On campus, grim statistics for African-American men

St. Petersburg Times ^ | January 5, 2004 | Bill Maxwell

[summer]

RE your post #72 - And I would be lying if I said that I would want to teach in a rough neighborhood again

Thanks for your thoughtful response. And, your very honest statement above. I don't want to teach in that kind of neighborhood again either, and I really wonder how that whole problem will ever be solved. At one time I thought if I made more money I would do it again, but now I realize there is no amount of money that would induce me to return there. I realize now many other teachers feel the same way. So, who teaches those kids? I have no idea. I only know I prefer my life now. I try to give what I can, but some situations are too heartbreaking for me to bear. How some of those kids make it day to day, I have no idea anymore.

[Cincinatus' Wife]

Ain't that the truth.

LOL

[Cincinatus' Wife]

Biggest mistake anyone can make in any place is to stop learning....

Now you're beginning to sound like my mother! Ha!

The point you make in your post, about all being grouped and defined by part, is something that I have always found so frustrating. It's unfair and destructive. If the black voting monolith could be broken up, that notion could be challenged.

[John O]

Not sure when all black people got defined by what happens in the big city...

Because that's all we non-blacks ever get exposed to. I separate the black culture into the inner city and the suburbs (which includes rural and everything else) for just that reason. I know lots of successful blacks. Normal people just like you or I. People who work hard, try to raise good kids, go to church, play softball etc. But watching the music world or the news and all you see is the inner city culture. (Now there may be some black family type programs on now but I don't catch much network TV so I don't know)

Of course, one could argue that Harlem used to be a nice place... East St. Louis could use some work...

And when did these areas start their downhill slide?

Funny thing about poor people... They define themselves more on their condition than the color of their skin... In the farm community, there were people with choices, people without hope, people hungry for a change, people that understood the big picture and knew where they stood, and those blinded by the light buzzing around trying to keep warm...

Again you have to separate the communities. In the inner city the poor define themselves as black first. In the rest of the world they seem to be more color blind. Most of the people I know never refer to themselves as black or mention racism (although in some places it still exists)

The black community outside the city seems to do OK. But the ones in the city culture are being dragged down to their deaths. The whole inner-city black culture is aimed against success. After all, you don't want to act white. Once people get free from the inner city culture then it becomes far easier for them to succeed (My friend from Harlem as an example, While they still lived in the inner city in Milwaukee they were not part of the inner city culture)

[John O]

some would use this article to point out racism, while those some would use it to justify personal prejudice, when the real answer stems from far more complicated societal ills which too few leaders, black or white have the balls to deal with.

This is the core truth. Worth stating again

[fso301]

First of all, not everyone needs to go to college. Nothing at all wrong with being a blue collar worker. The country needs lots of trades people.

A terrible societal dis-service is done by making people think they're nothing if they don't go to college. Only a few university programs give graduates hope of a white collar career. Most do nothing in the way of providing a young person with the tools necessary to support themselves and a family.

Whats wrong with vo-tech? A brick mason with a little ambition can become the owner of a variety of different construction related busineses. Most any tradesperson can progress to being a businessperson without requiring multi-million dollar venture capital funding.

[Cincinatus' Wife]

Good points.

[johnb838]

Government must establish an aspiration quotient which makes sure that no person's aspiration are higher than another person's.

I think this one can be easily managed through the tax code.

[dwd1]

This is the first "simple truth" that I can agree with. I am willing to admit that I am part of the problem because I took the education and ran.... I worked hard and after being in the military, going to school, and then got as far away as I could from the less affluent areas as I could... But I should say that in those communities, there are churches, there are schools, there are even people who pay their bills on time (OK..This is just a rumor!)

And I think that after speaking to my father, I under something else that is true.... Back in the 60's, a lot of black people moved into the city looking for opportunity that wasn't there or they were not prepared for... City life and small community life are different.... And one could argue that in a small town where people give you a hand up is a lot different from getting a handout in the city... Same goal but different results...

[dwd1]

That is going to take some work...

[dwd1]

Ask a good question...You will always get an honest answer from me... Just wish I had a better answer.... You must be a teacher... You ask really hard questions.... :-)

[John O]

And one could argue that in a small town where people give you a hand up is a lot different from getting a handout in the city... Same goal but different results...

And this is where my objections to the welfare programs, and my blaming them for a lot of the black family's demise comes from.

God bless you dwd1. It's been a good discussion

[gipper81]

MANY students should never been enrolled in college, black, white or whatever.

Imagine what would happen at some universities if you saw a 5-10% drop in student enrollment.

[cynicom]

Yes, some professors might have to teach over four hours a week.

[gipper81]

Thanks for your thoughtful response. And, your very honest statement above. I don't want to teach in that kind of neighborhood again either, and I really wonder how that whole problem will ever be solved. At one time I thought if I made more money I would do it again, but now I realize there is no amount of money that would induce me to return there. I realize now many other teachers feel the same way. So, who teaches those kids? I have no idea. I only know I prefer my life now. I try to give what I can, but some situations are too heartbreaking for me to bear. How some of those kids make it day to day, I have no idea anymore.

Correct. The amount of children that are being 'wherehoused' in school in this country, instead of taught, is simply amazing. Mostly courtesy of the NEA, your federal government, political correctness, fairness ... and the other usual reasons and the other usual suspects.

[dwd1]

Age old problem.... Lower standards or uplift the applicants...

I will say this much... I think appreciation for education is a value that needs to be glorified to a higher level and appreciated in all communities... There are not enough people that have a tradition of education.... I think part of that has to do with the way things were.... Example... Kennedy's have been going to Harvard, Yale, and Brown for quite sometime.... Except for the black colleges, we all know that it was not that long ago that many institutions of higher learning "discouraged" black students..... Funny to me how Bakke got so upset about the way he was denied an opportunity but I think there were also a few black people that faced exactly what he faced. Many did learn how it felt to be on the receiving end of institutional racism and I think it has helped to a certain degree..

On admission standards, there are always community colleges and other ways of raising one self up...

What needs to be overcome in the black community is the cynicism that comes from believing that if one jumps through all the hoops to get access to an opportunity, the opportunity will be there for the most qualified person... (Who moved my cheese?)... What we do not always have to share with our young people is the doors that are opened because one has the education.... What we have to often are the stories about what happens when someone does not...

Benjamin Davis, Jr's story about how he was silenced for four years, Chappie James, Charles Drew, Clarence Thomas, etc...good and inspiring stories... You look at someone like Tony Dungy who is a pro football coach and see his college professor father and you realize that the stories are out there...

I look at my own father who did not get much in the way of formal education (he is however, a distinguished graduate from the school of hard knocks) and I realize that he wanted to go to school but faced difficult choices 50-60 years ago... Sometimes, you can learn to appreciate education because you see what you want and sometimes you can learn to appreciate and therefore, aggressively pursue education because of what you don't want...