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1 posted on 04/16/2004 5:07:20 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: dennisw
Imagine if a US soldier had written a letter just like this in World War II. And it got through uncensored and a small newspaper published it.

Would there be consequences?

2 posted on 04/16/2004 5:13:30 AM PDT by Montfort
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To: dennisw
In essence, we have given the Iraqis an enormous gift, but they don't seem to be seizing the opportunity

Well, it would be nice if Iraq turned around because of this, but that is not the primary goal. The primary goal is to protect the long term health of Americans, in which the military has been highly successful.

And this American (kidd) is highly grateful.

4 posted on 04/16/2004 5:23:46 AM PDT by kidd
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To: dennisw
"The truth is, our division is now getting ready for another bloody and hellishly hot summer that none of us expected to ever go through again."

We're all grateful for their sacrifice.
5 posted on 04/16/2004 5:29:13 AM PDT by proud American in Canada
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To: dennisw
Bush was ill served by his advisors who estimated the necessary troops to get the job done. It will likely cost him the election in November. The American people will not tolerate incompetence.
7 posted on 04/16/2004 5:35:54 AM PDT by RichardW
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To: dennisw
Sounds reasonable.
"...because of Fallujah and what has been going on in Baghdad, our potency and resolve are on full display. My task force alone has killed many insurgents in the last two weeks - something that was not happening before. "

I'm impressed by how stoically the volunteer troops take this extension. In the conscript early '70's type of Army I was in it would have been a morale disaster (but we weren't too far from a morale disaster even on our good days).

9 posted on 04/16/2004 5:44:34 AM PDT by mrsmith ("Oyez, oyez! All rise for the Honorable Chief Justice... Hillary Rodham Clinton ")
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To: dennisw
The answer is clearly to split the country up into three new countries. Yugoslavia didn't work without a dictatorship, and neither will Iraq.
17 posted on 04/16/2004 5:58:57 AM PDT by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along)
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To: dennisw
This LT was just told he'd be spending an additional 4 months in theater after a one year tour. If he wasn't pessimistic and bitching, I'd question his sanity. Having been in similar (though not quite so harsh) situations in my military career, I can dig out my own stack of "everything sucks" letters. And then, when you finally make it home, take a deep breath, sleep in your own bed and reacquaint yourself with your wife and kids...you start looking back and realize that maybe not everything sucked. In fact, some of it didn't suck at all. In fact, maybe another tour wouldn't be so bad. Especially since the cause is just, and our troops are professional warriors.
My guess is this Lt will have a long career in the Army. He's obviously bright and a thinker. Contrary to Hollywood stereotypes, there is plenty of room in our military for those kinds of leaders.
33 posted on 04/16/2004 6:25:42 AM PDT by Rokke
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To: dennisw
Sometimes it's hard to tell if Saddam was the problem or the symptom.

This is the key sentence in the whole email. I lean to the "symptom" thinking. Of course, we're asking a bunch of nomadic tribesmen to advance about 500 years in thinking in a year.

As for the bitching about staying longer than expected, that's normal. If I had been told I was getting out of that sewer of a country then got stopped at the last minute, I'd be pretty p*ssed.

66 posted on 04/16/2004 6:57:14 AM PDT by mikegi
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To: dennisw
"Iraqi society is sick in many ways. Sometimes it's hard to tell if Saddam was the problem or the symptom.I just don't know how a society so divided along ethnic and tribal lines, with no democratic or liberal traditions and almost zero respect for the rule of law can build any kind of society accept and autocratic one."
67 posted on 04/16/2004 6:57:45 AM PDT by BenLurkin
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To: dennisw
An interesting note -- but we have to consider the source.

Iraqi society is sick in many ways. Sometimes it's hard to tell if Saddam was the problem or the symptom. I just don't know how a society so divided along ethnic and tribal lines, with no democratic or liberal traditions and almost zero respect for the rule of law can build any kind of society accept and autocratic one.

Sounds an awful lot like Yugoslavia, doesn't it? It's astonishing to me that we're still reaping the "benefits" of the political rearrangements that followed the First World War.

