Posted on 05/27/2004 7:33:19 AM PDT by sathers
Newly uncovered files examined by US military investigators in Baghdad show what is being described as 'a direct link' between Saddam Hussein's elite Fedayeen military unit and the terrorist attacks on America September 11, 2001.
Ahmed Hikmat Shakir, who attended a 2000 Al Qaeda summit in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia where the 9/11 attacks were planned, is listed among the officers on three Fedayeen rosters reviewed by US probers, the Wall Street Journal reported Thursday.
'Our government sources, who have seen the translations of the documents, say Shakir is listed with the rank of Lt. Colonel,' the paper said.
Saddam's Fedayeen has been identified in previous reports as the group that conducted 9/11 style hijack training drills on a parked Boeing 707 airliner at the south Baghdad terrorist camp Salman Pak.
In a post obtained through Saddam's Mukahbarrat intelligence service, Shakir was stationed at the Iraqi embassy in Kuala Lumpur at the time of the 9/11 planning session.
Also in attendance, 9/11 highjackers Khalid al Midhar and Nawaz al Hamzi who piloted American Airlines Filght 77 when it crashed into the Pentagon.
Ramzi al Shibh, the operational planner of the 9/11 attacks, and Tawfiz al Atash, a high ranking Osama bin Laden lieutenant and mastermind of the USS Cole boming, were also at the meeting the Journal said.
(Excerpt) Read more at newsmax.com ...
Saddam never had anything to do with al-Qaeda. CNN said so.
The Link Between Iraq and Al-Qaeda
Going out to buy a copy of today's WSJ now! Somebody ping Hugh!
Hugh Ping!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The more over the top they get,the more ridiculous they become.
YOu seem to have a hard on for Qatar. Are you blaming the government for its free lancing perps? Some of these states have this problem of trying to steer between curbing the perps and not destabilizing themselves. What the play on the ground in Qatar is I don't know. I do know the elite in Kuwait is far more pro American than its citizens, in general.
lets see we have this, CNN reporting on a cache of mustard gas shells, ABC discussing an Iraq/Al Queda link previous to the invasion of Iraq, and the Sarin Gas story. Hmm, is that thunder in the distance? I think the game is afoot and Bush is beinging to show some of his hand.
Yes, he did. I will never bear False Witness against our President by saying otherwise.
What I will say, is that Anti-Terrorism SHOULD have been the center-piece of the Case for War (and I am not "Monday Morning Quarterbacking, I said so well before the bombs started dropping)... not WMD's.
I read the stuff you posted on Sarin Gas and "Magnitude of Threat factored into Likelihood of Deployment = Total Threat Assessment", and sure it makes a cold sort of mathematical sense.
But that said, I still think a better Case woulda been made by saying: "Salman Pak, 30 miles south of Baghdad. Operational terrorist training camp. Mocked-up Boeing Airliner, Five-Man Teams, training in the use of Boxcutters as Hijack Weapons... what more do we need to say?"
as always, jmho
One mistake made by the President on the price of gasoline at the pump means that gas price goes up. Not so bad, and probably a frequent occurence.
One mistake made by the President on WMDs falling into the hands of suicidal terrorists means that an entire crowd at the Rose Bowl might die.
Not very likely, but SO catastrophic that it becomes a CRITICALLY HIGH RISK.
Did you see the connections between Saddam and Al Qaeda?
I agree with you that THAT is the issue. HOWEVER, if you check back through ALL of the President's statements you will discover a common thread. The WMDs were important ONLY because of their being placed in the hands of terrorists.
That Saddam had WMDs was not the problem in isolation. It ALWAYS was tied to the terrorist equation, OP. The media WON'T let you know that, though.
But I just did.
This Saddam/Bin Laden connection via Ahmed Hikmat Shakir was first proposed by Doug Feith, one of the civilians in the Pentagon who was a champion of the now disgraced Chalabi.
I am not saying yey or nay to this story. But I do ask for further confirmation. Like they say back home "fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me"
I agree. No matter what anyone says, I do not think that it is the UN or the USA's business to interfere with any Sovereign Nation's Military procurement programs, taken in isolation. WMD's are not, by themselves, a Justification for War (if they were, we'd bomb France.... or even Israel).
