Posted on 05/28/2004 7:45:07 AM PDT by Theodore R.
I have never been unfaithful to my wife. Have you been unfaithful to your wife.
Who hasn't? Right
I have a cousin that is gay and a good friend from high school. Both are successful and honest people who have been faithful to their partner's for years and years.
Mr. Terry made a vow to God and he like Bill Clinton violated that vow.
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Bumping your post.
However, if they refuse to be saved and changed then you'd rather they die now before they hurt anyone else. Is this also correct?
That's kind of the definition of God's love (and of love the sinner hate the sin). God loves us and wants the best for us but if we refuse to receive it then He will put us into situations where we will be apt to call on Him. (Diseases like AIDS maybe for the 'homosexual'). And unfortunately many times He's forced to remove us before we hurt others. It pains Him to send them to hell but sending one to hell is far better than sending that one and the 100's of others that he led dragged into hell with him.
Hey, you weren't supposed to notice that!
I would. Mr. Terry is completely unrecondite. He expects all and sundry to affirm his moral turpitude as the right thing.
When I was a young jarhead, I was taught that I had to lead my Marines by my example.
I take my marriage seriously. I am a "one life, one wife" kind of guy. I expect those who claim the mantle of leadership in the Christian community to do likewise.
The Christian Right has done far more damage to the Gospel and to conservative politics than they've done good. They passed their culminating point (the Clausewitzian way of saying they "jumped the shark") in the mid-1980s. Now, their specialty is giving scandal to the Gospel and getting the more liberal of two candidates elected out of spite.
My personal desire is that homosexuals will keep their lifestyles as advertised when they argued before the Supreme Court to overturn the sodomy laws -- PRIVATE!
As far as scripture goes, God will send all unreprentant sinners to hell. Homosexuality is a sin. Those who practice it need to repent or face God's judgement.
Personally, I do not "love" the sinner -- as in feel an emotional affection for -- and hate the sin. My emotional response is more one of resentment. I resent the fact that gays want to force everyone else (including BOY SCOUTS for gosh sakes) to approve of their deviant lifestyle through force of government and social pressure. I resent GLSEN for their efforts to pander this crap to school children. I resent LAMBDA Legal for abusing the court system. I have no emotional affection for these people. If they were to change their ways, I would work to forgive them. That's all that's required of me from a scriptural perspective. I stand ready to forgive if they turn from their wicked ways.
That's what I was saying.
I did love my niece -- as in have an emotional affection for -- who was trapped in the gay lifestyle. I loved her long before, and later, in spite of, her deviant lifestyle. I loved her before and in spite of her dishonesty and thievery too. I did not approve of her behavior. She will have to answer to God for that. But I did love her entirely in the human sense. My love for her in the godly sense should have been greater. Maybe then I would have worked harder at helping her out of her destructive lifestyle before it was too late.
...
That's what I was saying.
I understand what you're saying. I feel much the same way. What I was getting at however is that 'love' (as used in this discussion at least) is not a 'feeling'. It is not emotional affection. It is a decision to want the best for someone else. We decide to love the sinner because God commands us to love one another. Sometimes that love requires us to seek their health and sometimes that love (for yet others) requires us to seek their deaths. But we always deep down want the best for them.
I have a brother who is trapped in sodomy. I love him because God commands me to and he is my brother. I hate him because of what he does and what he believes. The two are not exclusive (The exact opposite of love is apathy not hatred)
I agree about walking the talk.
I'm happy to see you've become concerned with Social Conservatism.
I always have been concerned with social conservatism--far more, I daresay, than the loudmouthed self-proclaimed purveyors and guardians of social conservatism.
I do not personally want anyone's death in this matter. I am very sad when they get diseases and die. I know they did it to themselves. But it still grieves me. I know God is just and I trust Him. But I am not happy when it happens.
I agree that God's love is not a feeling. That really was my point too. Godly love is about what you do, not what you feel. In context, however, that is not how the world perceives the statement. From God's perspective, those of us who are fighting against the gay agenda are actually acting more loving toward homosexuals than those who join their cause. Love must sometimes side with what is best for a person, not just what makes the person feel good for the moment. God disciplines the son he delights in, to make him better. His correction of us is a display of His love for us. We do the same for our own children. It is hard to define a greater love than the love of a parent for his child. Yet the most loving parent is the one who gently corrects and instructs his child in ways that are right and good.
This is not untrue of other love relationships. You do not show genuine love by enabling a friend, family member, whomever, to continue in self-destructive ways.
Follow?
With the exception of the above I agreed with everything you said. As I suspected, but wanted to be clear for the lurkers who may be following the conversation, we were discussing and understanding the same issue.
Have a great day and may God Bless you.
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