78 posted on 04/16/2004 7:08:54 AM PDT by r9etb
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To: dennisw; ALOHA RONNIE
The fact that the 1st Armored Division (my unit) has now been extended for at least 4 months shows there aren't enough troops - in order to deal with a fairly minor uprising we had to break the one-year-boots-on-ground pledge. If we had had a strategic reserve, this would not be necessary. However, the dirty secret is that there aren't any more troops to be had - at least not the active-duty armor/infantry brigades and divisions requried to fight a tough enemy...

I've heard this a lot in the last couple of weeks, and I'm reminded of the situation just before the I Drang battle in Vietnam. There were men in Col. Moore's group who were close to being finished with their tour of duty. Rather than extend their tour, the Army brought in new men who didn't have time to get trained and up to speed before being shipped off. It is believed that the lack of experience of some of those men made the battle more difficult than it need have been. Am I remember this right, AR? I seem to remember having read this in Col. Moore's book.

Experience is a wonderful, though sometimes tough, teacher, and the fact that these men on the ground now HAVE lots of it helps when dealing with a flare up like Fallujah. Imagine the dog's breakfast it could have been with all new troops. They could rotate new folks in a few at a time to get them up to speed and rotate the other guys out slowly. In fact, I believe the military is doing something like that now. There are new folks in who are learning the ropes, so to speak, and the ones who've been there a long time will be coming home.

But we have to remember, this is war, and things don't always go as planned, so our folks have to be flexible. It seems the media is under the impression that the war is over, so that's why they're so incensed about American soldiers continuing to die. It ain't over folks. The President announce that MAJOR operations were over last year, and he was right. We're no longer having to fight all over the entire country. We can now concentrate on the hot spots and deal with the terrorists who are coming in from all over the Middle East; something else the partisan media is mentioning. These are not just Iraqis we're fighting.

90 posted on 04/16/2004 7:18:14 AM PDT by SuziQ
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To: dennisw
Iraq should be divided up between all the zealots, with a nice big slice for the Kurds. Then we can leave them to kill each other and do the job for us. It probably took someone as brutal as Saddam to control those fools over there and force them to co-exist.

Our quick exit may de-stablize the entire middle east, leaving them busy killing each other. Iran will, no doubt, attempt to rush in, Syria will object. Not really a bad result, on the face of it.
111 posted on 04/16/2004 7:33:52 AM PDT by MissAmericanPie
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To: dennisw
Hey Dennis,

Thanks for posting this soldier's email. I would humbly submit this as an exhibit in the case for those of us who opposed the war with Iraq from the get go. Contrary to the claims against us that we were anti Americans, terrorists, appeasers, isolationists, etc. what we were was consistent to conservative and libertarian understanding of failures of central planning and the dangers of ideologues. Ideologues start with grandiose ideas and build upon them. When reality conflicts with the basic tenets of their faith they dismiss reality, those unrepentant communists around the world for example. This is why some of us have disagreed with neoconservatives. They are central planners and ideologues. They had an idea for transforming the middle east and indeed the world. From the start their critics predicted this mess in Iraq. They predicted the need for large amounts of troops to pacify the country after the military was defeated. In fact the generals in the pentagon took issue with the neocon civilian authorities and were harshly slapped down by Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, et. al. In summary everything the neocons predicted has failed to materialize and everything their critics said has come true. The cost has been heavy in blood, treasure and American prestige. Unfortunately the ideologues have learned nothing from failure and wish only to invade more Arab countries - preventative war you know - making the world safe for democracy, etc.

P.S. I'd like to add that those of us on the right who criticized the invasion of Iraq always thought the reasons for the war were fraudulent.

144 posted on 04/16/2004 8:07:18 AM PDT by u-89
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To: JohnGalt; Burkeman1
ping
147 posted on 04/16/2004 8:08:32 AM PDT by u-89
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To: dennisw
Sounds like the Army, alright.
185 posted on 04/16/2004 8:51:09 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: dennisw
Bttt.
232 posted on 04/16/2004 10:08:37 AM PDT by Prince Charles
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To: dennisw
mark
240 posted on 04/16/2004 10:19:26 AM PDT by jokar (On line data base http://www.trackingthethreat.com/db/index.htm)
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