Russia vows to destroy Chechen rebels (Russia Alert - They are bloody mad can you blame them)

Reuters UK ^ | Sun 8 February, 2004 21:48 | By Mark Trevelyan, Security Correspondent

[gdyniawitawa]

MUNICH, Germany (Reuters) - Russia's defence minister says there is a clear connection between Chechen militants and al Qaeda and has vowed that Moscow would "calmly and systematically" wipe out the rebels.

Sergei Ivanov said on Sunday Russia would never negotiate with the Chechen separatists it blames for a bomb attack on the Moscow metro that killed at least 39 people on Friday.

"Whoever hopes we will start negotiations, let them go and start negotiating with Osama bin Laden or Mullah Omar," Ivanov said, referring to the al Qaeda and Taliban leaders.

"We will not negotiate. We will destroy these people calmly and systematically," he told a news conference in Munich.

Ivanov said investigations had not yet determined whether there was a foreign or al Qaeda connection behind the Friday morning rush-hour bomb on the Moscow underground.

But he said operational and financial links between Chechen separatists and bin Laden's network had clearly been demonstrated.

"The connection of these terrorists with the Taliban and al Qaeda has long ago been proved," he said.

Fugitive Chechen separatist leader, Aslan Maskhadov, has denied he was involved in the blast and called for talks.

Maskhadov, ex-president of the rebel region, has little or no control over extremist rebels led by warlord Shamil Basayev.

Ivanov expanded on comments to the Munich Security Conference on Saturday in which he said some foreign fighters were still active in Chechnya.

He said Russian 'spetsnaz' commandos were killing several foreigners a month, and regularly encountering Turks.

"The last Turkish citizen who was killed with a gun in his hand this week in Chechnya had previously, according to his passport, visited Pakistan as a 'tourist', and our experts believe it's clear he had been in a terrorist training camp in Pakistan," Ivanov said.

He said the Turk had then entered Chechnya illegally via Georgia. Many ethnic Chechens live in Turkey.

Russia has backed the United States in its war on terror since the September 11 attacks in 2001, and has consistently depicted its struggle with Chechen militants as part of the same global battle.

It has used this to justify its military operations in Chechnya, where it has fought two wars since the collapse of the Soviet Union, despite frequent criticism from human rights groups.

Ivanov said the type of militants active in Chechnya were also to blame for attacks much further afield.

"These people, if you can call them human, move about the world and carry out similar actions in Iraq, Afghanistan, Israel, Russia and Turkey," he said.

[Polybius]

Polybius: Please don't cheer for terrorists, it's not good form.

This has nothing to do with "cheering for the terrorists".

This particular discussion started with a claim that Russia's military capabilities combined with U.S. military capabilities would somehow constitute an irresistable force.

My point is that Russia has very little capability of projecting conventional military power any significant distance beyond it's own land borders.

The bottom line is that we are going to have to do the job ourselves and not hold our collective breath awaiting for any significant military help from Russia.

The best help that Russia can offer us right now is to stop joining the French in opposing every move we make in the War on Terror as has been their policy up to now.

[missyme]

According to Prophecy Russia will turn out to be the enemy the Southern part...

[MarMema]

Whose prophecy? According to our prophecy, Russia will rise again to once more be a great Christian nation. No offense, but the one I follow is looking pretty solid these days.

[Cronos]

Only problem is: US must give up protection of Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Turks, KLA, Pakistan (good terrorists), Russia must give up protection Syria, Iran, PPK...may be more then either near sighted leadership handle...human ego what is human ego...for that Islam grow strong by playing pettiness of both on each other and do good job of the real Great Game.

Ah, there you are correct. Very, very, very correct.

US opposed Russian bombing of Taliban through UN in spring 2001...and protect Saudi from Russia and Pakistan from India daily.

how would/could Russia hit at Saudi A? BEside underminign OPEc, which Russia is already doing (hooray for Rus!)

Do you know why Russian annex Chechnya and then to Khiva? Because since 1700s Chechyns slave raid russian colonists to far north, all land north of Tarek (still now Chechnya, thanks to STalin redraw of map for allied Chechins who help him destroy Tarek Cossaks) and for thousand years slave raid to Georgia, Ossessia, Abhazia (all Orthodox land) and sell to Khiva....till 1830's Russia do punitive counter raid to punish...by 1820s decision made, enough is enough...only by annex, burning of forests, building forts and road will issue solve...and did...but then Khiva hire Azerbajanies and Turks and start all over again.

Ah, now I didn't know that. I take back my earlier statement. But why isn't this advertised more on the Media? Right now all it looks like is : Russia crushing an independence movement and them resorting to terrorism. You guys should force the liberal media to show the truth.

[Cronos]

Now, America's critics can only compare 530 deaths to Vietnam.........Well, at this rate it will take another 90 years to equal Vietnam.

There is another BIG difference between Nam and irq -- in NAM the locals didn't want us there and they mostly supported the commies. Why? Because they thought the commies were just looking for Independence from FRANCE. They saw us supporting the colonial power, FRANCE. We should never have allowed those frogs to even set foot there, they gave the wrong impression at the start and the impression stayed on right to the end. Now look at Vietnam, the folks there are hardly virulently anti-American, especially in comparison to our 'allies' FRANCE and Germany.

The Irqis WANT us there, that's why our casualties have been so low. Don't let the lib media make you think otherwise.

[RussianConservative]

Ah, now I didn't know that. I take back my earlier statement. But why isn't this advertised more on the Media? Right now all it looks like is : Russia crushing an independence movement and them resorting to terrorism. You guys should force the liberal media to show the truth.

