Howitzers Are Leaving Slopes for Tour of Duty

The Washington Post ^ | May 2, 2004 | Rene Sanchez

[neverdem]

Even at ski resorts, wartime brings hardship.

On the slopes of Mammoth Mountain and Alpine Meadows, high along California's Sierra Nevada range, resort operators have grown accustomed to using five leased Army howitzers to blast loose dangerous drifts of snow packed high on mountainsides.

"They work really well for avalanche control work," said Pam Murphy, senior vice president for Mammoth Mountain ski resort.

But the military wants the big guns back. It needs them for troops fighting in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Army officials came knocking for the artillery cannons a few days ago, saying they had no choice but to break their deal with the ski resorts because the weapons, once surplus stock, now have to be hastily spruced up and shipped out to the front lines overseas.

[neverdem]

What the h*ll, have that many cannons been demilitarized, sold, converted to inert PGMs or melted?

[Squantos]

When I first saw this last week my initial response was it was all BS !

Did a little research with some folks still in the arena and Uncle Sugar does indeed need em back and fast....amazing.

Stay Safe !

[neverdem]

This howitzer leased to a resort near Tahoe City, Calif., is used to dislodge snow overhangs. (Rachael Woods -- Alpine Meadows Via AP)

[going hot]

There was a time we had boucoup of them. Surely we do not have that many in theatre, whereby we must go to ski resorts to take back those on loan?

[datura]

Why is it then that the MLRS units are still stateside?

[Squantos]

I think the need is possibly based on the ability to airlift to very high altitudes w/ ammo and troops. Small howitzers are bling bling in Afghanistan right now.

Stay Safe !

[neverdem]

Why is it then that the MLRS units are still stateside?

Maybe their sub-munitions disperse over too big an area, or maybe their sub-munitions don't detonate instantly as desired, or they are too big for the job. I don't know.

[going hot]

That would certainly be a good use to put them to. Sort of like mountaintop to mountaintop sniping. I like it!!

My curiosity was regards what did the army do with the many we had? Surely we did not run out of them, or did we in fact demil them and otherwise sell them for scrap?

[Squantos]

Dunno........If ya find out more please ping me !

Stay Safe !

[going hot]

did a quick scope. Seems this particular model of howitzer, the M119-A is the newest model, and improvemnt over the 105. It looks somewhat lighter. Perhaps to get further up the mountain with a sling load of shells and a crew to serve it all in one flight. Maybe they did not make as many of the newer model? Will keep scoping.

[Sender]

Maybe there are some dangerous snow overhangs in Afghanistan that need dislodging? Safety first, I always say.

[Atlas Sneezed]

Any guess as to what kind of shell they use for avalanche duty?

[neverdem]

Any guess as to what kind of shell they use for avalanche duty?

It appears to be the latest model to fire 105mm ammo, but it's been almost 25 years since I was in a similar unit, and the picture isn't the best.

[neverdem]

Any guess as to what kind of shell they use for avalanche duty?

IIRC, they have also used 75mm howitzers, which could be packed and hauled by mules in WW II, and 106mm recoilless rifles for avalanche duty. I don't know about the 106mm, but the last that I heard was that we still keep 90mm recoilless rifles in our infantry inventory for use in arctic and similar environments where the "Dragon" ATGM(anti-tank guided missile) isn't reliable.

[JasonC]

Probably just a particular light mountain model, wanted for Afghanistan. We have plenty of garden variety towed 105s and 155s.

[Darksheare]

It's the M-119A1 105mm light towed howitzer, max range 12000 meters, and 19,200 meters with RAP rounds.
Helicopter portable, and pulled along by an M-1097 Humvee usually.
The M-102 is considered obsolete and has been mostly replaced with the 119.
However, former Gerneal Eric Shinseki started off a plan to slash artillery units.
A plan that had been continued until recently.
Quite a few light towed artillery units were removed from service.
Oops.

Now they need them.

[Darksheare]

MLRS cannot mark with smoke or do illume missions.
Yet.
But a 105mm illume round costs less than an MLRS illume rocket would.
And a White phosphorus 105mm round is safer and costs less than an MLRS white phosphorus rocket would.

The WP rounds tend to be picky about rough handling, and an MLRS rocket tends to be thin skinned.

[Cannoneer No. 4]

FAMPL ping

[SAMWolf]

Bump

[bvw]

Why don't we have mini-ground launched cruise missiles yet?