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God and Allah Are Not the Same, Judge Told
CNSNEWS.com ^ | 3/02/04 | Patrick Goodenough

Posted on 03/02/2004 2:53:16 AM PST by kattracks

Pacific Rim Bureau (CNSNews.com) - God and Allah are not the same, an Australian pastor has told a tribunal where he faces complaints of vilifying Islam.

Pastor Daniel Scot, a scholar in Islam who fled his native Pakistan 17 years ago amid threats of retribution for "blasphemy," said that his studying of the Bible and the Quran led him to the conclusion that the God of the Bible and Allah of the Quran were different in practice, behavior and other attributes.

Scot and another pastor, Danny Nalliah, have been appearing before an administrative tribunal in the state of Victoria, after Muslims brought a complaint against them under controversial new hate laws.

Nalliah's organization, Catch the Fire Ministries, organized a seminar on Islam for Christians in March 2002, and Scot was the guest speaker. Three Muslim converts who attended the meeting at the request of the Islamic Council of Victoria (ICV) said the seminar had incited fear of, and hatred for, Muslims.

Catch the Fire denied the charge, saying the seminar had merely informed Christians about Islam and its teachings, as set out in the Quran, Hadiths (sayings of Mohammed) and other religious texts.

Mediation attempts failed, and the case eventually landed before the tribunal, which operates like a court, with a presiding judge and lawyers representing the complainants and respondents.

If the judge upholds the complaint, he may order Scot and Nalliah to apologize, pay compensation or take other steps. The specific complaint faced by the two does not carry criminal penalties.

Re-examined by his legal representative, David Perkins, Scot said he had read the Bible more than 50 times and the Quran even more than that.

He said the Bible made it clear that Jesus Christ came to earth because of God's love, to save all humanity. God did not want anyone to perish, whereas Allah said he had created many jinn (spirits), and mankind for hell.

Comparing the two faiths in other instances, Scot said the Bible taught that there is no marriage in heaven, whereas in Islam's holy book Muslims could expect many wives, as well as young men, in paradise.

Mohammed said in a Hadith that a man would enjoy the sexual prowess of 100 men, he added.

("The believer will be given such and such strength in Paradise for sexual intercourse. It was questioned: O prophet of Allah! Can he do that? He said: 'He will be given the strength of one hundred persons.' " - Mishkat Al-Masabih)

Scot said the Quran also refers, in sura 5:60, to Allah turning "people of the Book" (Jews and Christians) into monkeys and pigs.

By contrast, the Bible teaches that God made mankind in his own image, and only because of sin is that image marred.

The question of Allah and God was initially brought up in an earlier hearing, by a legal representative for the ICV, Brind Woinarski.

Woinarski asked Scot for a yes or no answer to the question of whether he believed Allah in Islam is the same as the God of the Bible.

Scot instead asked for permission to answer in more detail, then asked for a copy of the Quran and read two portions (sura 5:72 and sura 19:88-91) which say in essence that Allah has no son.

Then he read from the Bible (1 John 2:23), which says: "Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also."

Scot told the tribunal that it was considered the greatest sin in Islam to say that Allah has a son.

By reading those verses from the Quran and the Bible, it was evident Allah and God were not the same, he said.

At a different point in the questioning, Scot said that Jesus forgave his enemies, whereas Mohammed did not.

He said one needed to look at how Mohammed - the perfect example for Muslims - acted, and how Jesus lived and taught his followers to live.

The case continues.

See earlier story:
Vilifying Islam Case Drags on in Australia (Feb. 26, 2004)


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TOPICS: Australia/New Zealand; Culture/Society; Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: hatespeech; islam
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To: Cultural Jihad
God is by definition beyond definition

In a sense, yes, in that He is unbound by any limits imposed by language. However, I think most religions hold that their God is omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, infinite and eternal. By definition there can be only one such Being. To argue that the Gods of different religions are different, you must put some limitations on your or the other guy's God. Since the other guy's religion is not teaching that his God is less than eternal, infinite, etc., the only way to win this argument is to define your God as something smaller. That seems like a form of blasphemy to me.

