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To: tpaine; Hon; sinkspur

The facts of the political situation are clear.. Neither our 'representitives', nor our courts, -- will address the issue of constitutional violations.

A red herring & irrelavent to the issue at hand as the power of Congress to tax is unquestionable and clearly enumerated in the Constitution.

Constitution for the United States of America:

Aa I remarked at #133:

One of the important functions of a jury is to corral in government people who are running astray. Its a very important function.

You have not demonstrated that the government is running astray insofar as the income and payroll taxes are concerned. The power to levy and collect taxes on the individual by the national government is clear and incontestable, and has been from the very first tax case before the Supreme Court:

Hylton v. United States(1796), 3 U.S. 171

  • "A general power is given to Congress, to lay and collect taxes, of every kind or nature, without any restraint, except only on exports; but two rules are prescribed for their government, namely, uniformity and apportionment: Three kinds of taxes, to wit, duties, imposts, and excises by the first rule, and capitation, or other direct taxes, by the second rule. "
  • "the present Constitution was particularly intended to affect individuals, and not states, except in particular cases specified: And this is the leading distinction between the articles of Confederation and the present Constitution."
  • "Uniformity is an instant operation on individuals, without the intervention of assessments, or any regard to states,"
  • As well as clearly exemplified in the arguments of the founders in the Federalist Papers and the constitutional debates:

    James Madison, Federalist #39:

    James Madison, Federalist #45:

    James Madison, Elliots Debates Vol 3 p128:

    Our only recourse is jury nullification..

    False, as this is a Republic afterall and recource is to be had in the particular instance through the legislative process necessary to functioning under the Constitution.

     

    MCCRAY v. U S, 195 U.S. 27 (1904)

    However if you can establish a level of abuse beyound the principles stated by the early Supreme Court, then the tax law can be overturned.

    MCCRAY v. U S, 195 U.S. 27 (1904)

     


    -- And surprise! -- The selfsame people at FR who argue for prohibitions & insane tax codes , argue against nullification.

    Since I do not see anyone arguing for prohibitions nor insane tax codes, your statement is a is more hot air, and calling for jury nullification of constitutional statutes merely because one is dissatisfied with the operation of that law with regard to themselves is merely self interest looking for another avenue of expression.

    Yet they call thenselves conservatives. Go figure.

    The operation and preservation of law as opposed arbitrary action of the individual is a conservative position. Arbitrary application of law and the whims of men is a value of the anarchist, not that of the conservative.

    244 posted on 01/08/2004 6:12:52 PM PST by ancient_geezer
    [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 216 | View Replies ]


    To: ancient_geezer
    The facts of the political situation are clear.. Neither our 'representitives', nor our courts, -- will address the issue of constitutional violations.

    A red herring & irrelavent to the issue at hand as the power of Congress to tax is unquestionable and clearly enumerated in the Constitution. Constitution for the United States of America

    Taxation is not the issue. Abuse of the taxing power is our subject.

    You have not demonstrated that the government is running astray insofar as the income and payroll taxes are concerned. The power to levy and collect taxes on the individual by the national government is clear and incontestable, and has been from the very first tax case before the Supreme Court.

    The abuse of power is self evident to all rational men.
    Our only recourse is jury nullification..

    False, as this is a Republic afterall and recource is to be had in the particular instance through the legislative process necessary to functioning under the Constitution.

    Our legislative process is broken. Partisan politics rule. We lack viable recourse.
      - And surprise! -- The selfsame people at FR who argue for prohibitions & insane tax codes , argue against nullification.

    Since I do not see anyone arguing for prohibitions nor insane tax codes,

    Look in the mirror, geezer.

    your statement is a is more hot air, and calling for jury nullification of constitutional statutes merely because one is dissatisfied with the operation of that law with regard to themselves is merely self interest looking for another avenue of expression.

    Whatever.. Your own brand of hot air grows irksome.
    Yet they call thenselves conservatives. Go figure.

    The operation and preservation of law as opposed arbitrary action of the individual is a conservative position. Arbitrary application of law and the whims of men is a value of the anarchist, not that of the conservative.

    Your silly effort to brand me as an anarchist is refuted by my every post urging you to honor our constitution..

    Give it up geezer.. Your ploy to baffle em with volumes of BS cites isn't working.. Put a cork in it.

    245 posted on 01/08/2004 7:01:41 PM PST by tpaine (I'm trying to be 'Mr Nice Guy', but FRs flying monkey squad brings out the Rickenbacher in me.)
    [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 244 | View Replies ]

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