It ALWAYS was tied to the terrorist equation, OP. The media WON'T let you know that, though.
"The media WON'T let you know that, though".
This is not entirely the Media's fault, xzins.
I'm not disputing the Iraqi training of terrorists (which is Fact), nor the Threat of Sarin Gas. I'm saying the Case was poorly made.
As a Debater, I would not try to construct a Disadvantage Argument by jumping straight to the Hypothetical Impact, without firmly establishing the Link, Brink (or Threshold), and Uniqueness.
Salman Pak was the Link, Salman Pak was Unique to Hussein's Regime, and the Brink was already in place with Iraqi connections to the 1993 WTC bombing (i.e., the Brink was already in operation).
I.E., to construct a persuasive, watertight Argument -- Salman Pak should have led the Case. (besides the fact that, as 9/11 demonstrated, Salman-Pak-style terrorism has a pretty big Implicit Impact of its own -- independent of any WMD's.)
As an Argument: It should have, it could have, it was morally justifiable -- and it (largely) was not employed until After the Fact (which is too late, PR-wise).
Selling an Iraq-al Qaeda connection
Some critics blame TV news for making Baghdad new enemy
From Bruce Morton
CNN
Tuesday, March 11, 2003 Posted: 10:17 AM EST (1517 GMT)
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/11/Iraq.Qaeda.link/index.html
Iraqi President Saddam Hussein meets with military officers this month.
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Does Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein provide assistance to Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda? It's a case the Bush administration has tried hard to make.
"These al Qaeda affiliates, based in Baghdad, now coordinate the movement of people, money and supplies into and throughout Iraq for his network, and they've been operating freely in the capital for more than eight months," said U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell in his presentation last month to the U.N. Security Council.
SEPTEMBER 11 and IRAQ
NEW YORK SUN ^ | 11 March 2003 | New York Sun Editorial
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/863053/posts
Posted on 03/12/2003 10:02:48 AM PST by ganeshpuri89
EDITORIALS & OPINION
September 11 and Iraq
The supposedly tenuous nature of the connection between Saddam Hussein and the September 11, 2001, attacks on America has become a linchpin in the argument of those opposing war in Iraq. “American efforts to tie Iraq to the 9/11 terrorist attacks have been unconvincing,” President Carter wrote in Sunday’s New York Times. “Despite endless efforts by the Bush administration to connect Iraq to Sept. 11, the evidence simply isn’t there,” a staff editorial in Sunday’s Times said. “The administration has demonstrated that Iraq had members of Al Qaeda living within its borders, but that same accusation could be lodged against any number of American allies in the region.”
These claims are disingenuous. Virtually everyone acknowledges that the September 11 attacks were carried out by a network headed by Osama bin Laden. The question, then, is the nature of the relationship between Iraq and Mr. bin Laden.
Here’s what the director of central intelligence, George Tenet, said in testimony to the Senate Intelligence Committee on February 11: “Iraq is harboring senior members of a terrorist network led by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, a close associate of Osama bin Laden. We know Zarqawi’s network was behind the poison plots in Europe that I discussed earlier as well as the assassination of a U.S. State Department employee in Jordan. Iraq has in the past provided training in document forgery and bomb-making to Al Qaeda. It also provided training in poisons and gasses to two Al Qaeda associates; one of these associates characterized the relationship he forged with Iraqi officials as successful. Mr. Chairman, this information is based on a solid foundation of intelligence. It comes to us from credible and reliable sources. Much of it is corroborated by multiple sources. And it is consistent with the pattern of denial and deception exhibited by Saddam Hussein over the past 12 years.”
Providing “training in document forgery and bomb-making” is a far cry from merely having terrorists who happen to live within a country’s borders.