It's fine to say many followers of a religion are corrupt and immoral and that what is commonly taught is evil. I don't think, though, that Christians or Muslims can say my God is better than your God. It doesn't make sense.

61 posted on 03/02/2004 12:38:25 PM PST by SupplySider
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To: mrfixit514
"I teach in my World History class that there is no way that the Christian God and Allah can be the same. I give the students about 10 of Allah's attributes and they always figure it out for themselves."

Public or private school?
62 posted on 03/02/2004 12:48:43 PM PST by WOSG (If we call Republicans the "Grand Old Party" lets call Democrats the Corrupt Radical Activist Party.)
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To: mrfixit514
"I teach in my World History class that there is no way that the Christian God and Allah can be the same. I give the students about 10 of Allah's attributes and they always figure it out for themselves."

Public or private school?
63 posted on 03/02/2004 12:48:43 PM PST by WOSG (If we call Republicans the "Grand Old Party" lets call Democrats the Corrupt Radical Activist Party.)
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To: tellw
"There is only one God of Abraham, and I believe Christians, Muslims and Jews pray to him. They disagree on who God's representative on earth is."

Mohammed's God tolk him in Surah 9 to slay the "idolators" meaning slay the Jews and Christians. If He was the same God why would he do that?

Why did the Quran claim that Jesus wasnt crucified but somehow pretended to be? Why did the Quran make a hash out of other Bible stories? Why did the Meccans worship the same Quibla stone that they worshipped back when they were pagan moon-God worshippers if this God is the God of Abraham?

And lastly, where in the sayings of Mohammed, a man who was basically a bandit and warlord, is there any ethical sayings comparable to Jesus' sermon on the mount? My belief is that Mohammed's own theology was as warped and phony as say David Koresh - the difference is Mohammed was a bit more militarily successful. That does not mean the religion is comparable or the God is similar. Islam has perverted what was in the Gospels and the "book" beyond truth and recognition. They turned it into a hideous distortion.

Too many people buy the "kumbaya" cr*p instead of actually reading the Quran to know that Islam is really about.
Islam=submission, submission to a particular definition of God that is contrary totally to what Jesus preached and Christians believe.
64 posted on 03/02/2004 12:56:30 PM PST by WOSG (If we call Republicans the "Grand Old Party" lets call Democrats the Corrupt Radical Activist Party.)
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To: kattracks
Another huge difference is how men are viewed in terms of sexuality. Allah thinks men are no better than beasts, so women must cover themselves entirely or take the blame for being raped. God's view of man is more trusting.
65 posted on 03/02/2004 12:59:00 PM PST by bukkdems
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To: tessalu
"Islam claims that Jesus and Moses are prophets, and yet they do not believe what Jesus or Moses taught, so what good is a prophet when you can not believe what they say?"

It's worse than that. they distort who Jesus was and make claims directly contrary to Christian faith.
Fables from the apocryphal 'gospel of Thomas' ended up in the Quran, but the true story of Jesus is not conveyed . not his ministry, his preachings, his healings, or his passion and death.

It's like making a saint out of Martin Luther King Jr, and then somehow mistaking him for Marthin Luther and getting the story crossed.

What Mohammed did was he took 3rd hand stories and wove them into his religion. Kind of the way a political candidate borrows ideas from other people. After winning power only then do you know notice the story is not consistent... Mohammed himself went from tolerating other religions to persecuting them depending on what was best for his power.

The end result is a theological mess, and a host of statements and beliefs that defy logic and historical fact.

66 posted on 03/02/2004 1:02:40 PM PST by WOSG (If we call Republicans the "Grand Old Party" lets call Democrats the Corrupt Radical Activist Party.)
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To: BadAndy
"Allah is either a delusion that sprung from a psychotic mind, or a sham perpetrated by a murderous lunatic (read the origins of Islam)."

