have the disclaimer. This is why there's a potential for legitimate government action by somebody other than the federal government. And eventually there's going to be action at some level because way too many suppliment companies are selling placebos. Unfortunately it's probably going to happen at the federal level because we've so overpowered the fed and depowered the states.

[Know your rights]

Make that: Every act that doesn't screw up other people's rights and liberties (or cause a clear and present danger of screwing up other people's rights and liberties) is a right or at least a liberty, and it is morally illegitimate for any government to restrict such acts by sane adults.

[Know your rights]

there's a minimum of three parties in every purchase limiting the discussion to just the buyer is artificial.

Who's the third party?

But it's not fraud because they have the disclaimer.

The quiet disclaimer doesn't eliminate the loud fraud elsewhere. Governments may not call it fraud, but I do.

[tpaine]

discostu,
---By golly I think you finally got it...

Exceptions to the rule are enumerated restrictions on government power. If it isn't in their mandate, the Constitution, then they cannot pass a law regarding it. Period.
If a Bill of Rights was added to the State's Constitution, or is already forbidden in the Federal Bill of Rights that are to be regarded as Common to ALL US citizens, then those actions are further restricted to all governing entities in that State.

IE; your city council could not ban something that is explicitly spelled out in either the Federal or State Constitutions as being off limits.
Conflicts between enumerated powers, like the commerce clause and the Second Amendment, were to be handled by the USSC on a case by case basis.
At least, that was how the Founders tried to set things up. There has been a lot of "ignoring" going around in regards to governmental actions. If they want to do it, they will find a way to screw the public and still get elected.
183 Dead Corpse

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I had it yesterday, you just finally read what I wrote instead of what you wanted to read.
189 dicostu

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Nope, you finally read what DC was ~really~ writing about, and had to admit he was right.
-- Congrats on your belated honesty.