Independent Developer Releases Win98 SE Service Pack

Information Week Security Pipeline (via Slashdot) ^ | April 27, 2004 | unk

[pctech]

Come on guys, is this for real???

[Paladin2]

I'd look into getting a new or used hard drive. Then you could install the alternative hard drive and try loading Win98SE or whatever. That way if any doesn't work it's really easy to go back to the other way (reinstall the "old" disk drive).

As an alternative if the hard drive is big, it could be repartitioned, a boot manager installed and you could dual boot to Win98 & XP.

We now have a laptop at work that has both W2k and XPPro in the same partition. XP was loaded on a partition that had W2k, but had a non working MBR on the drive. Seems to work, strangely enough.

[Bloody Sam Roberts]

Also if you have XP Pro, you might have a problem formatting the hard drive because of different FAT partions. Win98 runs Fat16or 32(easy to format) and XP Pro is NTFS.I have found that harder to format.

Do a Google on "delpart.exe". This little utility will simply delete ANY partition. Then you can use fdisk as normal and then format as normal. It is only 124k in size, comes from Microsoft and has saved my bacon when trying to clean off several NT 4.0 formatted drives.

Add it to your favorite boot disk and stop fretting.

[SeeRushToldU_So]

I knew someone would point to a trick, I have been using the manufacture of the hard drives utilities to low level format hard drives formatted NTFS partions.

[jimt]

DOS runs REALLY fast on a relatively current computer.

Indeed it does. In fact it does on any Pentium.

I triple boot DOS 6.2, Win 95 and NT on my laptop - DOS for speed and assembly language experimentation, 95 because it was the OS the computer came with, and NT because certain software requires it. Each runs in its own partition, with an extended partition containing FAT 16, FAT 32 and NTFS areas so each OS has additional area to work with.

Back to your comment - have have a second computer at work, a 200mhz pentium, running DOS for data crunching. It's nothing short of incredible how fast a DOS program (running interpreted !) can zip through thousands of complex records. Currently I'm using it to analyze 19,000 work order records for actual performance versus estimates with a fairly complex set of rules.

The older OS's were designed for systems that had MUCH less resources than is commonplace today. Consequently they offer much higher performance for certain tasks.

[Paladin2]

There are utilities on the 'net that allow one to do saving and replacement of disk MBRs or disk editors that allow one to directly inspect and edit disk MBRs.

Look for "Power Quest utilities 'head.zip'" and "hard disk editors - free".

[Paladin2]

Dos was designed for stand alone computers where the owner of the computer could completely control access. Direct software control of hardware is obviously the fastest way to go.

Higher level software and OS's are easier to write & maintain and better to use in networks for security of access, but with a significant performance hit. Now that used computers can be obtained very inexpensively, tasks that can run independently of a network or on a small isolated network can be quite economically accommodated and quickly executed using "old" software.

[Eala]

Knoppix loads and works great on ~1 yr old laptops at work, but has issues on some of the older machines at home (that in all fairness have some uncommon hardware)

Interesting. I had an issue with Knoppix incorrectly identifying my monitor from my Linux machine (easily worked around), but it worked just fine from my old P300 Win machine. (I'm running Knoppix now.)

[Bloody Sam Roberts]

I was about to resort to that one time when trying to root out NT 4.0 that I had no login or password for. I decided first to go to my favorite PC help forum (www.computing.net) and search on "deleting logical partitions" and lo and behold, someone recommended delpart.exe. I downloaded it and it worked like a charm. I've used it many times since and it just tickles me to death how easy the whole process of renovating a hard drive is now.

[Thoro]

Thanks for representing the obnoxious viewpoint. Microsoft has enough money floating and shouldn't begrudge people trying to get by with their older operating systems. While they should reward those people's loyalty with support they choose to punish them by cutting them off if they don't cough up more cash for operating systems their computers may not be up to handling. Therefore Microsoft puts more machines into landfills before their time.

That's part of what bothers me, the waste. I have a pile of perfectly fine 486's of all mhzs sitting on a junk shelf. Although I still have this dream about taking one of them, popping it into a self-built arcade cabinet, and having it run an old copy of MAME exclusively...if only I had the time....one day....

[NewRomeTacitus]

That sounds pretty cool. I found a program called "Console Classix" that lets you play all of the Atari and NES stuff for free, later platforms for a modest subscription fee.

http://www.consoleclassix.com/

And here's a source for the game manuals:

http://www.planetnintendo.com/thewarpzone/manuals.html

[Paladin2]

I still have 3 486's in useful service.

A 66MHZ is at my dad's house networked to a much more modern machine to do backups of his files onto an internal hard drive. Another 66Mhz serves audio files within the house. A third (133MHz) is used for messing with hard drives up to 32 GB using some front access, slide in drive trays and for backup of important files from the other machines in the house.

[xrp]

I hope this fellow's solution extends the service life of 98 for the sake of the people who can't easily afford upgrading.

You gotta be freaking kidding me. You can't afford ~$100-$200 every 2-3 years for an OS upgrade? What's your return on investment for having that easy to use Microsoft OS? Think of everything that you had to go out of your way in life prior to Microsoft helped propel the Internet revolution that began with Windows 95.

Travel arrangements
Research
Entertainment
Shopping
Leisure web browsing
Comparison shopping
Free Republic
Etc

Also keep in mind that in order to do about 90% of the 'fun' stuff on the Internet (various web browsing, email, etc) you can still be running Windows 95.

[Petronski]

You can't afford ~$100-$200 every 2-3 years for an OS upgrade?

Does that estimate include hardware upgrades needed to run the new OS?

[xrp]

MS has basically washed it's hands of the OS at this point.

So? MS supported Windows 98 for 5 years (with extended, paid support still available). This is longer than many people own a car.

[xrp]

I have a pile of perfectly fine 486's of all mhzs sitting on a junk shelf.

You should put those up on eBay. 486s make great OpenBSD firewalls.

[xrp]

Does that estimate include hardware upgrades needed to run the new OS?

No, Microsoft really isn't in the hardware business (couple of exceptions, Xbox, etc).

[Petronski]

That's not the point. You implied that a user should be able to afford 100 to 200 dollars for an upgrade, but that's just the cost of the software: new hardware is almost always needed to run a new OS, no matter who sells it.

[xrp]

That's not the point. You implied that a user should be able to afford 100 to 200 dollars for an upgrade, but that's just the cost of the software: new hardware is almost always needed to run a new OS, no matter who sells it.

Workarounds:

Stick with the older OS. It'll still do a majority of what the end-user wants to do. Microsoft doesn't go into anyone's house with a gun in the end-user's face forcing him/her to upgrade OS.

Go with a Linux distribution, which ironically, requires hardware upgrades if you wish to use the latest kernels with XWindows and other associated services and applications otherwise there will be a very noticeable degradation of performance.

Pony up the $500 or less it costs to get a new hardware platform that will run the latest operating system. Dell offers decent systems that run Windows XP and are high end Pentium IV processors for less than $500!

Again, using a car comparison, many people don't think twice about getting 24-36 month leases on cars @ $300/month. 2 months worth of car lease = a new computer. If you ask me, a computer is far more valuable than a car, nowadays. The RoI on a new PC is absolutely incredible, especially @ PC < $500. Basically it boils down to a person's priorities and how much he/she wants to complain about big, bad, evil Microsoft.

[meatloaf]

I never saw that as a problem. I finally moved off Win 3.11. about six months ago. I never felt the need to pay to play Microsoft's game every time they decided to release another OS.