A little of both actually ... some of Mohammed's visions were "convenient" excuses for him to make decisions that helped him. For example a vision that let him marry 9 women, including a 9-year-old.

"In any case, I think it would be difficult to recognize the G-D from the Old and New Testiments as being the same. Old testimemt is all fire, brimstome and smiting people. New Testiment is all peace, love and brotherhood."

Not quite, but some truth to that. And a lot of truth to the fact that Mohammed brought back the old testament style view of man and god's relationship. God would reward you with sexual pleasures in heaven if you are 'good', where 'good' including smiting the 'infidels' who werent believers in the Quran; and he would punish those who didnt believe. A primitive but effective theology for enforcing your will and creating Islamic states.
67 posted on 03/02/2004 1:07:50 PM PST by WOSG (If we call Republicans the "Grand Old Party" lets call Democrats the Corrupt Radical Activist Party.)
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To: philetus
The judges know, if they rule against Islam, they stand a good chance of dying.

Well isn't that special.

It's comforting to know that the same process by which countries become Islamic Republics continues unchanged throughout the ages. They simply keep yielding, until they've handed over the complete reins.

Tradition!

Welcome to the Islamic Republic of Australia.

Someone should photoshop up some nice Visitor's Bureau posters, eh?

68 posted on 03/02/2004 1:16:27 PM PST by Don Joe (We've traded the Rule of Law for the Law of Rule.)
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To: kattracks
Well!
That takes care of allah (sbuh) in my book!
69 posted on 03/02/2004 1:17:03 PM PST by Publius6961 (40% of Californians are as dumb as a sack of rocks.)
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Well, what about:

