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Appeals Court Orders Jose Padilla released in 30 Days!
FOXCNN

Posted on 12/18/2003 8:10:02 AM PST by Dog

Breaking...


TOPICS: Breaking News
KEYWORDS: abdullahalmuhajir; enemycombatant; josepadilla
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To: Protagoras
yes, and there is a reason he was being treated differently. he wasn't just some punk from Marin county who thought it would be cool to be a jihadist.

What's your case against Padilla? What are you going to say in court to convict him? Maybe he was just vacationing in Pakistan. Maybe he has a scientific interest in radiological material, maybe he wants to be an XRAY technician. Without being able to produce witnesses, and the only evidence coming from intel sources that cannot be comprimised or subject to cross examination, I do not see how he can be put on trial for anything.
201 posted on 12/18/2003 11:24:55 AM PST by oceanview
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To: oceanview
Our justice system was not designed to prosecute conspirators like this, its mostly designed to punish people AFTER the crime has been committed, which doesn't do a whole hell of alot to protect us against someone plotting to detonate a dirty bomb.

Which can be addressed if the people feel that way. Constitutionally.

Sorry if the system isn't set up as you would like, call your representative or senator. Start a constitutional admendment drive if you like, but it is the way it is.

On the question of whether any criminal can call as witnesses people who are alleged to be involved but whom cannot be found and whether that would necessitate a finding of not guilty; I find that question to be inane. Call a lawyer for the technical answer.

202 posted on 12/18/2003 11:25:21 AM PST by Protagoras (Hating Democrats doesn't make you a conservative.)
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To: Dog
Pedilla had spent his life chasing respect but rarely earning it—marking a dreary passage from a Chicago gang to juvenile detention to grownup prison to a Florida fast-food job and, finally, to a new life as a Muslim in the Middle East.

There he was, in Pakistan just six months after the Sept. 11 attacks, presenting an ominous proposal to Abu Zubaydah, Osama bin Laden's operations chief.

Senior U.S. officials stated that Padilla, conducting research on the Internet, had come across instructions for building a nuclear bomb—"an H-bomb," as a top official described it.

Padilla took them to Abu Zubaydah and other al-Qaeda planners and said he wanted to detonate such a weapon in the U.S. "He was trying to build something that would attain a nuclear yield," says a senior Bush Administration official monitoring Padilla's case.

In response, Abu Zubaydah cautioned his eager job applicant to think smaller—to get training and attack America with a "dirty bomb."

"They sent him to the U.S. to see what he could do—plan and execute," the official says. What he did was get arrested as soon as he stepped off the plane on May 8, having come full circle, back to Chicago, the site of his first encounters with the law.

In his early teens, Padilla joined the Latin Disciples, a mostly Puerto Rican gang. When he was 14, Padilla and several friends assaulted and robbed three men. When one victim gave chase, one of the other boys stabbed him in the stomach, according to court records. Padilla helped the boy throw the man to the ground and then kicked him in the head. The pair took cash from the victim's pockets and left him in an alley, where he died. Padilla was convicted of aggravated battery and armed robbery and went to juvenile detention until he was 18.


At a Taco Bell in Davie, Fla., Padilla found jobs with and a mentor in the restaurant's manager, Mohammad Javed, a Pakistani immigrant. "They were poor but trying to make something of their lives—buy a car, establish a good credit rating, things like that," Javed says.

Javed, a Muslim who now runs an Islamic elementary school in Broward County, insists he did not proselytize to his young employees. Padilla, began asking him how to convert.

Padilla began a 10-year odyssey, moving ever closer to radical elements within Islam. In South Florida, as many as 60,000 Muslims attend two dozen mosques and religious sites, spanning the spectrum of ideology. A subculture of extremism has taken hold in certain pockets.

"Hamas and Hizballah have a wide network here," says a prominent Islamic community leader. "These are people who are convinced that the West is evil and America is 'Darul Harb,'" the Place of War. The community leader, who requested anonymity, describes a growing radicalized cadre of mostly Middle Eastern men who aggressively recruit young Muslims. These men often drive BMWs and Mercedes and lure followers with money, he says.

In 1994 Padilla converted formally to Islam at al-Iman mosque in Sunrise. The imam at the mosque at that time, who would have overseen Padilla's conversion, was Raed Awad—the former Florida fund raiser for the Holy Land Foundation, a Muslim charity that the Bush Administration has linked to Hamas. In December the Texas-based offices of the foundation were raided and shuttered by the Treasury Department. Attempts to reach Awad, who has since left the mosque, were unsuccessful. Awad has denied any link between the charity and Hamas. Law-enforcement sources say the FBI is interested in learning more about the role he played in Padilla's conversion.

Around the time of his conversion, Padilla legally changed his name to Ibrahim. In 1996 he married Stultz, who had also converted. He started wearing a red-and-white kaffiyeh, or headdress, and expensive watches and clothes, although he was unemployed for much of the time. In 1998 Padilla suddenly left his wife and moved to Egypt, telling acquaintances at al-Iman mosque that he was going to learn Arabic.