On top of the Tenet testimony to Iraq’s Al Qaeda links, we have the matter of the April 2001 meeting in Prague between a leader of the September 11 attacks, hijacker Mohammed Atta, and an Iraqi government official, Ahmad Khalil Ibrahim Samir al-Ani, who was expelled from the Czech Republic later in April. The latest of the Czech officials directly involved to comment was the Czech ambassador to the United Nations, Hynek Kmonicek. Reports Edward Jay Epstein, “The last statement to date was made on October 26th, 2002, by Ambassador Kmonicek, who was deputy Foreign Minister at the time and served the expulsion notice on al-Ani. He flatly told the Prague Post that ‘the meeting took place’ and that ‘the Czech government collected detailed evidence of the al-Ani/Atta meeting.’”
In addition, there are the reports — in the New York Times, in Aviation Week, and in the New Republic — of the Iraqi government training camp at Salman Pak, where Islamic militants were trained in hijacking around a Boeing 707.
The relevant congressional resolution here is the one passed September 14, 2001, by a vote of 98 to 0 in the Senate and a vote of 420 to 1 in the House of Representatives. It said “the president is authorized to use all necessary and appropriate force against those nations, organizations, or persons he determines planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored such organizations or persons, in order to prevent any future attacks of international terrorism against the United States by such nations, organizations or persons.”
Note the words aided and harbored.
There would be a logic to this war even if there weren’t links between Iraq and the September 11 terrorists, just as there was for a preemptive strike against Al Qaeda before September 11 — in other words, before there were any September 11 terrorists. Still, there’s a lot more evidence here than commonly thought, and one can only wonder at the motives of those who would belittle, ignore, or deny it.
"Salman Pak, Boeing" Googled returned this from Newsmax:
CIA's Woolsey Tells Court: Iraq Involved in 9/11
OP, below is simply another of dozens of articles that I have saved. This one, as the other two, shows the administration went out of its way to make the case. The media and the anti-America crowd had a tandem....the one refused to inform the public, and the other pooh-poohed any connection that the administration tried to make.
You SHOULD remember this case. It is when the Federal Government THROUGH the court system proved the Iraqi Bin Laden Connection. Woolsey testimony was telling. The court found that Iraq and Bin Laden were connected an ordered restitution to the victims.
SALMAN PAK is a prominent point made by WOOLSEY --- PRE-WAR!
CIA's Woolsey Tells Court: Iraq Involved in 9/11
NewsMax.com ^ | 3/07/03 | Carl Limbacher and NewsMax.com Staff
Posted on 03/07/2003 11:05:42 AM PST by kattracks
Former CIA Director James Woolsey offered bombshell testimony this week in a lawsuit brought by the families of World Trade Center victims that implicates Saddam Hussein in the 9/11 attacks.
The one-time Clinton administration intelligence chief described what he said was a conspiracy between al Qaeda and Baghdad. As evidence he offered accounts from Iraqi defectors who have described a Boeing 707 jet parked on the ground at the terrorist training camp Salman Pak. The plane, the eyewitnesses insist, was used as a hijacking school prior to 9/11.
Since 1995 Saddam's most elite terror operatives had allegedly used Salman Pak to train al Qaeda recruits to overcome U.S. flight crews using methods employed on 9/11, according to London's Observer newspaper. In Nov. 2001, dozens of other reports, including several in the New York Times, covered news of Saddam's Salman Pak hijacking school based on the defectors' accounts.
"I believe it is definitely more likely than not that some degree of common knowledge between (al Qaeda and Iraq) was involved here," Woolsey told a Manhattan Federal Court on Monday, according to the New York Daily News.
He compared the relationship between Baghdad and Osama bin Laden's terror network to two Mafia families "who hate each other, kill each other from time to time but are still capable of working together against a common enemy," according to testimony quoted by the Associated Press.
At the very least, Saddam Hussein is guilty of aiding and abetting the activities of al-Qaeda, Woolsey contended.
He also offered evidence suggesting that Baghdad had prior knowledge of the 9/11 attacks.
A July 21, 2001 article in an Egyptian newspaper article headlined, "America, an Obsession with Osama bin Laden" indicated that Baghdad knew what was coming three months later, the former U.S. intelligence chief told the court. The report, written by an Iraqi, predicted bin Laden would target both New York City and the Pentagon.
Woolsey noted a line in the story that predicted bin Laden would "strike America on the arm that is already hurting," explaining that the phrase was likely a reference to the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center.