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Hathor (Hathoor, Het-heru, Het-Hert), Harpocrates, Hor-pa-kraat, Horus, Heqet, Imhotep, Imsety (Amset, Mestha), Khepri, Khnum, Khons, Maat, Mentu (Month, Montu), Min (Menu, Amsu), Mut, Nefertum, Neith, (Net, Neit), Nekhbet, Nephthys, Nut (Nuit), Osiris, Asar, Ptah, Qebehsenuef (Qebsnewef), Qetesh, Re-Horakty (Ra-Hoor-Khuit), Sati, Seker, Sekhmet, Selket, Serapis, Set, Shu, Sobek, Sothis, Tefnut, Thoth, Thoueris, Wepwawet, Chaos, Gaea, Tartarus, Eros, Erebus, Uranus, Mountains, Pontus, Cyclpoe, Hecatonchires, Cronus, Rhea, Phoebe, Hestia, Lapetus, Dione, Epimetheus, Hebe, Asclepius, Juno, Vesta, Venus, Vulcan, Cupid, Proserpina, Bacchus, Dionysos, Ceres, Castor, Pollux, Aeolus, Boreas, Zephir, Notus, Eurus, Iris, Aether, Hygeia, Trivia, Discordia, Nike, Erinyes, Victory, Furies, Aurora, Thelxepeia, Peisinoë, Molpe, Clio, Urania, Melpomene, Thalia, Terspichore, Calliope, Erato, Polyhymnia, Euterpe, Fama, Asclepius, Aglaia, Euphrosyne, Clotho, Lachesis, Atropos, Durga, Garuda, Hanuman, Kali, Lakshmi, Nandi, Sarasvati, Dyaush-pita, Prithivi mata, Vayu, Parjanya, Surya, Varuna, Agni, Indra, Soma, Ushas, Yama, Adityas, Aswini, Rudras, Vasus, Visvedevas, Abassi, Ab Kin Xoc, Abraham, Adroa, Acheloos, Adroanzi, Aegle, Ah Chuy Kak, Ah Cun Can, Ah Puch, Zygia, Zaltys, Zanahary, Zephyros, Mu, Muchalinda, The Silver Tree, Yogath Hob, Na May Hob, Thomtain Hob, Fate, Djandri Hob, The Sleeping Entity, Olanigan, Wemusa, Marush Hob, Catemar, Kalendor Hob, Timballayamu, Symbaga, Banthaln, Gnaman, Zaalaac, Kalahari, Celestian, Tuanghor Hob, Saalah, Ouikka, Tenebrion, Nemed Hob, Korint Hob, Tsothoggua, Jergal Zadh, Keambiroiro, Jehovah, Elohim, Atho (Ahti), Akka (Maa-Emoinen, Mader-Akka, Rauni), Hiisi, Ilma, Ilmatar (Lounnotar), Ilmarinen, Jumala (Mader-Atcha), Kalma, Kipu-Tytt, Kuu, Leib-Olmai, Louhi, Loviator, Mielikki, Mother of Metsola, Num, Numitorem, Paiva, Pellervoinen, Rauni (Maan-Eno, Ravdna, Roonikka), Tapio, Tuoni, Ukko, Yambe-Akka, Hina-ke-ka, Hina-ku-wa'a, Hina-puku-'ai, Ka-pu-'a-o-alaka'i, Ka-pu-o-alaka'i, Kama-i-ka-huli-wa'a-pu, Kanealuka, Ku'alana-wao, Ku-holoholo-pali, Ku-kalanawao, Ku-kanaloa, Ku-ka-'ohi'a-laka, Inti, Ku-mauna, Ku-moku-hali'i, Ku-ohanawao, Ku-'ohi'a-Laka (Laka), Ku-olonawao, Ku-pepeiao-loa, Ku-pepeiao-poko, Ku-pulapula, Ku-pulupulu, Ku-pulupulu-i-ka-nahele, Kulauka, Lea (Lea-ka-wahine), Moku-hali'i, Sreekara Devaru, Bhoovaraha, Ebisu, Daikokuten, Bishamonten, Benzaiten, Fukurokuju, Jurojin, Hotei, Eleggua, Obatala, Oloddumare, Oshun, Yemalla, Beelzebub, Eshmun, Ashtoreth, Chemosh, Mesha, Han Chung-li, Han Hsiang-tsu, Acat, Ahpuch, Bacabs, Chac, Cit Chac Coh, Ek Ahau, Ek Chuah, Gucumatz, Hun Pic Tok, Hunab Ku, Hurukan, Itzamna, Ixchebelyax, Ixchel, Ixchup, Ixtab, Ixtubtun, Tkinich Kak Mo, Kukulcan, Mam, Masaya, Nohochacyum, Xaman Ek, Yum Caax, Illapa, Mama Cocha, Mama Quilla, Manco Capac, Pachacamac, Supai, Urcaguary, Viracocha, Aakuluujjusi, Ab Kin Zoc, Abaangui, Ac Yanto, Acan, Acat, Aclla, Acna, Acolnahuacatl, Acolmiztli, Acuecucyoticihuati, Adamisil Wedo, Adlivun, Agaman Nibo, Aguara, Agwe, Agweta, Ah Bolom Tzacab, Ah Cancum, Ah Chun Caan, Ah Chuy Kak, Ah Ciliz, Ah Cun Can, Ah Cuxtal, Ah Hulneb, Ah Kin, Ah Kumix Uinicob, Ah Mun, Ah Muzencab, Ah Patnar Uinicob, Ah Peku, Ah Puch, Ah Tabai, Ah Uaynih, Ah Uincir Dz'acab, Ah Uuc Ticab, Ah Wink-ir Masa, Ahau Chamahez, Ahau-Kin, Ahmakiq, Ahnt Alis Pok', Ahnt Kai', Ahuic, Ahulane, Aida Wedo, Ajbit, Ajtzak, Akewa, Akhushtal, Akycha, Alaghom