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9/11 Was Reagan's Fault (Barf Alert!)
St. Paul Pioneer Press ^ | 4/21/04 | Tom O'Mara

Posted on 04/21/2004 6:51:06 AM PDT by brbethke

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To: brbethke
If FAA had followed Billie Vincent's advice in 1991, even poorly trained security people would have found those box cutters.

And what if they had? Weren't they legal carry-on items at the time?

21 posted on 04/21/2004 7:13:12 AM PDT by BlackRazor
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To: BlackRazor
Clinton gave the airport security job to Algore. How'd he do ?
22 posted on 04/21/2004 7:15:12 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Corin Stormhands
No I blame the Angel Gabriel for delivering a garbled message to old Mad Mo.
23 posted on 04/21/2004 7:17:20 AM PDT by Kozak (Anti Shahada: " There is no God named Allah, and Muhammed is his False Prophet")
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To: All
I blame the first caveman who discovered you could fashion a rock into a sharp object ...
24 posted on 04/21/2004 7:17:50 AM PDT by Mr. Buzzcut
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To: mass55th
"Jimmy Carter is to blame for 9/11 ..."


You beat me to it. But you're 100% correct. If any American President is to blame for the current problems in and with the Middle East, it's Jiminy Carter, winner of the Nobel Appeasement Prize, for the actions you cited.
25 posted on 04/21/2004 7:20:38 AM PDT by Blzbba
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To: brbethke
Gee...last time I checked, Al Gore headed an airline security task force that could've made what ever revisions it felt necessary to change any shortcomings in current policy. Instead of adopting the proposed measures, the commissioners changed their final conclusions because they were bought off by airline lobbyists (hey Linda), who later contributed large amounts of cash to the DNC. Nice try, though.
26 posted on 04/21/2004 7:42:17 AM PDT by cwb (Kerry: Sadr is a legitimate voice in Iraq being silenced by America..and Hamas are sorta terrorists.)
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To: brbethke
It's so easy to criticize if you ignore the facts. The size of the baggage allowed aboard on 9/11 was meaningless.

Box cutters did not have to "found" before 9/11. They were allowed, as where small knives, Leatherman tools, small straight razors, etc.

In one flight to Reykjavik, a passengers was allowed to board with an ice ax in his bag. He was going glacier climbing in Iceland, so he needed his ice ax / ice hammer... of course....

In the Bush-hateing club, you get extra points if you can also demonstrate that you are a Reagan hater too!
27 posted on 04/21/2004 7:46:57 AM PDT by MindBender26 (For more news as it happens, news first, fast, 5 minutes sooner, stay tuned to FReeper Radio!)
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To: dead
It's all Da Vinci's fault...


28 posted on 04/21/2004 7:48:37 AM PDT by socal_parrot
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To: Kozak
I've been hearing conflicting reports about these box cutters in the last couple days. I don't remember what cable news network it was, but last night someone said that box cutters were illegal...while they did say that the leatherman knife you refer to, was legal. I've also heard that "any" closed knife was legal on flights prior to 9/11, also. Does anyone have any concrete info on what exactly was permissible on flights prior to 9/11? Not that it really would've mattered, since we've seen pranksters and journalist sneak all sorts of things on since 9/11 to make statements.
29 posted on 04/21/2004 7:49:34 AM PDT by cwb (Kerry: Sadr is a legitimate voice in Iraq being silenced by America..and Hamas are sorta terrorists.)
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To: cwb
Edit: Any closed knife UNDER 4 inches was supposedly, legal.
30 posted on 04/21/2004 7:52:21 AM PDT by cwb (Kerry: Sadr is a legitimate voice in Iraq being silenced by America..and Hamas are sorta terrorists.)
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To: brbethke
Like I said yesterday, if those upstarts in the 1700's didn't get a bee in their bonnet over this whole freedom and democracy thingy, we would have never had 9-11-01 happen.

The Founders of our Country, that's whose fault it is?

