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To: Swordmaker
It is you, Race, who is reading into words in the New Testement meanings that ARE NOT THERE. It is you who is confabulating Egyptian burial practices with Jewish

Wow. The story of two Jewish men, as recorded in the Bible, are actually EGYPTIAN?? Jesus was buried according to EGYPTIAN custom? Lazarus, too?

It is YOU, Race, that is making an extraordinary claim. It is you who is claiming, against all Biblical scholarship, that the Christians who for 2000 years have observed Good Friday as the day of Jesus's crucifixion, are wrong.

No, they didnt observe this for 2000 years at all.

Good Friday

The Friday before Easter, the day in the Holy Week on which the yearly commemoration of the Crucifixion of Jesus Christ is observed. As early as the 2nd century, there are references to fasting and penance on this day by Christians, who, since the time of the early church, had observed every Friday as a fast day in memory of the Crucifixion. In the Roman rite of the Roman Catholic Church, the liturgical service for Good Friday has been in approximately the same form for centuries, the notable difference since 1955 being the communion of the people. The liturgy, now celebrated after 3 pm, consists of three distinct parts: readings and prayers (including the Passion according to St. John), the veneration of the cross, and the communion (in place of the Liturgy of the pre-sanctified which developed in the Middle Ages). Non-liturgical devotions such as the Way of the Cross, and the Three Hours Service were introduced in the Roman Catholic Church after the Protestant Reformation and are still observed in some places. The Three Hours Service is a three-hour-long service consisting of sermons, hymns, and prayers centered round Christ's "seven last words on the Cross." It takes place from 12 noon to 3 pm on Good Friday.

Easter Origin - Christ Revealed in the Jewish Passover Easter origin can be traced to the Passover ceremony itself. Christian scholars believe that the Old Testament is Christ concealed, while the New Testament is Christ revealed. Let's hold the elements of the Passover up to the light of the life of Christ. By tradition, the lamb to be sacrificed during the Passover was selected four days before the sacrifice was to be made. Jesus rode into Jerusalem four days before He was crucified. The lamb was customarily slain at 3 p.m. on Passover. Jesus uttered the words "it is finished" and died on the cross at 3 p.m. (this is known traditionally as Good Friday, but many Bible scholars have determined the crucifixion to be on a Wednesday or Thursday). The festival of Unleavened Bread began at sunset. One of the rituals involved the sacrifice of a grain offering, representing the first fruits of the harvest. Jesus, according to the Apostle Paul, became the first fruits of those raised from the dead (1 Corinthians 15:20). During the Passover dinner, three matzahs are put together. Christians see these matzahs as representative of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The middle matzah is broken, as Christ said at the Last Supper, "This is My body, broken for you." The middle matzah is also striped and pierced, as Jesus was during His crucifixion, and as was prophesied in Isaiah 53:5, Psalm 22:16 and Zechariah 12:10. This matzah is then wrapped in a white cloth and hidden, just as Christ was wrapped in linen and laid in the tomb.">

It is the Friday before Easter that was always a fast day, but it was NOT always the day that was observed as the day of the Crucifixion.

It is you who insists on applying a Western mind set to an inherently Eastern document.

No, I apply the known, proven definition of the word, something quite simple actually.

It is you who idly sweeps aside 100 years of scholarly research on the Shroud, dismissing it as Jesus's Shroud, merely on YOUR interpretation of words in an ENGLISH Bible.

No, I just apply simple Biblical logic to the fairy tale that this piece of cloth which is nothing ore than an archaelogical oddity that many people have been foolish to believe is a relic similar to the other relics of a particular faith.

God very many times in the past destroyed certain people's bodies to prevent the use of the bones as relics, such as Moses. To then take whatever you can and somehow apply it to Jesus makes those items an idol, and people go and worship it as something that is supposed to help them build up their faith.

That is what an idol is.

86 posted on 01/24/2004 10:40:33 AM PST by RaceBannon
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To: RaceBannon; aruanan
Wow. The story of two Jewish men, as recorded in the Bible, are actually EGYPTIAN?? Jesus was buried according to EGYPTIAN custom? Lazarus, too?

Did I say that? No, I did not. I said that YOU were confabulating (that means combining one thing into another) Egyptian burial practices with Jewish to come up with things like extra cloths, etc. The Egyptian mode of burial is the source of the idea that there were MANY cloths involved with the burial of Jesus. I have had this same discussion with others before, some of which claim the Bible says that Jesus and Lazarus were wrapped up in bandage like strips.

This is another example of you reading something into words that is not there.

Your little Good Friday cuts and pastes are interesting... but irrelevant to this thread, except for YOUR attempts to hijack this discussion to YOUR agenda. I read your thesis and found very little in it of value. I certainly did not want to discuss your errors in depth here. This is not about RaceBannon's pet theory of "Good Wednesday;" it is a thread about the Shroud of Turin."

God very many times in the past destroyed certain people's bodies to prevent the use of the bones as relics, such as Moses. To then take whatever you can and somehow apply it to Jesus makes those items an idol, and people go and worship it as something that is supposed to help them build up their faith. That is what an idol is.

Do you see anyone here "Worshiping" the Shroud of Turin? I don't. We are having a discussion on the possible provenance of the Shroud. I do not worship it... I worship Jesus Christ.

God very many times in the past destroyed certain people's bodies to prevent the use of the bones as relics, such as Moses.

Again, you read things that are not there... and now you claim to know God's motives. Amazing.

Excuse, but this mantra of yours, that I am ignoring your false evidence that I have clearly disproved, rings hollow, as you have not countered any Biblical fact I presented, and observers can see that.

Now you are calling me a liar. Nothing I have posted on here is "false," Race. I can provided source material for everything I have posted... and have done so. Your "disproving" consists of your one note repetition of your OPINION and YOUR interpretation of the facts... without supporting material. That disproves nothing... it just proves you are not willing to consider anything other than your opinion.

I have shown you the words in the Koine Greek original texts... you have shown me the King James Bible. I have shown you the various interpretations possible of the Koine Greek words in the original texts... you have shown me the King James Bible.

I have shown you the most common ENGLISH definitions and usages of the words you are reading in the King James Bible and you insist on narrowly defining them using tertiary or even quaternary meanings to get the interpretation YOU WANT IT TO BE. This is contrary to all rules of exegesis. If you want to believe that your ENGLISH LANGUAGE Bible is the most accurate source of what happened in the first Century AD that was first recorded in Koine Greek writings, I will not argue with you any further because your mind is completely closed.

If you want to argue Good Wednesday, go start your own thread about it. Don't hijack this one. Good bye.

90 posted on 01/24/2004 2:46:37 PM PST by Swordmaker (This tagline shut down for renovations and repairs. Re-open June of 2001.)
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