Padilla has since told investigators that his travels were sponsored by "friends" interested in his education. Using the name Abdullah al-Muhajir, he moved to a suburb of Cairo. But he was frustrated, officials say, by the secular, state-controlled brand of Islam taught in mainstream schools. He plunged into the extremist underground, where he was advised to study in Pakistan and Afghanistan. He moved to Pakistan, where, like many militants, he married the widow of a jihadist. Last year Padilla met with Abu Zubaydah for the first time, U.S. officials say. In spring of this year, he met with Abu Zubaydah again—and allegedly made his nuclear-bomb pitch.

In March Abu Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan. A month later, he hinted to his FBI and CIA interrogators that he had talked to people who wanted to put together a dirty bomb, says a U.S. official. He provided no details, but agents started comparing intelligence as well as material from safe houses they had raided. Out popped Padilla's name, the official says. They then matched the name to a passport photo of Padilla and checked the identification with Abu Zubaydah, who confirmed it. The chase was on.

The CIA caught up with Padilla in Cairo in early May, where officers learned he was planning to fly to the U.S. When he boarded his connection in Zurich, bound for Chicago, he was trailed by FBI agents. FBI officials, including Director Robert Mueller, had debated whether to continue following Padilla in hopes of turning up accomplices. But they could not risk losing him, sources tell Time, as they had a couple of times during his far-flung journey, so they took the more cautious approach. After Padilla deplaned in Chicago, customs officers pulled him aside not far from the baggage carousel. In a secondary screening room, FBI agents identified themselves and took Padilla into custody. He appeared neither surprised nor angry, says a federal agent. During the next month, the feds tried and apparently failed to build a case against Padilla that would stand up in court. On Sunday, June 9, the day before Padilla could have been released under laws protecting U.S. citizens from indefinite detention, President Bush approved Padilla's reclassification as an "enemy combatant." He was transferred after midnight to the brig of a South Carolina naval base.

203 posted on 12/18/2003 11:28:10 AM PST by JesseHousman (Execute Mumia Abu-Jamal)
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To: MarkL
But here's a guy who's a US citizen, who was captured on US soil, at an airport...

All the German saboteurs in Quirin were captured on U.S. soil. Two of them claimed to be U.S. citizens. The Supreme Court said it did not matter if they were, so it did not bother to consider whether their claim was correct. Which implies that U.S. citizens captured on U.S. soil can be treated as enemy combatants (at least in circumstances like those of that case.)

204 posted on 12/18/2003 11:30:31 AM PST by aristeides
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To: Protagoras
Heh. Whatever. Look, the fact of the matter is, despite your contentions of malfeasance upon the current administration and the law, the WoT is going on successfully. This is a temporary setback that will not stop Law Enforcement. How sad you're experiencing an apparent priapism because two jackass judges in New York have ruled against the Department of Defense.

I'll be happy to settle with whatever the administration decides to do in this case, because I trust their judgement over yours in this War On Terror.

Tell you what, though: since you're as unbending in your opinion as I am, I'm going to cut off discussion with you on this thread. But since you seem to have a penchant for retort, I'll let you salve your desire to look like a big-shot "thinker". Go ahead and flame me back, and I promise I won't respond. Then you can sit back satisfactorily and pretend like you won the argument. You seem to need that in your life.

G'nite.

205 posted on 12/18/2003 11:31:34 AM PST by Recovering_Democrat (I'm so glad to no longer be associated with the Party of Dependence on Government!)
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To: Protagoras
That is incorrect.

No, it is perfectly correct and telling me I'm incorrect after telling me you didn't know does nothing to give me confidence in your latest declaration.

Not to mention, no one has proved that he is a member of Al Qaeda.

The CIC is satisfied that he is a member of Al Qaeda. Congress authorised the CIC to conduct this war. The judiciary does not have the power to execute wars, that power is granted to the executive. Under your system the judicary could order the CIC not to bomb Tikrit absent a court order and a document to show cause.

If otherwise, you or I can be called that also and denied our rights without due process. It would be a call for the government with no recourse. No trial, no attorney, no charges. Just, "I say he's the enemy so he is".

Everything you state here is without factual basis. Only Hamdi and Padilla are being held as enemy combatants, the other 280 million of us are still going about our business. Padilla is getting his judical review, after all we are debating here the opinion of the Second Circuit. He has an attorney, I just saw her on TV. And as for the charges they will be forthcoming, good things come to those who wait.

206 posted on 12/18/2003 11:32:07 AM PST by jwalsh07
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To: Dog
Release John Hinkley, then release Jose Padilla [Abdullah al-Muhajir], then all the prisoners at Gitmo and lastly Saddam Hussein himself.

Think that will satisfy these liberal Federal Court Justices?

