State factory loss a 'crisis,' panel says

The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette ^ | Sunday, February 22, 2004 | Len Barcousky

[Willie Green]

About 1,400 factories have closed in the state in the past three years, says the Pennsylvania Manufacturers Association.

"If this isn't a crisis, then that word has no meaning," said David N. Taylor, communications director for the association. He was one of seven panel members representing an unusual alliance of labor and business who spoke Wednesday at a Trade Sanity Town Meeting at Butler County Community College.

[jpsb]

Someone w/o even a high school diploma has no right to demand 50k a year to turn a screwdriver in a car assembly plant.

Ok, I get it, someone w/o a high school diploma is not entitled to learn a living, get married and raise a family. Thanks for clearing that up for me. And good luck on selling your elitist agenda to the many millions of hard working people that for one reason or another do not meet your qualifications for having a life.

[Veracious Poet]

"I argue against all forms of protectionism, that is why I am a conservative not a populist. See the difference?"

So if a President taught all of his successors that excessive concentration of power, whether in an institution or an individual, was just not American, what would he be?

[jpsb]

Nope, and I note that you have not yet answered my question.

Also where did you get this silly idea that it is not conservative to conserve (protect) the nations ability to produce wealth?

[Texasforever]

LMAO. Yep they were one big happty family. Look, here is the bottom line, Washington used slave labor, Jefferson used slave labor and every other major land owner and merchant it is not in dispute. They were kind to their slaves but the pre-civil war economy was fueled by slave labor. You brought up the founders I didn't. You just pick the wrong example to make your case.

[CurlyDave]

The RATs have been conducting a "War on Capitalism" for decades.

They are starting to win, and now they don't like it.

[Texasforever]

Also where did you get this silly idea that it is not conservative to conserve (protect) the nations ability to produce wealth?

You don't "conserve wealth" by losing money paying higher labor costs than necessary.

[Joshua]

Funny that these products that needed to be "created" by ingenious blue collar US workers are now being produced by third world morons.

Hell, this outsourced third world produced computer i'm replying to you on is doing a great job.

[Texasforever]

So if a President taught all of his successors that excessive concentration of power, whether in an institution or an individual, was just not American, what would he be?

I guess that question made sense to you but you are going to have to communicate it better to me.

[Veracious Poet]

Here, I'll make it easy for you:

So if a President taught all of his successors that excessive concentration of power, whether in an institution or an individual, was just not American, what would he be?

A. Conservative

B. Populist

C. Socialist

D. Father of the Republic

[Texasforever]

LOL. You mean Washington's farewell address. No it would make him a free market conservative. Protectionism is the very definition of centralized government power. Next?

[Veracious Poet]

"Funny that these products that needed to be "created" by ingenious blue collar US workers are now being produced by third world morons."

If you can't see any advantage to creating an environment for skilled labor in the US, I don't think there is anything I can say to convince you...

Enjoy your foreign made products, hopefully you'll still be able to buy them in ten years. ;-)

[Joshua]

Actually it is the elitist agenda that believes everyone is entitled to a living wage. You sound like the populists that are running on the democratic ticket.

[Veracious Poet]

***WRONG ANSWER***

Although he mentioned some relevant issues to this discussion, that is not where the quote was extracted from. ;-)

[jpsb]

You don't "conserve wealth" by losing money paying higher labor costs than necessary.

Yes you do, Henery Ford proved that paying workers enough so that hey could buy what you produced generated demand and demand generates production and production generates wealth. Not rocket science, paying subsistence wages does not generate demand. The American miracle is the creation of an American middle class that fueled demand that was met by American industry. Yall free traders have destroyed American industry and the collaspe of the American middle class will shortly follow.

[jpsb]

Actually it is the elitist agenda that believes everyone is entitled to a living wage

LOL, good one! That why all our jobs are going to China! LOL. Yea, right! hahahaha

[Texasforever]

If you can't see any advantage to creating an environment for skilled labor in the US, I don't think there is anything I can say to convince you...

You don't get it do you. It is exactly those high skilled/high tech workers that have made offshoring of jobs economically feasible. Whether it be automated assembly lines that no longer require highly skilled workers to man them to the communications technology that allow for programmers in India to work for US based companies. The Technology boom is the "culprit", not government. High tech whiz kids are responsible for millions upon millions of “American” jobs being eliminated or automated to the point that an un-skilled Mexican peon can do the job just as well and much cheaper than an AFL/CIO worker in Detroit. If you want to blame someone blame the folks now crying that their programming jobs are going to India.

[jpsb]

It is not entirely about protectionism, it is about funding government, income taxes or tariffs. Which do you favor?

[Texasforever]

That was until the High-Tech guys automated the assembly line that sent skilled workers jobs to Mexico. You don't seem to grasp exactly why business in in business. It is NOT TO CREATE JOBS. Every manager is tasked with eliminating or automating as many jobs as possible to MAXIMIZE PROFIT. The "job" belongs to the employer to fill or not fill as he sees fit.

[Joshua]

"If you can't see any advantage to creating an environment for skilled labor in the US, I don't think there is anything I can say to convince you... "

I have run a business for the last 30 years. I,ve dealt with you so called "skilled labor". People that believe that if they show up every day the are entitled to high wages when in fact minimum wage is above what they can produce.

You're right, nothing you say can convince me and only because, with all due respect, you have no idea what you are talking about.

I'm off to bed. I have to get up in the morning I have a business to run. My employees depend on me getting enough sleep to insure everything runs smoothly so they have a place to work.

Goodnight.

[Texasforever]

It is not entirely about protectionism, it is about funding government, income taxes or tariffs. Which do you favor?

10-15% flat income tax with legislation requiring a super majority to raise. NO capital gains tax and across the board overhaul of all regulations that requires a cost benefit analysis before they are enacted.