Diocese targets Granholm on abortion

The Detroit News ^ | Friday, January 9, 2004 | Kim Kozlowski

[nickcarraway]

Detroit Cardinal Adam Maida will challenge the state

[nickcarraway]

ping

[Support Free Republic]

Rank	Location	Receipts	Donors/Avg		Freepers/Avg		Monthlies
26	Oregon	325.00	10	32.50	218	1.49	85.00	5

Thanks for donating to Free Republic!

Move your locale up the leaderboard!

[I still care]

“I am sure the governor clearly understands his position,” said Liz Boyd, spokeswoman for Granholm. “She would hope that he would understand hers as well.”


And her position is, that as a Democrat, there will be hell to pay if she votes against abortion. After all, she can't risk her job.

I am constantly amazed at people who say they are Catholics and yet don't seem to understand or approve of Catholic doctrine at all. There are plenty of faiths that allow abortion, for goodness sake they should go out and find one.

But stop calling themselves Catholic, because they aren't.

[Dan from Michigan]

I'll be the first to admit that I'm not the best Catholic around, but there is no way I'd back abortion.

[Salvation]

Catholics and Politicians -- some other references:

The Deadly Dozen

Canadian Prime Minister Taunts Church: "I Am A Catholic And For Abortion"
Catholic Church asks Tom Daschle to stop calling himself a Catholic
On Catholic Politicians and Faith
Vatican Urges Catholic Politicians to Vote Along Church Lines
Senator Santorum on Being Catholic and a Politician
William E. Simon, Sr. and Jr. Devout Catholics, Philanthropists and Politicians
Deadly Dozen senator taken to task over claims of Catholicism
THE BISHOP AND THE SENATOR [author links to FR thread regarding Daschle in her online column]
Blood On Their Hands: Exposing Pro-abortion Catholic Politicians
MI Gov Granholm Proclaims June "Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual and Transgender Pride Month"
Colorado Governor To Media:'WE LOVE OUR CHURCH' [Gov. Bill Owens
U.S. Senator Brownback and Commentator Dick Morris Join Catholic Church
PRIEST REFUSES COMMUNION TO KNEELING PRO-LIFE POLITICIAN [Richard Black, Virginia]
Kerry [Catholic} says he'll filibuster Supreme Court nominees who do not support abortion rights
Pope to MPs: Stop gay marriage
Vatican - Considerations regarding ... homosexual persons
CONFUSIONS ABOUT POLITICAL JUDGMENT AND THE MORAL LAW
Prelate says politicians who back abortion shouldn't go to Communion
Bishop draws fire for targeting Chrétien
Kennedy likens Vatican stance on gay unions to 'bigotry' (oh, go get a job, you little creep)
Ignorance or Malicious Intent? "No religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to..."
George Weigel on Authentic Catholic Citizenship, and the Duty of Catholic Politicians to Behave as Catholics
Conservative Catholics urge Church to challenge "dissenters"
[Robert F., Jr.] Kennedy to speak at Festival of Faiths (Environmentalism as religion)
Faithful Catholic Politicians
Catholic Bishops Eye Possible Crackdown of Pro-Abortion Pols
PETITION TO EX-COMMUNICATE PRO-ABORTION CATHOLIC ELECTED OFFICIALS
It is Time to Excommunicate the Politicians
Church vows to fight gay marriage: Catholics pressure pols
Should politicians toe their church line?
Church May Penalize Politicans
Catholic politicians facing dogmatic threat
Bishop appeals to Catholic lawmakers [Wisconsin]
New St. Louis Catholic Archbishop Warns Pro-Abortion Catholic Politicians of Excommunication.
Bishop Objected to AIDS Walk
Wisconsin Catholic Lawmakers Seek Victim Status In Feud With Bishop
Bishop Burke discusses the letters he sent to Catholic politicians
Congressman Places Internal Pro-Abortion Docs in Congressional Record
Flynn: Dems ignore Catholics
Granholm gay rights order "a slap in the face"
Calif. Bishop To Gov. Davis: Pick Abortion Or Communion [formal excommunication?]
California Bishop to Gov: Oppose Abortion or No Communion (New Title)
Sacramento Bishop Challenges Governor on Abortion; Tells Davis to Stop Receiving Communion
Granholm's Bible-thumping Sure to Rile GOP
Bishop: No Communion for Abortion Backers
Legislators can't have Eucharist, bishop says: Don't serve supporters of abortion rights, euthanasia
Wisc. Bishop Tells Pro-Abort. Catholic Pols: Change Your Stripes or Stay Away from Holy Communion
Diocese targets Granholm on abortion

[Salvation]

A bump for cardinal Maida!