Anyone care to go further back?
31 posted on 04/21/2004 7:53:43 AM PDT by eyespysomething (The Barbarians are at the Gates. Don't give Kerry the key!)
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To: brbethke
I blame Abraham for having one too many sons.
32 posted on 04/21/2004 7:54:55 AM PDT by Dr._Joseph_Warren
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To: socal_parrot; Mr. Buzzcut
see my above post, you both went back further than me.
33 posted on 04/21/2004 7:55:25 AM PDT by eyespysomething (The Barbarians are at the Gates. Don't give Kerry the key!)
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To: Dr._Joseph_Warren
I guess God was just putting his plan into play.
34 posted on 04/21/2004 7:56:22 AM PDT by eyespysomething (The Barbarians are at the Gates. Don't give Kerry the key!)
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To: brbethke
If FAA had followed Billie Vincent's advice in 1991, even poorly trained security people would have found those box cutters.

So what if they did? At the time there was no law or regulation against carrying box cutters onto an airplane.

35 posted on 04/21/2004 7:59:31 AM PDT by steve-b
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To: eyespysomething
Anyone care to go further back?

I blame the Pilgrims, for not having invited Muslims on their journey to America. If the first settlers had been Muslims, 9-11 would have never happened.

36 posted on 04/21/2004 8:01:13 AM PDT by Michael81Dus
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To: BlackRazor; Kozak
This is what I found on the legallity of box cutters:

Pre-9/11 Rules Barred Box Cutters

By Jonathan D. Salant, ASSOCIATED PRESS

WASHINGTON (Nov. 11) - Airlines failed to enforce existing security guidelines on Sept. 11 that required airport screeners to confiscate box cutters from passengers, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press.

Government rules did not specifically bar the objects before last year's attacks, but the airlines were in charge of security then, with the Federal Aviation Administration overseeing their performance. The airlines issued a manual in 1994 that listed for screeners items passengers could not carry past airport checkpoints.

The AP obtained a copy of the document, which included box cutters such as those purportedly used by the Sept. 11, 2001, hijackers. "If they knew these were problems, why weren't they more responsible in protecting the public?" asked former FAA security chief Billie Vincent.

The Air Transport Association, which represents major airlines, and the Regional Airline Association, the trade group for smaller carriers, issued the Checkpoint Operations Guide to implement Federal Aviation Administration security regulations.

ATA spokesman Michael Wascom said only: "Box cutters were not prohibited by the FAA on 9-11-01," and refused to comment further. Officials of the regional airlines' group would not comment.

FAA spokeswoman Laura Brown said keeping box cutters off planes was an industry requirement, not a government order. She said the FAA allowed airline passengers to carry blades less than four inches long before Sept. 11. Government rules now prohibit such items.

The manual for security screeners was issued by the airlines' trade groups to comply with FAA regulations and was in effect at the time of the terror attacks. The document lists box cutters and pepper spray as items not allowed past security checkpoints. Screeners were told to call supervisors if either item were to be found.
37 posted on 04/21/2004 8:02:21 AM PDT by cwb (Kerry: Sadr is a legitimate voice in Iraq being silenced by America..and Hamas are sorta terrorists.)
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To: cwb
I routinely carried various small blades onto airplanes before the attacks -- they most certainly were not prohibited, the scrawlings of Tom O'Mara of Stacy, Minnesota upon a used napkin with an orange crayon notwithstanding.
38 posted on 04/21/2004 8:03:40 AM PDT by steve-b
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To: brbethke
This is a WorldNetDaily printer-friendly version of the article which follows.
To view this item online, visit http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=24840

Tuesday, October 9, 2001



Why airline security failed
Gore commission study material still classified


© 2001 WorldNetDaily.com

MIAMI – The classified reports used by the White House Commission on Aviation Safety, chaired by Vice President Al Gore and appointed by President Clinton in the wake of the TWA Flight 800 disaster, are still being withheld from a dissenting member of the panel despite a lawsuit to obtain copies, WorldNetDaily has learned.

The Gore commission produced what most observers considered to be a tough preliminary report unveiled Sept. 9, 1996 – one that included extensive counter-terrorism procedures.

But within days, according to Victoria Cummock, a whistleblower commission member, the airline industry jumped all over Gore with concerns about costs. As a result, 10 days later, Gore sent a letter to airline lobbyist Carol Hallett promising that the commission's findings would not result in any loss of revenue.