207 posted on 12/18/2003 11:33:33 AM PST by KriegerGeist ("The weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty though God for pulling down of strongholds")
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To: Protagoras
who says Zubayda cannot be found? We know exactly where he is.
208 posted on 12/18/2003 11:34:16 AM PST by oceanview
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To: NonValueAdded
The dissent is excellent:
"Sadly, the majority’s resolution of this matter fails to address the real weakness of the government’s appeal. Padilla presses to have his day in court to rebut the government’s factual assertions that he falls within the authority of the Joint Resolution. The government contends that Mr. Padilla can be held incommunicado for 18 months with no serious opportunity to put the government to its proof by an appropriate standard. The government fears that to do otherwise would compromise its ability both to gather important information from Mr. Padilla and to prevent him from communicating with other al Qaeda operatives in the United States.
While those concerns may be valid, they cannot withstand the force of another clause of the Constitution on which all three of us could surely agree. No one has suspended the Great Writ. See U.S. CONST. art. I, § 9, cl. 2. Padilla’s right to pursue a remedy through the writ would be meaningless if he had to do so alone.
I therefore would extend to him the right to counsel as Chief Judge Mukasey did. See Padilla, 233 F. Supp. 2d at 599-609. At the hearing, Padilla, assisted by counsel, would be able to contest whether he is actually an enemy combatant thereby falling within the President’s constitutional and statutory authority."

The two democrat living constitutionalist judges are in fantasyland, totally missing the point.

209 posted on 12/18/2003 11:38:02 AM PST by mrsmith
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To: jwalsh07
I agree with everything you say, except I do not see what charges can be brought against him. How do you charge him with conspriring with Zubayda, when you know that you cannot produce Zubayda to provide that evidence against him?
210 posted on 12/18/2003 11:38:50 AM PST by oceanview
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To: oceanview
I agree with you. Underour criminal system, treating Padilla as a criminal and applying the Bill of Rights would have required releasing him.
211 posted on 12/18/2003 11:40:59 AM PST by jwalsh07
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To: All
This just up on the How Appealing blog:

EVEN MORE ENEMY COMBATANT BREAKING NEWS -- Divided three-judge Ninth Circuit panel holds that federal district courts have jurisdiction to consider habeas petitions of uncharged foreign detainees held at Guantanamo Naval Base: You can access the ruling, issued just moments ago, at this link. Circuit Judge Stephen Reinhardt wrote the majority opinion, in which Senior District Judge Milton I. Shadur, sitting by designation from the U.S. District Court for the Northern District of Illinois, joined. Circuit Judge Susan P. Graber dissented. In an unpublished order issued today, the panel has stayed the issuance of its mandate pending the U.S. Supreme Court's resolution of a case presenting this very same issue.

posted at 1:30 PM by Howard Bashman

(I've omitted the links, which you can get by going to the How Appealing site.)

212 posted on 12/18/2003 11:41:27 AM PST by aristeides
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To: Protagoras
My point was that it is ironic that the scum bag lefties are the ones defending the constitution in thic case, for whatever reason.

Doesn't that give you pause? That you perceive the clintonites as "defending the Constitution"?

Perhaps that is reason to reconsider your stance...

213 posted on 12/18/2003 11:41:31 AM PST by cyncooper ("The evil is in plain sight")
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To: All
Link to majority opinion (in 2nd Circuit Padilla case).
214 posted on 12/18/2003 11:44:07 AM PST by aristeides
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To: Geist Krieger
Release John Hinkley, then release Jose Padilla [Abdullah al-Muhajir], then all the prisoners at Gitmo and lastly Saddam Hussein himself.

Think that will satisfy these liberal Federal Court Justices?

No. They would not be satisfied unless they achieved the impeachment of President Bush and perhaps incarceration of some of his administration.

215 posted on 12/18/2003 11:44:33 AM PST by cyncooper ("The evil is in plain sight")
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To: mrsmith
Thank you. I was going to go looking for the dissent.

Say, aren't you the Freeper who exposed the "Sailor Mongering" scam that was being floated around?
216 posted on 12/18/2003 11:45:42 AM PST by cyncooper ("The evil is in plain sight")
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To: jwalsh07
FNC is now reporting that the terrorist held at Gitmo should be given the same rights as in America per the CT Fed Court
217 posted on 12/18/2003 11:46:06 AM PST by Mo1 (House Work, If you do it right , will kill you!)
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To: Dog
Another appeals court just ruled that the GITMO enemy combatants MUST receive LEGAL rights ie......they MUST get lawyers. 911 has been TOTALLY FORGOTTEN!!
218 posted on 12/18/2003 11:46:07 AM PST by PISANO (God Bless our Troops........They will not TIRE - They will not FALTER - They will not FAIL!!!!!)
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To: All
Link to dissenting opinion.
219 posted on 12/18/2003 11:46:27 AM PST by aristeides
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To: Destructor
Let me remind you that a "nuke" and a dirty bomb are about as similar as a MOAB and a cherry bomb.
220 posted on 12/18/2003 11:49:22 AM PST by lugsoul (And I threw down my enemy and smote his ruin on the mountainside.)
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