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Monument at City Hall is removed (Winston-Salem)
Winston-Salem Journal ^ | 1/20/04 | Theo Helm

Posted on 01/20/2004 1:01:12 PM PST by Rebelbase

City Council member Robinson placed 1-ton marker bearing Ten Commandments yesterday

A seven-man crew removed a monument of the Ten Commandments late this morning from in front of City Hall that had been illegally placed there the day before by City Council Member Vernon Robinson.

City workers removed the 1-ton marker on the order of City Manager Bill Stuart. They used a backhoe to slowly carry the two-piece monument to a trailer attached to a city truck.

Robinson was not at the scene.

The truck was taking the monument to a warehouse in the City Yard, where it would stay "until the owner comes and claims it," said Carrie Collins, the city's marketing and communications director.

Collins said she would not know how much it cost to move the monument until the crew finished. She said that city officials had not decided whether Robinson would pay for its removal.

Robinson did not return a phone call for comment. His spokesman, Chris Younce, said that Robinson was talking to city officials about the next step and would be at the city council's meeting tonight.

The monument violated two city policies. One requires any displays honoring public officials to be approved by the council. The other requires permission from the city manager to place a display in city-owned facilities.

An inscription on the monument says: "A project of Councilman Vernon L. Robinson, January 2004."

Robinson was part of the unanimous vote on Sept. 15 that approved the policies.

City officials all criticized Robinson for his action Monday, when city hall was closed and the community was celebrating Martin Luther King Jr. Day.

"Obviously if you are going to do something like this, this is not the right way to do it," Mayor Allen Joines said. "We are working hard to bring the city together. Actions like this tend to push people apart."

"This is just politics as usual," City Council Member Dan Besse said. "Another political stunt."

Robinson, a Republican candidate for the 5th Congressional District seat, has frequently been the target of complaints from his peers for grandstanding, and campaigning from his council seat.

City Attorney Ron Seeber said people who want to put a permanent marker on city property must petition the council for approval.

Robinson he didn’t get permission to put up the 4-foot granite marker because he didn’t know the procedure. Although he admitted that he has had the idea since October, he said he couldn’t find out what the procedure was because of "timing," declining to explain further.

Robinson also said that his announcement was not intended to clash with King Day celebrations. He defended his decision to act when City Hall was closed, saying that he wanted the presentation to be a "surprise to the city and citizens of Winston-Salem."

Robinson said that his idea for the marker came from a conversation with Roy Moore, the former chief justice of Alabama. Moore was ousted as chief justice last November after repeatedly refusing to remove a Ten Commandments monument from the state judicial building.

Robinson had asked the city council in September to consider a resolution requesting that Joines offer to have the Alabama monument shipped to Winston-Salem and displayed here at the expense of private donors.

No one on the council responded.

Robinson said he then decided to pay $2,000 for his own marker. David Maynard, a local Baptist preacher and monument dealer, arranged a contract for the marker, which was made in Georgia.

The Ten Commandments are inscribed on the side of the monument facing Main Street. An abbreviated version of the Bill of Rights is inscribed on the side facing City Hall. Below the Ten Commandments is an inscription that says: "A project of Councilman Vernon Robinson, January 2004."

Robinson said Monday he believes that the marker is constitutional because it is not publicly funded or overtly religious.

"This monument is not an effort to proselytize; it is a history lesson," he said. "Atheists may complain about history, but the words are still history."

Others said they believed Robinson was only out for publicity.

"I’m afraid my colleague has neglected to read the Second Commandment," Besse said. "He has made himself a graven image to political ambition."

If getting publicity was behind Robinson’s actions, he would not acknowledge it Monday.

"I don’t know that it will have any effect on the campaign," he said.

Robinson’s opponents weren’t so sure. Although they said they supported the public display of the Ten Commandments, several said they didn’t like how Robinson went about it.

"I don’t know that this kind of grandstanding promotes the understanding of our heritage," said state Sen. Virginia Foxx of Banner Elk. She said the monument would be more sincere if it was erected by someone who isn’t running for office.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; US: North Carolina
KEYWORDS: nc05; northcarolina; oldnorthstate; tencommandments; unhelpful; vernonrobinson
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Robinson got his $2000 worth of publicity.
1 posted on 01/20/2004 1:01:15 PM PST by Rebelbase
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To: Constitution Day
NC ping please.
2 posted on 01/20/2004 1:01:49 PM PST by Rebelbase
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To: Rebelbase
Wow, that was quick.

Hitting the NC list now...

3 posted on 01/20/2004 1:04:57 PM PST by Constitution Day
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To: *Old_North_State; **North_Carolina; mykdsmom; 100%FEDUP; 2ndMostConservativeBrdMember; ~Vor~; ...
NC ping!
Please FRmail me if you want to be added to or removed from this North Carolina ping list.
4 posted on 01/20/2004 1:06:23 PM PST by Constitution Day
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To: Rebelbase
What a waste of time. Wonder if there's a way to impeach or recall this idiot.
5 posted on 01/20/2004 1:07:13 PM PST by Modernman (Providence protects idiots, drunkards, children and the United States of America- Otto von Bismarck)
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To: Constitution Day
City Council meeting tonight in Winston Salem at 6:30 PM.

