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To: DumpsterDiver
Sabertooth, what is the point you're trying to make with this? I'm asking because if there's a message I'm supposed to be getting out of it, it has completely eluded me.

See #6.

A lot of folks have posted in this forum that the Bush proposal to legalize millions of Illegal Aliens isn't an Amnesty because the President said it wasn't, and because it's different in some significant way than the Reagan Amnesty.

As it turns out, the Reagan Amnesty wasn't self-described as an Amnesty either, nor was it different in any significant way from what President Bush is proposing.


11 posted on 01/26/2004 10:45:42 AM PST by Sabertooth (The false dilemma behind the Bush Amnesty - http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1059898/posts)
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To: Sabertooth
D'oh!

Sorta of... a rose by any other name, eh?

12 posted on 01/26/2004 11:03:24 AM PST by DumpsterDiver
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To: Sabertooth
Thanks for all your hard work on this, Sabertooth. Here is a reply I gave someone the other day who claims that if Reagan did it, then it must be right.

Our wonderful President Reagan wasn't right every time, none of us are and has not had to see for the past, what 10 years, what has happened to his California, and many other states. I would guess you don't live in a border state or a state like Oregon, where I recently "migrated" from. I became too ill to even live in my own home and had to sell it to live on. You might say I was "lucky". No, I worked and paid taxes for 30 years on that home to own it.

I watched my neighborhood, in a matter of 6 months turn into a little Tijuana...have you ever been to Tijuana? First the across the street neighbor died and her relatives sold a beautiful 2 acre lot with a small mobile to a man who imports "guest workers". There were 12 of them, and their goats, fighting chickens, "music" all night, blocking the street. They lived in the carport, the sheds, they built new sheds...LOTS of them. Then he bought another one down the street. Don't get me wrong here, they were decent people in many ways. The few who spoke English. Mostly teenage kids. The adults wouldn't speak English. I gave them a bunch of stuff and hired some of them when I moved. They didn't like the country. They liked the cities. The country was boring. Nothin' to do.

I keep asking that question and I asked one of them? , "If you wanted to leave your home so badly, why are you turning this into the same thing?" He shrugged his shoulders and said, " I don't want to be here".

I believe most "immigrants" today, don't want to be here. A number of things compel them to come.

But I can tell you this, the immigrants of today are not the immigrants of before. They came and made this country better. Most of them knew why they were here. And they left us all wealthier and better for it. Then we became politically correct. I'm glad Ronald Reagan hasn't had to see it.

I sold my property for $50,000.00 less than I would have 6 months before. A $300,000.00 new home got $195,000.00. Please don't tell me about my "zoning police". I was called a bigot. I hope I'm a good "immigrant" to my new home state. It's rather strange to be somewhere new after 56 years. I really don't want to be here. I'll try to leave it like it is or make it better and not convince the "current indigenous tribe" that they should change all their rules to suit me or be forced to put up with ill mannered, rude behaviour. And I'll stand by my new neigbors when they need me. Because that's what neighbors are supposed to do. That goes for Mexico, too. Mexicans want to be in Mexico. We should do everything we can to force that corrupt government to be a good neighbor and start taking care of it's own.

Remember NAFTA? Remember the BIG promise of NAFTA? It was going to put a stop to all this illegal immigration, because the people of Mexico would have "prosperity" and want to stay in their own homeland.

I don't pretend to be as smart as some of our politicians or know all the answers to the problem with the invasion of migrants from Mexico. But everything I've heard, including Bush's is no better than what NAFTA accomplished. and from where my vantage point is, it can be called no less than invasion. You will not get a business job unless you speak Spanish. I started hearing that 10 years ago. It's not just the service labor sector that's losing jobs, it's the secretaries, any customer service. I'll take the service job. What are the odds of my pathetic body being hired over a strong, young "guest worker". That proposal might work, if we were talking say, 5% of the population. You have to realize in places, even like So. Oregon, we're talking 10 to 20% of the population and growing every day. It's the worst unemployment in the nation. We have an incredible Mexican Mafia situation. And great welfare. Assimilation? Not happenin'.

13 posted on 01/26/2004 11:05:28 AM PST by AuntB (REFORM SS DISABILITY: http://www.petitiononline.com/SSDC/petition.html)
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To: Sabertooth
If I understand what's in this thread, the concludion is that Enforcement is the key -- it was lacking after Reagan's effort, and it's hard to see it will be any better this time. The border is too long to stop them coming in -- the only solution is to arrest and deport those who are aprehended without papers. But first we have to give the limited number allowed tostay some papers......
16 posted on 01/26/2004 11:27:25 AM PST by expatpat
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To: Sabertooth
As it turns out, the Reagan Amnesty wasn't self-described as an Amnesty either, nor was it different in any significant way from what President Bush is proposing.

The Bush proposal, as was the Reagan proposal, is amnesty on the installment plan. The politicos believe that most people are too stupid to discern this truth if the proposal is camouflaged with words such as "temporary" or "guest worker."

25 posted on 01/26/2004 2:13:25 PM PST by Kevin Curry (Dems' magnificent four: Shrieking Nikita, Frenchie La Lurch , Gen. Jack D. Ripper, and Lionel Putz)
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