No Iraqi journalist would write such a report without his government's knowledge and approval, Woolsey testified.
Read more on this subject in related Hot Topics:
That was considered and rejected. In retrospect it was a tactical political error. You might recall that everyone thought Saddam had chemical weapons and would use them against us in the war.
Unfortunately we may not find a stockpile before the election. Unless we do, in which case it's too bad for the democrats, particularly if they're in another country.
This article is extremely telling, OP.
It was written right as GWBush assumed office in January of 2001.....BEFORE 9/11, of course.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/924587/posts?page=4#4
Iraq Resumes WMD Activities, New York Times Reports
Monday, January 22, 2001
Press reports that Iraq has rebuilt chemical and biological weapons plants bombed by the United States in late 1998 present newly-inaugurated President George W. Bush with a serious non-proliferation challenge. A New York Times report that Iraq has rebuilt chemical and biological weapons-capable plants at Falluja demonstrates the continued threat posed to regional stability by Saddam Hussein.
A recently released Department of Defense report "Proliferation: Threat and Response: 2001" stated that Iraq "may have begun program reconstitution" of its chemical and biological weapons capabilities. The news story focuses on alleged development of these weapons at Falluja, an industrial complex west of Baghdad, and specifically mentions production of chlorine and ricin. Chlorine is a dual-use chemical that, if weaponized, is a choking agent that destroys lung tissue. Ricin is a protein toxin produced from castor beans (ricin constitutes approximately 5% of the waste from castor oil production) that causes a variety of symptoms culminating in circulatory and respiratory failure in victims.
The reports and allegations highlight the fact that Iraq continues to block U.N. inspections of its weapons of mass destruction (WMD) programs, as required by the Gulf War cease-fire. Created by the U.N. Security Council in the aftermath of Iraq's defeat, the U.N. Special Commission on Iraq (UNSCOM) inspected and dismantled much of Iraq's infrastructure for building WMD. However, its activities took place against a background of increasing Iraqi hostility towards the inspections that culminated with UNSCOM being kicked out of Iraq in December 1998.
In December 1999 the Security Council voted to establish a new U.N. presence in Iraq, the United Nations Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission (UNMOVIC). By September 2000 UNMOVIC, led by former International Atomic Energy Agency Director Hans Blix, was assembled and prepared to begin inspections. Iraq continues to prevent any inspectors from entering the country, and insists that it has disarmed to the extent called for by U.N. resolutions. With the will of the Security Council to continue sanctions and inspections wavering, UNMOVIC remains in limbo.
In his inaugural address, Bush pledged to do more to confront the threat posed by weapons of mass destruction. Bush's foreign policy advisors have stated both publicly and privately that they wish to shore up flagging international support for economic sanctions on Iraq. Even as the Bush administration forms its Iraq policy, U.S. and British fighters remain on patrol in the no-fly zone, periodically drawing the fire of Iraqi air defense installations as the battle of wills between Washington and Baghdad continues.
~~~
Iraq Rebuilt Weapons Factories, Officials Say
Source: New York Times
Published: 1/22/01
By STEVEN LEE MYERS and ERIC SCHMITT
ASHINGTON, Jan. 21 — Iraq has rebuilt a series of factories that the United States has long suspected of producing chemical and biological weapons, according to senior government officials. The new intelligence estimate could confront President Bush with an early test of his pledge to take a tougher stance against President Saddam Hussein than the Clinton administration did.
The factories — in an industrial complex in Falluja, west of Baghdad — include two that were bombed and badly damaged by American and British air raids in December 1998 to punish Mr. Hussein for his refusal to cooperate with United Nations weapons inspectors, the government officials said.
The new intelligence estimates were mentioned, but without any such specific details, in a report on weapons threats released on Jan. 10 by the outgoing secretary of defense, William S. Cohen. It warned that Iraq had rebuilt at least its weapons infrastructure and may have begun covertly producing some chemical or biological agents.
Last week, the officials provided details on what they said was the reconstruction of the two factories, and the resumption of the production of chlorine at a third in the same complex.
