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To: William Terrell
This is the 14th amendment. It was proposed before the war and contributed greatly to the hostilities

It was not proposed before the war. There was a proposed amendment just before the war, it was never ratified. It read:

No amendment shall be made to the Constitution which will authorize or give to Congress the power to abolish or interfere, within any State, with the domestic institutions thereof, including that of persons held to labor or service by the laws of said State.

The first drafts of what became the 14th amendment were not written until until Jan 12, 1866, well after the end of the war. It did not pass until June 13, 1866, and was not ratified until 1868. It was written in response to state and local governments in the South infringing upon the rights of the former slaves, most particularly their right to keep and bear arms. The banning of slavery was done by the 13th amendment, which was passed and ratified in 1865. Lee surrendered on April 9th, 1865.

History and fact checking are not your strong suite, are they?

You support this fraud, evidently.

I support the Constitution as written and ratified.

So, I would not say that your allegiance to America is not close to perfect. (Funny the USAF and DoD never questioned it when they granted me some pretty hefty security clearances) Service in the United States Air Force Reserve means nothing to me. Live with that.

I don't really give an ant's ass what it means to you, it means a lot to me, as does my oath of office to support and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic. BTW, I did serve on active duty, as an officer, before becoming a reservist, and have been involved in suppling the US military with the best weapons and equipment I could devise ever since. (Except for the 18 months I spent in grad school)

Did you, and your parents, come to this country legally?

I was born here. My Dad was born in Montana, where his parents had gone to find work in the mines, and my mother was born in Nebraska. I don't know about my paternal grandfather, since he was adopted and since grandma left him after the third child in 3 years was born and I never knew him. He could have been an immigrant as could his birth parents, but it would have been in the 1880s or 1890s if that were the case. I know my maternal grandfather, also "adopted" but only by his stepfather, was born in the US, but not much more about him, although one or both of his parents may have had some Spanish ancestry, since they gave him the middle name of Carlos, but his adopted last name was Kimball, while his birth last name was probably Lamb. My maternal grandmother's family (Kunz) came from Germany in the 1860s and 1870s. Not sure when my paternal grandmother's family (Harrison) came from England, but I know her mother (a Lee) was born in the US as well, and I never heard any different about great-grandfather Harrison, but I know he owned several hundred acres of land in 1890s.

So I'd say your implication was way off base.

1,024 posted on 04/08/2004 4:40:41 PM PDT by El Gato (Federal Judges can twist the Constitution into anything.. Or so they think.)
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To: El Gato
I support the Constitution as written and ratified.

There is a very serious question, whether the "Fourteenth Amendment" was ever validly ratified. The Supreme Court has ducked the question, treating it as political not judicial, but it is hardly something sacrosanct.

You are right that it was not proposed until after the War. It was the cornerstone of the punish the South campaign, launched by those led by the despicable Thaddeus Stevens, and motivated by a combination of hate and an ideology that Karl Marx found appealing.

1,026 posted on 04/09/2004 2:40:31 AM PDT by Ohioan
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