Communion ban on lawmakers who back abortion starts furor

Chicago Sun-Times ^ | January 11, 2004 | Juliet Williams (A.P.)

[Holly_P]

MILWAUKEE -- A Roman Catholic bishop who waded into politics with a decree that lawmakers who support abortion rights can no longer receive holy communion has ignited a debate over the separation of church and state.

Bishop Raymond Burke of La Crosse cited Vatican doctrine, canon law and teachings by the U.S. bishops in an announcement telling diocesan priests to withhold communion from such lawmakers until they ''publicly renounce'' their support of abortion rights.

''This is about as stark a decree to come down against Catholic politicians as we've seen in recent history,'' said Barry Lynn, executive director of the Washington, D.C.-based Americans United for the Separation of Church and State.

''The problem with it is that elected officials have to represent people of all faiths and none, and not adhere to one religious demand like the bishop's,'' he said.

Pope John Paul II appointed Burke, 55, archbishop of St. Louis in December. Burke signed the decree in November, when he still had the authority to do so, but it was not made public until Thursday.

Burke is to be installed in St. Louis on Jan. 26 -- raising concerns among opponents that he may issue the same decree there.

The Vatican and U.S. bishops have urged Catholic legislators to consider their faith when they vote, and a task force is weighing whether to recommend sanctions for Catholic politicians who support policies contrary to church teachings.

In November, Burke wrote letters to at least three Catholic lawmakers, telling them they risked being forbidden from taking the sacrament by continuing to vote for measures he termed anti-life, including abortion and euthanasia.

Democratic U.S. Rep. David Obey, who received a letter from Burke, said Friday that he respects the sacred oath he took to uphold the U.S. Constitution. Obey said Burke can instruct him on faith and morals in his private life, but should use ''persuasion, not dictation'' to affect his political votes.

He said Burke had ''crossed the line.''

[Montfort]

I was hoping something like that would be the case. So you are saying that the Church's stance against abortion is doctrine, but the church's stance against the death penalty is not doctrine?

[mercy]

What a joke. If their faith meant a hill of beans to them they would not be pro abortion. Guess they'll just have to become Episcopal.

[ninenot]

Jim, you recognize that the spin on this story is being handed to the "reporter" by the Democrats who were recipients of Burke's letter.

Nowhere will you read about MORAL law--but you'll hear a lot about the Constitution, Democracy, the Sacred Trust of Representation, etc., etc.

Smell from Obey even carries down to Milwaukee on the wind.

[spunkets]

"What does politics have to do with communion?"

In the case of politicians like Obey, the church attendance and participation is a front and is used as part of their con. Their exists a right to life, not a right to kill babies because they are an inconvenience.

[Polybius]

A Roman Catholic bishop who waded into politics with a decree that lawmakers who support abortion rights can no longer receive holy communion has ignited a debate over the separation of church and state.

There is no conflict here.

The Catholic Church has absolutely no power to legislate in the U.S. and the politicians have an absolute right to find another Church that does not believe that abortion is a sin.

[Happy2BMe]

MILWAUKEE -- A Roman Catholic bishop who waded into politics with a decree that lawmakers who support abortion rights can no longer receive holy communion has ignited a debate over the separation of church and state.

I salute and greatly admire this champion of right, decency, morality, and the right of the unborn to live.

BRAVO and God forever bless this great and wonderful man!

[Happy2BMe]

ouch!

Those bishops who remained silent against the Nazi butchery are no doubt paying their dues now and for a long, long time to come.

Thank God Almighty spiritual and moral courage may finally be being rebirthed in the Catholic Church.

I say BRAVO. I say Praise God!

[ninenot]

Re abortion you are correct. Deliberate killing of ANY innocent is murder. Doctrine.

Re: death penalty: the Church, DOCTRINALLY, recognizes that the State has the authority to use the death penalty. Never has changed--it's still in the Catechism.

However, the current Pope really, really, really, really, REALLY wants States to abandon the DP and use life-in-jail instead. He claims (justifiably) that in most Western countries, there's enough money to keep a prisoner for life.