The factories have ostensibly commercial purposes, but all three were previously involved in producing chemical or biological agents and were among those closely monitored by the United Nations inspectors, the officials said. One of the rebuilt factories, for example, is making castor oil used in brake fluid, the Iraqis say, but the mash from castor beans contains a deadly biological toxin called ricin, the officials said.
~~~~
While officials have previously disclosed that Iraq had rebuilt missile plants destroyed in the 1998 strikes, the Jan. 10 report released by Mr. Cohen was the first public acknowledgment of the resumption of work at suspected chemical and biological plants.
"Some of Iraq's facilities could be converted fairly quickly to production of chemical weapons," the report said at one point. It went on to warn, "Iraq retains the expertise, once a decision is made, to resume chemical agent production within a few weeks or months, depending on the type of agent."
Following article says: (1) "The Bush administration cited links between al-Qaeda and Saddam Hussein's Baath party regime as justification for attacking Iraq to oust Saddam. The administration also insisted Saddam had chemical and biological weapons and was pursuing nuclear weapons."
(2)"The report quoted the unnamed prisoner as saying al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden turned to Iraq after concluding his group could not produce chemical or biological weapons on its own in Afghanistan.
"Iraq agreed to provide chemical and biological weapons training for two al-Qaeda associates starting in December 2000," the report said."
Al-Qaeda chief told us Iraq supplied WMD material: US
SMH.COM.AU ^ | August 9, 2003
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/960971/posts
Posted on 08/09/2003 2:35:24 AM PDT by Aeronaut
August 9, 2003
A high-ranking al-Qaeda operative in custody disclosed that Iraq supplied the Islamist militant group with material to build chemical and biological weapons, the White House said today.
"A senior al-Qaeda terrorist, now detained, who had been responsible for al-Qaeda training camps in Afghanistan, reports that al-Qaeda was intent on obtaining (weapons of mass destruction) assistance from Iraq," the White House said in a report.
The 25 page document was released as US President George W Bush holidayed at his Texas ranch.
The Bush administration cited links between al-Qaeda and Saddam Hussein's Baath party regime as justification for attacking Iraq to oust Saddam. The administration also insisted Saddam had chemical and biological weapons and was pursuing nuclear weapons.
The report quoted the unnamed prisoner as saying al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden turned to Iraq after concluding his group could not produce chemical or biological weapons on its own in Afghanistan.
"Iraq agreed to provide chemical and biological weapons training for two al-Qaeda associates starting in December 2000," the report said.
"Senior al-Qaeda associate Abu Musab al-Zarqawi came to Baghdad in May 2002 for medical treatment, along with approximately two dozen al-Qaeda terrorist associates.
"This group stayed in Baghdad and other parts of Iraq and plotted terrorist attacks around the world."
The report, quoting the State Department, also says the fallen regime of Saddam Hussein "provided material assistance to Palestinian terrorist groups, including the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine-General Command, Hamas and the Palestine Islamic Jihad".
The Saddam regime, says the report, "posed a threat to the security of the United States and the world. With the removal of Saddam Hussein's regime, a leader who pursued, used and possessed weapons of mass destruction is no longer in power."
Since May 1, when Bush declared the combat in Iraq effectively over, occupation forces have found no conclusive evidence of Baghdad's banned weapons programs in spite of intensive searches.
This article has Condoleeza Rice making the case a YEAR BEFORE we occupied Iraq.
Rice: Iraq Providing Shelter, Chemical Weapons Help to Al Qaeda
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,64110,00.html
Thursday, September 26, 2002
WASHINGTON — President Bush's national security adviser has alleged a connection between Iraqi President Saddam Hussein and terror master Usama bin Laden that many had thought impossible to back up.
And Condoleezza Rice also insisted she could back up her assertion with proof.
Rice on Wednesday accused Saddam's regime of sheltering members of the Al Qaeda terrorist network in Baghdad and helping bin Laden's operatives in developing chemical weapons.
Rice's comments -- by far the strongest statements yet from the U.S. government alleging Al Qaeda contacts with the Iraqi government -- were aired Wednesday on PBS' The NewsHour with Jim Lehrer.