It ain't over yet.
6 posted on 01/20/2004 1:07:23 PM PST by ConservativeGadfly
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To: ConservativeGadfly
And by the way, it was not, as the article said, "illegally placed." The City Attorney has not been able to cite one ordinance that determines that the monument was "illegally placed."
7 posted on 01/20/2004 1:09:10 PM PST by ConservativeGadfly
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To: Rebelbase
Robinson he didn’t get permission to put up the 4-foot granite marker because he didn’t know the procedure.

Reporter he didn't get job because he didn't know the grammar.

8 posted on 01/20/2004 1:10:47 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: ConservativeGadfly
Thanks for the info.
9 posted on 01/20/2004 1:14:29 PM PST by Constitution Day
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To: Modernman
Who? Robinson?
10 posted on 01/20/2004 1:15:34 PM PST by Future Snake Eater ("Oh boy, I can't wait to eat that monkey!"--Abe Simpson)
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To: Constitution Day
"Atheists may complain about history..."

How prophetically spoken. Now his monument's history.

11 posted on 01/20/2004 1:16:50 PM PST by azhenfud ("He who is always looking up seldom finds others' lost change...")
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To: Modernman
"What a waste of time. Wonder if there's a way to impeach or recall this idiot."

So says you. You sound like the RINOs in the Forsyth County GOP organization.

Vernon made his point. The only waste of time was committed by the City in removing it. There will be local repercussions, count on it.
12 posted on 01/20/2004 1:18:11 PM PST by NCSteve
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To: Modernman
What a waste of time

Yeah, big waste of time. Imagine, someone that still thinks you can display the Ten Commandments, and in public even < /sarcasm>

This gentleman is standing up to his name as the next Jesse Helms. Just disappointed he's not running for Senate in 2004. Well perhaps he could be convinced to replace the Senator that's up for reelection in 2008

13 posted on 01/20/2004 1:18:21 PM PST by billbears (Deo Vindice.)
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To: Future Snake Eater
Who? Robinson?

Yup. I'm not attacking his religious beliefs- I'm attacking his placing of a monument on public property without any authority to do so. I think I'll go down to the courthouse and place a personal monument tonight....

14 posted on 01/20/2004 1:20:55 PM PST by Modernman (Providence protects idiots, drunkards, children and the United States of America- Otto von Bismarck)
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To: ConservativeGadfly
"It ain't over yet."

True, the monument may be gone, but Robinson will be remembered as a monumental guy.

15 posted on 01/20/2004 1:21:01 PM PST by azhenfud ("He who is always looking up seldom finds others' lost change...")
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To: NCSteve
Vernon made his point. The only waste of time was committed by the City in removing it. There will be local repercussions, count on it.

Yup. His point being- Republicans can grandstand as well as Democrats.

16 posted on 01/20/2004 1:22:03 PM PST by Modernman (Providence protects idiots, drunkards, children and the United States of America- Otto von Bismarck)
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To: billbears
Yeah, big waste of time. Imagine, someone that still thinks you can display the Ten Commandments, and in public even

You're free to put up the TC in public. You're not free to do it on public land without, at the very least, the permission of the public entity that owns that land. What gives him the right to do so? If he can put this monument up, why can't every other citizen put up whatever they want on public property?

17 posted on 01/20/2004 1:24:20 PM PST by Modernman (Providence protects idiots, drunkards, children and the United States of America- Otto von Bismarck)
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To: Modernman
"I'm attacking his placing of a monument on public property without any authority to do so."

So you worship at the altar of the almighty bureaucracy. Vernon happens to worship at a different altar.

Why would he need permission to put up something like that in a place that he (along with the rest of us) supposedly owns?
18 posted on 01/20/2004 1:25:23 PM PST by NCSteve
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To: ConservativeGadfly
I suppose that the litter laws wouldn't apply, though I consider this to be a solid waste of time. He puts a four foot tall slab of stone in the middle of the walkway, centered with the steps of the building.

If this was a gay veteran memorial, everyone would be screaming about it. He wanted attention and fame and to cash in on Judge Roy's bandwagon. Probably the best $2000 he ever spent.
19 posted on 01/20/2004 1:26:07 PM PST by kingu (Remember: Politicians and members of the press are going to read what you write today.)
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To: Modernman; ConservativeGadfly
Well, like ConservativeGadfly mentioned, there has yet to be a city ordinance dug up that prohibits his doing so. Until then it smacks of your average Christian-hunt. SSDD from our elected officials, the purveyors of "equality" and "freedom."
20 posted on 01/20/2004 1:26:51 PM PST by Future Snake Eater ("Oh boy, I can't wait to eat that monkey!"--Abe Simpson)
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