Why is US media only seeing terroirst when US citizen killed but not when Russian, Jew, Serb, Hindu or Phillopino or Sudanese or Nigerian or Makedonian killed?

[Cronos]

Why is US media only seeing terroirst when US citizen killed but not when Russian, Jew, Serb, Hindu or Phillopino or Sudanese or Nigerian or Makedonian killed?

The US media is the liberal media. Rotten to the core. Yeah, you're right. I don't see news reports on the slavery still in practise in Sudan (black Christian slaves to ArabMuslims), the Russian and Indian points of view on thterrorism they face.

[Savage Beast]

It will be well worth the wait, but in the meantime we must remain strong and vigilant.

[LjubivojeRadosavljevic]

Yes, of course, I know.
I was using Northern Ireland as an analgoy (" a plan similar to") and not as a model to replicate for Chechnya.

Ljubivoje

[ZULU]

I hope Putin leaves Chechnya a smoking, charred, radio-active hole in the earth and we don't say one word about it - except to congratulate him.

[ZULU]

The Egyptian and Saudis have THEIR independence. Are things any different for US? WOuld YOU want an Islamic fundamentalist state sitting on OUR borders??

Let Putin nuke them. Wipe out them, their women, their children and their entire name. Send them all to Allah.

[ExSES]

Why is US media only seeing terroirst when US citizen killed but not when Russian, Jew, Serb, Hindu or Phillopino or Sudanese or Nigerian or Makedonian killed?

Simply because we have a media which (despite the fact that "THEY DOEST PROTEST TOO MUCH") is dominated by LIBERALS who are totally unable to discern the fact that there really are differences between warring parties which are based upon GOOD & EVIL.!

No conflicts amongst humans are totally defined in "TOTAL GOOD" vs "TOTAL EVIL" but..., there is always a REAL BALANCE which liberals are FAR more prone to ignore!

[zinochka]

Pathetic pictures of dismembered Chechens won't arouse any sympathy here in America any more (except among the psychopathic, suicidal, and dwindling Left, of course). Nice going Osama... your "Islamic Brothers" owe you a big debt of... of... of - ?

Right, and for more than one reason. The Chechens found in mass graves all have the Islamist "signature", heads and hands cut off. From Afghanistan to Pakistan to Caucausus, that is a traditional Wahhabi execution signature. Gulbudden Hekmattur, Afghan warlord and terrorist recently called on all mujahadeen holy warriors to "kill the American infidels and cut off their heads and hands." The Chechen civilians were probably Sufis killed by Wahhabis. Nowadays the Sufi militia headed by Kadyrov's son is rounding up sympathizers of Wahhabi rebels including probably innocent family members and killing them. Both Wahhabis and Sufis also blame Russian federal troops of copying the Islamic "signature" to blame the rebels. Chechen Wahhabi websites show plenty of mpegs of rebels cutting off heads of Russian soldiers along with all the praise for Al Quaida and Bin Laden, so it's pretty obvious who should really be blamed. There's no reasoning with terrorists!

[battousai]

Hey cowards of Spain, what do you say now? Was it Russia's involvement in Iraq that got them this bombing?

Oh thats right, Russia opposed action in Iraq, well now what's the excuse?

[zinochka]

"Russia has backed the United States in its war on terror "
Oh really... I thought Russia was dead set AGAINST Iraq War.

Well they were and are against the war in Iraq, but they have helped. David Wood, Newhouse News Service reports from Hunter Army Airfield, Ga.:

The Iraq invasion caught the Pentagon so short of military cargo planes that it had to hire Russian aircraft to ferry tanks and other materiel. "We had exhausted all of our resources," explained Mark Voorhis, a spokesman for the U.S. Air Mobility Command at Scott Air Force Base, Ill. The United States chartered Russian AN-124 aircraft for 79 missions at a cost of $28.9 million in 2003, and is still chartering them.

[zinochka]

Ah, now I didn't know that. I take back my earlier statement. But why isn't this advertised more on the Media? Right now all it looks like is : Russia crushing an independence movement and them resorting to terrorism. You guys should force the liberal media to show the truth.

I'm glad Russian Conservative took time to explain, since now I do'nt have to. Yes you are right Cronos, it is the liberal media especially CNN. Mr Jane Fonda never met a Chechen terrorist he does'nt have sympathy for. Chechnya is in a civil war between traditional Chechen Sufis and Al Quaida Wahhabis and foreign mujahadeen trying to create a Pan Islamic alliance. Chechnya is part of Russia like Siberia is, not a former Soviet republic such as Georgia or Uzbekistan, so they are as "independent" as any Russians. Many ethnic Russians live in Chechnya, including Christians who were relocated there by Stalin. You notice many Chechens have Russian names and they all speak Russian. Chechens themselves will have to help destroy the Wahhabis if they want peace with independence. And the leftist American media that loves Palestinian "militants" and Chechen "militants" should wake up call them what they are: Terrorists!

[zinochka]

As for SW...just wait and see what new Mexican majority say about Askalan...their mystic homeland. US soon have issues galore.

An exellent point! A very good comparison about Chechen Wahhabist Islamists fighting against traditional Sufi Chechens and the Russian Federal goverment to create Pan Islamic states: for hyperthetical example, Chicano "Warriors of Aztlan" fighting against traditional Catholic Chicanos and U.S. government to establish Pan Toltec religious states (California, Texas, Arizona??) for worship Huitzilopochtli, Quetzalcoatl, ect. And using terrorism, kidnapping, suicide bombing against American citizens to accomplish it!

A very good anology Russian Conservative! As a Chicana, I am impressed!

[RussianConservative]

Will the 10,000 blood sacrifice on high holy day commense again? Sick pagan religion, only Islam is bloodier.