[Kudsman]

Born and Unborn.

[Kudsman]

Mama,

Sorry I borrowed your pledge from yesterday's finest, but I felt the need to recite it as we do as Knights.

[Miggsathon]

I'm against abortion too, but would you say someone's not Catholic if he supports the death penalty? Or supports the war in Iraq? Or opposes welfare? The Catholic church talks about all those things. I'm not a Catholic; I'm just saying I bet you're being selective. I'm against abortion regardless of what Catholics say about it.

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the ping!

[Canticle_of_Deborah]

Take the next step. Deny her Communion and threaten excommunication.

[Mr. Silverback]

ProLife Ping!

If anyone wants on or off my ProLife Ping List, please notify me here or by freepmail.

[nickcarraway]

Right to Life of Michigan

[I still care]

I have to say I feel abortion is in a totally different catagory than something like welfare.

I am not Catholic, but I am a committed Evangelical Christian. I would not say a person is not a Christian if they support abortion, but I would wonder about their understanding of the Bible and God's word.

If that was the lone problem, that would be one thing. Nobody has perfect understanding. But usually people who say they are Christians yet support abortion have a whole host of areas where they have problems with what scripture says. If you question them, it usually comes down to they don't really believe that the bible is completely true, and sometimes they don't even believe Jesus is God.

I have met many pro-choice "Catholics" that when I start questioning them this turns out to be the case. They are just sort of "used" to being Catholic, they are not one out of any personal conviction.

Dean is a classic example. He says he is a Christian, yet with every word that comes out of his mouth he shows his complete ignorance of what Jesus taught.

[Miggsathon]

I agree that a lot of pro-choice Catholics are not really faithful -- they just grew up being called Catholic and came to accept that identity. I know other pro-choice Catholics who are very faithful -- raise their kids to be believers, attend church every week, teach Bible study, whatever. I think some evangelicals are being genuine when they accuse others of not being "real Christians" or even, a bit outside their own realm, "real Catholics." But others just have an agenda.

Abortion is NOT in a different category than welfare in one crucial respect: the Catholic church has long expressed support for enlarging the welfare state, just as it has expressed opposition to abortion. The Catholic church is also explicitly opposed to the death penalty and to any wars (like the one in Iraq) that don't meet certain criteria. Most evangelical Christians take the "conservative" position on all those: support for the death penalty, support for pretty much any war the president says we need, and opposition to the welfare state. And that's fine -- all perfectly justifiable positions. Just acknowledge that, by an orthodox definition, no Catholic could stray from the Church on any of those other doctrines, either.

Again, I'm no Catholic, so I don't feel the need to do what the Church says.

[I still care]

See, now I have not yet met a pro-choice Catholic that really seems involved with their faith in a personal way. Oh, they may send their kids to Catholic School, and mass, and participate in Bingo night, but I have not met any that, for instance, do regular scripture study with their kids or homeschool.

I have met homeschooling Catholics that hold are prolife. I have never asked them their opinion on the war or the death penalty; I think I will!

[Mama_Bear]

I am flattered that you would want to use it. You are welcome to any of my pledge graphics.

[nickcarraway]

You may be operating under a very faulty impression of Catholic teaching, even if some Catholics gave you this impression. There is no Catholic teaching that says you have to support welfare. For that matter, Catholic teaching does not prohibit the state from instituting the death penalty. The Pope has said that he believes that the death penalty is no longer necessary, given modern situations. But this does not mean a Catholic who is in favor of a just death penalty is against Church teaching. And Catholic teaching on just war is extremely complex. Some Catholics have argued the war in Iraq is not a just war; others have argued that it is. Neither opinion is necessary to be following Church teaching.

Abortion however, has been recognized as wrong, even as far a pre-Christian Judaism. In Christian teaching it was already recognized as an evil by the Didache, written in 70 A.D.

[nickcarraway]

Abortion is NOT in a different category than welfare in one crucial respect: the Catholic church has long expressed support for enlarging the welfare state, just as it has expressed opposition to abortion. The Catholic church is also explicitly opposed to the death penalty and to any wars (like the one in Iraq) that don't meet certain criteria. Most evangelical Christians take the "conservative" position on all those: support for the death penalty, support for pretty much any war the president says we need, and opposition to the welfare state. And that's fine -- all perfectly justifiable positions. Just acknowledge that, by an orthodox definition, no Catholic could stray from the Church on any of those other doctrines, either.

I strongly disagree with this paragraph.