But JPII cannot change the doctrine.

Same-o with war. The war must be a "Just War." (Don't have time to cite the stuff for you, but Google...) Now in the case of Iraq, the Pope's prudential judgment was that the justification for the action was not sufficient for the action we took.

GWB's prudential judgment was that the justification WAS sufficient.

Were we to have nuked every square foot of Iraq to prosecute the war, that would be UN-just. (Collateral damage must consciously be minimized...)

The Pope prefers not-war solutions, but does not have a DOCTRINAL basis for condemning this war.

[BlessedBeGod]

From the Catechism:

2266 Preserving the common good of society requires rendering the aggressor unable to inflict harm. For this reason the traditional teaching of the Church has acknowledged as well-founded the right and duty of legitimate public authority to punish malefactors by means of penalties commensurate with the gravity of the crime, not excluding, the death penalty.

Hope that helps. :-)

[A. Pole]

A Roman Catholic bishop who waded into politics with a decree that lawmakers who support abortion rights can no longer receive holy communion has ignited a debate over the separation of church and state.

Some people think that this so called "separation of church and state" means that the Church may not refuse the sacraments to the people in power. Weird.

[mware]

I salute and greatly admire this champion of right, decency, morality, and the right of the unborn to live.

I could not swear that the late Cardinal O Connor refused to give communion to Geraldno Ferrio, but I do know that she was not premitted to speak at St Patricks.

The only way Bill Clinton got into St Patricks was when the good Cardinal was dead and he could no longer stop him.

[e5man_r_u?]

Very true. Statements not made ex cathedra by the Pope should be carfully listened to and considered. They are not doctrinal teaching. The Church's doctrine on birth control and abortion is and binding to all Catholics.

[Happy2BMe]

'The only way Bill Clinton got into St Patricks was when the good Cardinal was dead and he could no longer stop him.'

We can only pray that God will raise up more godly men such as Bishop Raymond Burke of La Crosse.

God is God, and He does not change. This abomnination of abortion is the darkest blot on our nation's conscience and continuing to remain silent does nothing but endorse it and will surely bring the wrath of God down on the entire nation.

[muir_redwoods]

My understanding is that such people are regarded as Catholics but the church retains the right to avoid scandal (in it's original meaning of leading others into sin) by refusing the sacraments to such people who hold anathema beliefs and, more importantly, anathema public stances.

[William Tell]

The oath of office for Congressional seats is as follows:

I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God."

Why would anyone who supports abortion ask for the help of God. I can't imagine such help being afforded.

[dangus]

They are excommunicated. In spite of that, they've been able to receive communion. This is the bishop saying, "look, these guys ain't Catlicks; quit treating them like they are."

(I forget the Latin terms, but there are two types of ex-communication: You can personally be named for your unique offenses, or you can belong to a group which has been excommunicated. Pro-abortion politicians were already excommunicated, but idiot leftist priests kept giving them communion. The bishop has simply instructed the priests to quit it.)

[dangus]

Don't worry...

The Pope has made plain that abortion is a special case. While he has a strong *opinion* on the war, just war theory specifically states that it is the STATE and NOT the CHURCH which has ULTIMATE authority for declaring when the conditions for a just war exist. Furthermore, even just war "theory" is just that: a theory. The Church has never (and could never) make just war theory, or anti-war doctrine, infallible.

The Pope has specifically stated that social and economic policies are issues of stewardship and judgment, whereas permitting the slaughter of human beings is *intrinsically* evil.

[Dan from Michigan]

Someone should send a letter to PBA supporter and "Catholic" Jenny Granholm.....

[Snuffington]

Democratic U.S. Rep. David Obey, who received a letter from Burke, said Friday that he respects the sacred oath he took to uphold the U.S. Constitution.

This is more than a little infuriating. He claims the right to ignore his Church on the basis that he made a sacred oath. In other words the sacred is meaningless to him, unless it serves his political interests.

[Montfort]

You answer helps a lot, as do the other great answers.

It is nice that the correct answer happens to be what I hoped would be the case.