Naom Tzentel, Alignak, Alom, Amimitl, Angpetu Wi, Aningan, Apozanolotl, Apu Punchau, Asintmah, Atabei, Atahensic, Atl, Atlacamani, Atlacoya, Atlatonin, Atlaua, Auchimalgen, Auilix, Ayauhteotl, Ayizan, Bacabs, Bachué, Backlum Chaam, Balam, Bikeh Hozho, Bitol, Bochica, Bolontiku, Breath of Wind, Buluc Chabtan, Cabaguil, Cacoch, Cakulha, Camaxtli, Camozotz, Caprakan, Ca-the-ña, Cauac, Cavillaca, Centeotl, Centzonuitznaua, Chac, Chac Uayab Xoc, Chakwaina Okya, Chalchiuhtlatonal, Chalchihuitlicue, Chalchiutotolin, Chalmecacihuilt, Chalmecatl, Chamer, Chantico, Chaob, Chasca, Chibiabos, Chibirias, Chiccan, Chicomecoatl, Chicomexochtli, Chiconahui, Chiconahuiehecatl, Chie, Chirakan, Cihuacoatl, Cinteotl, Cipactli, Cit-Bolon-Tum, Cit Chac Coh, Citlalatonac, Citlalicue, Ciucoatl, Ciuteoteo, Cizin, Coatlicue, Cochimetl, Cocijo, Cocomama, Colel Cab, Colop U Uichkin, Copil, Coyolxauhqui, Coyopa, Coyote or Old Man, Cum Hau, Dagwanoenyent, Deohako, Djigonsasee, Dzalarhons, Ee-loolth, Ehecatl, Eithinoha, Ek Ahau, Ekchuah, Esceheman, Eschetewuarha, Estsanatlehi, Evaki, Ewauna, Gaoh, Gawaunduk, Geezhigo-Quae, Gendenwitha, Genetaska, Ghanan, Gitche Manitou, Glispa, Gluskap, Godasiyo, Great Seahouse, Guabancex, Gucumatz, Gukumatz, Gunnodoyak, Gyhldeptis, Hacauitz, Hacha'kyum, Hamedicu, Hanghepi Wi, Hastseoltoi, Heng, Hino, Hisakitaimisi, Hotoru, Huehuecoyotl, Huehueteotl, Huitaca, Huitzilopochtli, Huixtocihuatl, Hummingbird, Hun Hunahpu, Hunab Ku, Hunahpu, Hunahpu Utiu, Hunahpu-Gutch, Hunhau, Hun Pic Tok, Hurakan, Iatiku and Nautsiti, Idlirvirisong, Ilamatecuhtli, Illapa, Ilyap'a, Inti, Ioskeha, Ipalnemohuani, Isakakate, Itzamná, Itzananohk`u, Itzlacoliuhque, Itzli, Itzpapalotl, Ix Chebel Yax, Ixbalanque, Ixchel, Ixchup, Ixmucane, Ixpiyacoc, Ixtab, Ixtlilton, Ixtubtin, Ixzaluoh, Iztaccihuatl, Iztacmixcohuatl, Jaguar Night, Jaguar Quitze, Katsinas, Kan, Kan-u-Uayeyab, Kan-xib-yui, Kanati, Ketchimanetowa, Ketq Skwaye, K'in, Kianto, Kilya, Kinich Ahau, Kinich Kakmo, Kisin, Kun, Loha, Loo-wit, Macaw Woman, Macuilxochitl, Maho Peneta, Mahucutah, Malinalxochi, Malsum, Mam, Mama Cocha, Mama Quilla, Manco Capac, Mani'to, Manu, Masaya, Master of Winds, Mayahuel, Menahka, Metztli, Mexitl, Mictecacihuatl, Mictlan, Mictlantecuhtli, Mitnal, Mixcoatl, Mulac, Nacon, Nagual, Nahual, Nakawé, Nanabojo, Nanabush, Nanahuatzin, Nanautzin, Nanih Waiya, Nanook, Naum, Negafok, Nesaru, Nishanu, Nohochacyum, Ockabewis, Oklatabashih, Omacatl, Omecihuatl, Ometecuhtli, Onatha, Opochtli, Oshadagea, Pachacamac, Pachamama, Pah, Paiowa, Pana, Patecatl, Pautiwa, Paynal, Pinga, Qaholom, Qakma, Quetzalcoatl, Quootis-hooi, Ragno, Rukko, Sedna, Selu, Shakuru, Shilup Chito Osh, Shrimp House, Sio Humis, Supai, Talocan, Tarhuhyiawahku, Tawa, Tawiscara, Tecciztecatl, Teoyaomqui, Tepeu, Tepeyollotl, Teteoinnan, Tezcatlipoca, Tieholtsodi, Tirawa atius, Tlacolotl, Tlahuixcalpantecuhtli, Tlaloc, Tlaltecuhtli, Tlauixcalpantecuhtli, Tlazolteotl, Tohil, Tonantzin, Tonatiuh, To'nenile, True Jaguar, Tsentsa, Tsichtinako, Tunkan Ingan, Tzakol, Tzitzimime, Uchtsiti, Ueuecoyotl, Uitzilopochtli, Ukat, Unk, Urcaguary, Viracocha/Huiracocha, Voltan, Wah-Kah-Nee, Wakan-Tanka, White Buffalo Woman, Windigo, Winonah, Wisagatcak, Xaman Ek, Xibalba, Xilonen, Xipe Totec, Xiuhcoatl, Xiuhtecuhtli, Xiuhtecutli, Xmucane, Xochipili, Xochiquetzal, Xocotl, Xolotl, Xpiyacoc, Xpuch and Xtah, Yacatecuhtli, Yaluk, Yebaad, Yeba Ka, Yeitso, Yemanja, Yemaya, Yiacatecuhtli, Yolkai Estsan, Yum Kaax, Zaramama, Zipaltonal, Zotz,....?