Victoria Cummock

The Democratic National Committee received $40,000 from TWA the next day. Within two weeks, Northwest, United and American Airlines ponied up another $55,000 for the 1996 campaign. In the next two months leading up to the November elections, American Airlines donated $250,000 to the Democrats. United donated $100,000 to the DNC. Northwestern contributed $53,000. Other reports suggest even more airline money was poured into the election campaign that year.

Following the election, in January, Gore floated a draft final report that eliminated all security measures from the commission's findings, according to Cummock. Two commission members balked, as did CIA Director John Deutch.

Fearing more political heat, Gore pulled back the draft report. A month later, the final report was issued – one that included requirements that would cost the airlines money for new security measures.

The report's requirements included:

  • high-tech bomb detectors;
  • more training for airport security;
  • criminal background checks for security personnel; and,
  • increased canine patrols.

But there were two things missing from the report, said Cummock – there was no deadline by which those requirements would have to be implemented and no funding mechanism for ensuring that they were. In the 1970s, for instance, when security checkpoints at airports were first implemented, the government provided tax credits as a funding mechanism. No such measures were mandated or offered as part of the Gore commission recommendations.

Thus, the requirements were not in place Sept. 11 of this year when terrorists hijacked four airliners, crashing two into the World Trade Center, another into the Pentagon and crashing a fourth in Pennsylvania. In fact, they are still not in place.

In a meeting with other commission members Feb. 12, 1997, Gore said he would leave room for a dissent by those who opposed the report. Cummock expressed her strong dissent. But within minutes, she says, Gore was announcing to the president and the public that the report was the work of a unanimous commission.

Cummock filed suit to gain access to files she and the public were denied. She won the case, but the material still has not been made available to her.

Cummock was appointed to the commission by Clinton because her husband was killed in the terrorist downing of Pan Am Flight 103 in Lockerbie, Scotland, and because of her work in counseling victims of such disasters.

Hallett now also agrees that the original 31 recommendations of that commission might have prevented the Sept. 11 attacks.

"In our hearts, everyone must realize that failure to use the (profiling) techniques that are available today may be directly responsible for the events of Sept. 11," she said in a speech to the Travel Industries Association in Atlanta.

The FAA issued a statement saying the security improvements mandated by the report were slowed by "often conflicting and time-consuming" federal rule-making procedures and by efforts to protect civil liberties.

As of last month, days after the terrorist attack, according to a Los Angeles Times report, the agency was still collecting research on how to keep intruders from slipping past airport perimeter fences and into restricted areas. The FAA had not launched an effort to assess the vulnerability to terrorists of the nation's 450 commercial airports. Measures to improve detection of explosives in baggage were still being considered by various agencies. The FBI was still working on a plan to protect civilian airliners from surface-to-air missiles. The FAA was negotiating with intelligence agencies for access to confidential information about potential terrorists and plots.

Before Sept. 11, the FBI knew that at least two men with ties to Osama bin Laden had entered the country. But authorities did not notify the airlines, despite bin Laden's threats to bring down U.S. airliners.

The commission report, despite its lack of teeth, acknowledged the threat of terrorism.

"People and places in the United States have joined the list of targets," it said. "It is becoming more common to find terrorists working alone or in ad hoc groups, some of whom are not afraid to die in carrying out their designs."

Even Gerald Kauvar, staff director of the Gore commission, admits the government had more than enough information and time to act.

"It's a government failure," he told the Los Angeles Times. "We specifically said the FAA had to change, and they've proved resistant to change."

But Cummock insists that the change would have taken place if the Gore commission had simply provided deadlines for action. She believes Gore sold out airline security for campaign cash.

"They buried it," she says. "And it's disgraceful that Gerry Kauvar would blame government failure. If anyone has blood on his hands, it's Gerry Kauvar. He was an impediment to getting to the truth."

Unlike most Americans, Cummock says she was not surprised by the terrorism of Sept. 11.

"We were briefed that it would happen," she says. "These scenarios of terrorists using our assets was part of the fact-finding process we looked at. It was inevitable with such lax security procedures."

Related column:

How Gore aborted air safety



39 posted on 04/21/2004 8:06:30 AM PDT by Howlin
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To: cwb; Phantom Lord
This is what they now think they used:







And, cwb, you are right; Fox reported this just last night.

So are you, PL; they were BOTH legal at that time.

40 posted on 04/21/2004 8:09:09 AM PDT by Howlin
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