Her accusations came as the Bush administration continues to make its case to a skeptical world that Saddam should be removed from power, by force if necessary. The charges also came as the White House sought to fend off accusations from Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle that Bush was playing politics with the debate over war in Iraq.
"We clearly know that there were in the past and have been contacts between senior Iraqi officials and members of Al Qaeda going back for actually quite a long time," Rice said. "We know too that several of the [Al Qaeda] detainees, in particular some high-ranking detainees, have said that Iraq provided some training to Al Qaeda in chemical weapons development."
Previously, the widely held view has been that while Saddam and bin Laden both oppose the United States, their motivations are too different for them to work together. Saddam seeks secular power; bin Laden's drive comes from religious motivations and his opposition to the U.S. military presence in Saudi Arabia and the Arab world.
But Rice said, "There clearly are contacts between Al Qaeda and Iraq that can be documented; there clearly is testimony that some of the contacts have been important contacts and that there's a relationship here."
She suggested that details of the contacts will be released later.
Previously, U.S. intelligence officials have said that some Al Qaeda members have been detected in Iraq, but that they appeared to simply be crossing the country after fleeing Afghanistan for their native countries on the Arabian peninsula or in North Africa. U.S. intelligence has also received information that some Al Qaeda leaders are hiding in Iran, and the U.S. government is looking into reports that Al Qaeda operatives are conducting training just over the Iranian border from Afghanistan.
Rice said that much of the information is coming from Al Qaeda operatives captured since the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon. This includes several senior leaders whom the U.S. alleges organized terrorist attacks.
"No one is trying to make an argument at this point that Saddam Hussein somehow had operational control of what happened on Sept. 11, so we don't want to push this too far, but this is a story that is unfolding, and it is getting clearer, and we're learning more," Rice said.
"And there are some Al Qaeda personnel who found refuge in Baghdad," Rice said.
Earlier in the day, Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld made a vague reference to Iraq-Al Qaeda links during a NATO meeting in Warsaw, Poland, but didn't offer details.
Administration officials, speaking on the condition of anonymity, said Rice's disclosure was significant because it marked the first time that the White House claimed that Al Qaeda operated in Saddam-controlled Baghdad. It was an effort to counter suggestions that Al Qaeda operatives were solely in the Kurdish area of northern Iraq, which he doesn't control. The disclosure is part of an effort to strengthen the case against Saddam, the officials said.
Previously, it's been known that Ansar al-Islam, an Islamic extremist group in northern Iraq, sent about a dozen of its members to bin Laden's camps. The group is largely composed of ethnic Kurds and had experimented with biological weapons, U.S. officials have said. But any links to Saddam's government were dubious.
Bin Laden has sought chemical, biological and nuclear weapons for a decade, U.S. intelligence officials have said. His followers are believed to have experimented with rudimentary chemical and biological weapons, but they lacked the sophistication to use them in a way that would kill large numbers of people.
Saddam's military used chemical weapons against Iran in the 1980s and on rebelling Iraqi Kurds. He has also researched biological and nuclear weapons -- previously, the key complaint of the Bush administration against Saddam.
Saddam's government denies having any of these weapons.
After Sept. 11, officials in the Czech Republic said that chief hijacker Mohamed Atta had met with an Iraqi intelligence agent in Prague, which some viewed as a link between Iraq and the attacks. But U.S. officials have since said they doubt the meeting took place.
The Iraqi government has been linked to other groups labeled terrorist by the United States -- primarily those that oppose Iran and Israel.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
I guess they expect us to believe Saddam build shells pre '91, then stopped because he & Blix told he stopped. No way he spent any time after Gulf War #1 improving his delivery ability, or making more Sarin.
To me the most worrisome part of the story is how old the Sarin shell was. To the media, it is reason for comfort. Go figure.
and we've know this news flash here for how long, a year
Actually, that type of artillery binary shell with sarin capability wasn't found out until 1995. They had never been claimed before by Iraq, and were in fact NEVER claimed by Iraq.
We are asked to believe that Saddam destroyed as part of the 1991 agreement, capabilities that had not yet been found out. After they were found out, Iraq never admitted them.
Does that sound like a pre-1991 shell to you?
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