70 posted on 03/02/2004 1:23:03 PM PST by Consort
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Folks, what we have here is not a middle-east problem. It is not an Arab problem. What we have is a Muslim problem. Once folks begin to see that this is really a war of principalities (spiritual war), we will know who the true enemy is, and what to do to address that enemy. The first thing you must do to be victorious is to identify the the enemy. This has been done from the beginning of time. You are either for God (Biblical God) and the salvation that comes through Christ or you are against. Pray for our misguided Muslim friends that they may see the truth and be saved.

If you want to win the war on terrorism, it will not be done until Islam no longer exists. (Political incorrectness sometimes hurts).
71 posted on 03/02/2004 1:24:02 PM PST by Vercingetorix_Gaul
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To: rageaholic
Logic and islam are mutually exclusive.
72 posted on 03/02/2004 1:29:47 PM PST by John Frum
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To: DonQ
I am surprised that the Australians are so eager to prosecute a Christian minister for promoting Christianity over Islam, especially considering how many Australians were killed by that Islamic terrorist bombing in Bali last year.

It's the sheep mentality. They hurt you, so be nice to them. You don't want to piss 'em off even more, do you?

There's an old "ethnic joke" I like to tell. I heard it on NPR of all places, IIRC.

A Jewish couple is sitting on the ground in a concentration camp, facing a trench filled with bodies. Behind them stands a nazi guard with a machinegun.

They hear the nazi cock his machinegun.

The husband mutters, "Lousy stinking nazi sonofabitch..."

His wife then turns to him and says, "Shush! You'll make him mad!"

Sad, isn't it, how that mentality has pretty much taken over Western culture. The Australians aren't, "eager to prosecute a Christian minister," they're simply trying not to upset the Muslims. They just don't know that there's a not-too-pretty endgame to the process of "not upsetting the Muslems" via kowtowing to them.

73 posted on 03/02/2004 1:29:53 PM PST by Don Joe (We've traded the Rule of Law for the Law of Rule.)
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To: Gritty
It's always Christians being hauled up on "hate crime" charges, never Muslims,

The agenda should be clear for all to see - even judges!

The problem isn't that they don't see it. The problem is that Islam has managed to get itself the "street rep" as the toughest kid on the block -- the one that no one dare offend.

