Posted on 05/17/2004 7:06:39 AM PDT by qam1
Thus you explain why it's a funny bumper sticker. Thank you.
You need to hide your agenda a little better. I lost count, how many times have you posted that? 4? or was it 5?
Oh... so you mean missing the opportunity to tell them the good news. Okay... sorry if I missunderstood you.
Pardon me if that seems a tad far fetched. Particularly since I have posted it several times.
So, maybe I misunderstood you. Maybe you can clarify, why do we bother to spread the good news since it doesn't matter? I must have missed your explanation.
Much of what I see in NYC is church-as-religion-themed-social-club.
No. Remember that the members of the upper class in this country (and this means those who live on inherited wealth, not those who have become rich through work) are primariliy educated in the elite preparatory schools and the ivy league and certain select liberal arts colleges (Amherst, Williams, Bowdoin, Swarthmore, Carlton, Davidson, Washington & Lee, etc), almost all of which (with the exception of W&L) are very, very liberal, fully-indoctrinating houses of political correctness. Hence, the rising generation of the upper class is overwhelmingly very liberal. Even the currently adult generation is generally liberal, given the liberalism, and liberal Episcopal Christianity with which they were raised. Most young professionals of the upper classes (for they typically work until they come into their inheritences in their 20's-40's) are not churched at all. They turn to the churches they grew up in when it comes time to marry (Oh, Muffy, of course we'll be married in Christ Church, but do you want the reception at the Field Club, Greenwich Country Club, or at Indian Harbor Yacht Club...) and become active as they have children and have a vague pull towards giving them an appropriate culturally Christian environment with other appropriately culturally Christian children in Sunday School and the St. Cecelia's Choir.....
You know.. it doesn't matter salvation wise if you or I do anything or not. If you and I don't tell those that God wants to save, then He'll raise up someone else who will. And I think he already knows if you and I are gonna do it or not. But what does matter is how our obedience or disobedience it effects our relationship with God. We are "called" to spread the good news. We are commanded to do it. If we aren't then we are not doing what God wants us to do.
The question becomes are we really called to make the church look like the rest of the world while we do it? I don't think we are. And really, I can't find any scripture that teaches us that we are. I can find scripture about being separated from the world, and about the world hating us.... etc. But I can't find any that says, dress like, act like, look like, be cool like the world... and then they'll be willing to listen to your message about being set apart from the world.
See my #104.
I saw the tv reports about the "Jesus is my homeboy" t-shirts, but must confess that I have no idea what that's aupposed to mean. (Is it a gang reference?) Guess I'm just too far removed from the cutting edge or something...it does not sound complimentary to the Lord, I will say that.
LOL! You just described one of my college friends precisely!
"Homeboy", as I've always know it, was a gang-term for someone who lived in your neighborhood and was a good friend. It's a bit of a retro term now, and hasn't been a "cool" term since the early 90's.
Hey I am glad someone else asked what it means also. So what does Jesus is my homeboy mean?
The question becomes, is that what we are doing when we evangelize in this way? I think not.
He'll raise up someone else who will.
Why? He doesn't need anyone to do it. Those in hell belong there and those saved are saved by your reckoning. Funny how he asked you to do something so useless.
But I can't find any that says, dress like, act like, look like, be cool like the world..
Another strawman, unless you can find someone here who has said that.
Ya know, in your church I'll bet most people dress pretty much the same. I think you should dress like a hippy for church so you can be different from them. It's basically what you are asking others to do.
Go ahead, set yourself apart. Maybe if you wear a clown hat and a hula skirt you will have a beter impact because you will be different that EVERYONE. That'll get 'em.
On the other hand, don't bother at all, it doesn't matter.
That reminds me of the joke circulating in the 1950s:
A priest is holding two scruffy beatniks by the scruff of the neck as he's tossing them out of the church.
"I don't mind you calling the priests 'Daddy-0'"
"And, I don't mind you calling the sisters 'Sis'"
"But, when it comes to calling Jesus Christ and the Twelve Apostles 'JC and the Boys......."
I'm not saying that we should intentionally make it difficult to hear the message. But I am saying that we are to be our changed selves. We're to go about our lives telling others about Christ. And that I don't think it's really our calling to try and mold ourselves to fit the "acceptance level" of others around us... for the sake of their hearing.
"Homeboy" means someone from your nieghborhood, someone you trust, someone you know.
As in, "I know Christ".
But it's really bad to say that because it's not exactly the words someone else thinks you should use.
So, again, are you offended if a Peruvian church looks like the culture of Peru?
Or if an Alaskan church looks like the culture of Alaska?
So why wouldn't an American church have in it things that look like American culture?
But the bible teaches that what I have told you is accurate. If you and I don't do what God has commanded, he will raise up someone who will. The old testament is filled with examples of this. You can start with Moses and Joshua.
Believe me, I know the breed from long familiarity. They're not much different in San Francisco, New York, Philadephia, or Boston. Only the name of the churches and the clubs change. You know these people, they're in the Book, and over the summer you need your Diliatory Domiciles supplement to find them. If they're married, and he his parents werent in the Book, she'll be listed under another heading, but that would be telling....
I can remember, not so very many years ago, when law firms determined who they would interview at law schools by checking the Book, and there was a time, back before the Books were unified nationally, that simply being hired at certain law firms would get you into the book.
American culture says taking the lord's name in vain is okay. You can just watch television one night and count the number of times. American culture says sex outside of marriage is fine, and is practiced by millions. Should our churches model this too?
I don't think it's fair or accurate to say that churches should reflect the culture of the country they are in.
This has become disingenious IMO. I have made my point. You have made yours. I reject yours. You seeming reject mine.
Good luck with the getting the message out. But after all, it doesn't matter. You are on a useless mission. It has all been decided and you are just doing busy work. They don't need to know because they are already doomed or saved.
Carry on.
Thanks for the explanation.
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