Just think back to those movies where the mealy mouthed little weasels, in cloyingly saccharine, deferential demeanor, avert their gaze and utter such terms of "respect" like, "yes, don Corleone..."

The mobsters were "men of respect". The more feared, the more respected.

It's nothing new. The Bard even covered it. "For Brutus is an honorable man; So are they all, all honorable men."

The West is bowing, scraping, and condescending itself into a return to the Dark Ages.

I doubt it'll be any prettier this time around.

74 posted on 03/02/2004 1:39:36 PM PST by Don Joe (We've traded the Rule of Law for the Law of Rule.)
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To: montag813
Someone tell me again why this is accepted as a "religion".

Because, in the common parlance, if it isn't accepted as such, and on its terms -- it'll "kick yer ass."

The West has traded the Fear of God for the Fear of Islam.

75 posted on 03/02/2004 1:43:08 PM PST by Don Joe (We've traded the Rule of Law for the Law of Rule.)
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To: tkathy
Like, "If my god behaved like that, I'd kick his butt?"
76 posted on 03/02/2004 1:43:19 PM PST by Old Professer
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To: chronotrigger
"If the judge upholds the complaint, he may order Scot and Nalliah to apologize, pay compensation or take other steps."

Thank God I live in America. To think that some stuck up, fascist government could punish me for merely saying something someone else doesn't like.

Not so fast there, eh?

It's happening here too, just not quite as fast as in Australia.

In Califorina, public school kids are required to study and practice Islam in class. I am not exagerating in the least. Perhaps someone can provide some URLs. This has received quite a bit of coverage, yet, it persists.

77 posted on 03/02/2004 1:46:03 PM PST by Don Joe (We've traded the Rule of Law for the Law of Rule.)
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To: george wythe
Comparing the two faiths in other instances, Scot said the Bible taught that there is no marriage in heaven, whereas in Islam's holy book Muslims could expect many wives, as well as young men, in paradise.

Is this about Muslims or Mormons?

I don't think Mormons are into young boys.

Besides, many scholars have assured us that it's only due to an improper translation that the "82 virgins" story got started. The actual text refers to raisins, not virgins, so don't get your panties in a wad over it.

Now, as to the appropriate state of "waddishness" over the idea that crazed madmen would commit mass murder, so that they might earn 82 raisins in the afterlife...

78 posted on 03/02/2004 1:50:58 PM PST by Don Joe (We've traded the Rule of Law for the Law of Rule.)
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To: WOSG
What Mohammed did was he took 3rd hand stories and wove them into his religion. Kind of the way a political candidate borrows ideas from other people.

Sometimes you don't know whether to laugh or cry. A few months back, some big league RAT said, when asked about taxes (I think it was a question during one of the beauty pagents "debates"), replied that the Bible said that it's OK to give to God what's God's, but the main thing was to give to Caesar what's Caesar's.

In one breathtaking statement, he not only reversed the meaning of Christ's message, but also equated the USA to the Roman Empire.

79 posted on 03/02/2004 1:57:03 PM PST by Don Joe (We've traded the Rule of Law for the Law of Rule.)
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To: Cultural Jihad
Oh, that's your problem, your an atheist. I wondered if you were. Well, little girl, these are the facts as we know them. There is no denying the existance of Jesus, that he died on a cross, that it is claimed for our sins, on the third day he rose, according to witnesses who later died horrible deaths rather than deny the truth of what they had seen, you are aware that we even figgure our time by his birth.

The only two remaining questions are, do you believe him or not, and have the Most Highs prophecies about the future proven accurate or not? Other than that, there is the evidence of the Holy Spirit, you either have it, and know you have it, or you don't, and the other evidence is Israel.

On the other hand you cannot prove there isn't a God, and given your post there is little wonder that you would not know the difference between the Most High and an imitation.
80 posted on 03/02/2004 1:57:18 PM PST by MissAmericanPie
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